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Has any other Presidential nominee


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#16    BlindMessiah

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Posted 17 October 2008 - 11:27 PM

284dan on Oct 18 2008, 12:20 AM, said:

I expect an honest campaign.

lol

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There would no need to "downplay" it if McCain was not falsely exaggerating it. The relationship is, IMO, a mute point. It should not have been brought up.

I'm pretty sure Clinton was the first one to bring it up but I may be wrong. And please, when you run for president, you had better expect every single thing you ever did or didn't do to be scrutinized down to the last detail. We're putting our lives in their hands for god's sake.

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You said yourself Ayers never killed anyone. Wasnt he also acquitted of these acts? I read that somewhere and will try to find the link.

He did however injure several people in the bombing. He was acquitted on a technicality. He remains guilty of doing it as he himself admits.


#17    The Silver Thong

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Posted 17 October 2008 - 11:28 PM

284dan on Oct 17 2008, 05:20 PM, said:

I expect an honest campaign. There would no need to "downplay" it if McCain was not falsely exaggerating it. The relationship is, IMO, a mute point. It should not have been brought up. It is an obvious sign of desperation by McCain. You said yourself Ayers never killed anyone. Wasnt he also acquitted of these acts? I read that somewhere and will try to find the link.


An honorable presidential race hmmm sounds interesting, I would like to see one as well.   As far as accusations go, once they are said and the general public pic up on these accusations they roll with as if it's truth, caring little as to it's validity. Once the cat is out of the bag ( even if the cat is really not a cat) the damage has been done. Smear is all most politicians have as a weapon.


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#18    AlexG

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Posted 17 October 2008 - 11:31 PM

284dan on Oct 17 2008, 07:20 PM, said:

I expect an honest campaign.


Wouldn't it be pretty.

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#19    questionmark

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Posted 17 October 2008 - 11:32 PM

The Silver Thong on Oct 18 2008, 02:28 AM, said:

An honorable presidential race hmmm sounds interesting, I would like to see one as well.   As far as accusations go, once they are said and the general public pic up on these accusations they roll with as if it's truth, caring little as to it's validity. Once the cat is out of the bag ( even if the cat is really not a cat) the damage has been done. Smear is all most politicians have as a weapon.


The last person I remember being honest in politics was Jimmy Carter...people did not like that either.... (besides the fact that he was not the best politician either).

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#20    freeman88

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 05:03 AM

Rastaman on Oct 17 2008, 11:19 AM, said:

I was just watching the news and apparently theres another ad paid for by John Mccain linking Obama to Bill Ayers, and last week Palin said he launched his career in Ayers' "basement". Is Obama the only nominee to be accused of such things? If so then America is really ****** up.



I just watched the debate and Obama makes it very clear about this standing with Bill Ayer. They were chosen to be on a committee education board or something about 10 years ago, that is there only contact ever. Obama does not work with this man and his opinion has absolutely nothing to do with the Obama campaign.



#21    AROCES

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 07:05 AM

freeman88 on Oct 17 2008, 08:52 PM, said:

He was passionate about his cause like most people. The weathermen from what i understand worked beside the black panthers which are also known to be a "terrorist" group. These were intelligent people that wanted to fix poverty,police brutality,racism,education,and to help the oppressed get on there feet . They were not terrorists they were just radical activists that were passionate about there cause and wanted change.

Terrorist claim as well they are just fighting for a cause.
I think what you mean is that they are not Pirates or extortionist.

Edited by AROCES, 18 October 2008 - 07:13 AM.


#22    HKCavalier

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 08:03 AM

The hideous thing about this accusation is that saying Obama "pals around with terrorists" in the current political context, is as much as saying he is an enemy combatant and, therefore, an appropriate object of our hatred and even violence.  It's a massive distortion and ominously incendiary.  Such viciousness has no place in a Presidential campaign.

If Ayers were REALLY a terrorist, then why the hell is he still at large?  This is such b.s.  

It was a different world in the 60's.  Our country was coming apart at the seams and some people were trying to start a revolution, not because they hated America, but because they thought America had been hijacked by evil men.  To call Ayers a "terrorist" in the current sense of that word, is completely irresponsible and could easily incite people to violence against a decent man running for President.  You folks who want to paint Obama as a "friend of terrorists" should be ashamed of yourselves and I hope to God no one takes this trumped-up political canard seriously enough to do Barrack Obama harm.




#23    Fluffybunny

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 03:08 PM

HKCavalier on Oct 18 2008, 03:03 AM, said:

You folks who want to paint Obama as a "friend of terrorists" should be ashamed of yourselves and I hope to God no one takes this trumped-up political canard seriously enough to do Barrack Obama harm.

Its the last desperate acts of people who for whatever reason choose not to focus on policy, but on character assassination. I was a huge supporter of Mccain in 2000, and felt that what bush did to him(the sleaze/negative ads) in order to win was just disgusting and really set the tone for his presidency, and it did hold true as to his level of honor.

For mccain to stoop to bring on some of the same people, and use the exact same vile tactics has destroyed the integrity he once had. The tactics he has used have backfired on him time and time again and he knows that...there will always be people that will follow the leader and parrot what the presidential candidates say; it happens on both sides of the coin and we see that here. The rhetoric is pretty vile here, and some people fall for it hook line and sinker. Most people dont bother to check the details of anything on the other candidate and trust what their candidate says...

...being that I dont trust either obama or mccain I check them both, and mccain has had a record of stretching the truth far and above that anything I have ever seen...more than bush, more than clinton...it is really sad to see from a guy I once admired so much. He has sold his soul to the devil in order to get elected, and I think that there may be a chance that it may not happen for him after all of his efforts.

The saddest part of this is that if the mccain of 2000 were still around, the guy with a shred of integrity, if he were to have stayed away from the bush people and tactics, I think he would have had a much better chance...


Too many people on both sides of the spectrum have fallen into this mentality that a full one half of the country are the enemy for having different beliefs...in a country based on freedom of expression. It is this infighting that allows the focus to be taken away from "we the people" being able to watch, and have control over government corruption and ineptitude that is running rampant in our leadership.

People should be working towards fixing problems, not creating them.

#24    Guardsman Bass

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 03:26 PM

I don't mind McCain bringing this up; American elections have been a dirty, nasty, accusatory affair since the earliest elections under the Constitution (look at what John Adams's supporters and Thomas Jefferson's supporters called the other guy). But if McCain is going to bring this up, then Obama (or the Democrats) ought to bring up G. Gordon Liddy - who actually served time for his role in the Watergate burglary, told his listeners to kill federal agents coming after them in the wake of the Waco catastrophe on his radio show, and who donated money for McCain and held a fundraiser for him. Not to mention that he's been a contributor to Fox News, and has a syndicated radio show.

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#25    HKCavalier

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 03:46 PM

Fluffybunny on Oct 18 2008, 08:08 AM, said:

Its the last desperate acts of people who for whatever reason choose not to focus on policy, but on character assassination.

It's one thing to say a man slept with half a dozen women, had a child out of wedlock, or that he lied about his heroics in the military, these things are merely personal--weaknesses of character, foibles--it's quite another thing to say that a Presidential candidate is engaged in treason, to attempt without a shred of evidence to connect him in our minds to the perpetrators of 9/11 and to Saddam Hussein.  And it is appallingly irresponsible of McCain/Palin to continue to incite their crowds to such groundless hate.  This country has far too rich a history of political assassination for this kind of thing to be remotely conscionable.

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The saddest part of this is that if the mccain of 2000 were still around, the guy with a shred of integrity, if he were to have stayed away from the bush people and tactics, I think he would have had a much better chance...

Well, yes, but then he'd have lost the support of the GOP base.  The one positive thing about all this is that negative campaigning is failing to win anyone a damn thing in this election.  Hillary and Bill could very well be heading back to the White House right now if they hadn't behaved so deplorably during the primaries.  I think the 24 hour news channels and YouTube have changed the level to which out and out lies can succeed in national politics.  That's a "game changer" if ever there was one, and Barrack Obama is the only candidate (well, him and to a lesser extent, Dr. Paul, I'd say) to really understand that.




#26    Incorrigible1

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 04:58 PM

Associations matter. BTW, the Messiah is wearing no clothing.

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#27    AROCES

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 05:15 PM

Incorrigible1 on Oct 18 2008, 05:58 PM, said:

Associations matter. BTW, the Messiah is wearing no clothing.

You are who your friends are......


#28    Splodgenessabounds

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 05:21 PM

AROCES on Oct 18 2008, 06:15 PM, said:

You are who your friends are......


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Edited by Splodgenessabounds, 18 October 2008 - 05:21 PM.

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#29    Tiggs

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 05:25 PM

Incorrigible1 on Oct 18 2008, 05:58 PM, said:

Associations matter. BTW, the Messiah is wearing no clothing.

Only for campaigns that don't have anything except smear by association.

Karl Rove is naked? Scary.


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#30    danielost

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Posted 18 October 2008 - 06:23 PM

The Silver Thong on Oct 17 2008, 01:44 PM, said:

He wasn't president but helped create one. George Bush SR  dad and George W Bush's grandfather Prescot Bush had ties with Nazi Germany.... Does that count?

Didn't know that they were terriosts.

freeman88 on Oct 17 2008, 01:52 PM, said:

From what i understand Obama does have ties with this man. He is not a terrorist he is a professor and a former anti-war activist that made some bad decisions 35-45 years ago. If you want to look for real terrorist ties look at the Bush family hmm.gif they aid and do bussiness with the binladen family

including bombing the pentigon.

The family binladen has disowned the son.

284dan on Oct 17 2008, 06:20 PM, said:

I expect an honest campaign. There would no need to "downplay" it if McCain was not falsely exaggerating it. The relationship is, IMO, a mute point. It should not have been brought up. It is an obvious sign of desperation by McCain. You said yourself Ayers never killed anyone. Wasnt he also acquitted of these acts? I read that somewhere and will try to find the link.

ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.  Oh I'm sorry you're serious.

BlindMessiah on Oct 17 2008, 05:50 PM, said:

I have a feeling that eventually public perception of terrorist and freedom fighter will be blurred. The problem with calling him a terrorist, is, it associates the organization with Islamic terrorism and they are nothing alike. 9/11 resulted in the deaths of 3000+. Bill Ayers bombing resulted in zero deaths. Nations everywhere have a tendency of demonizing any and all who oppose them. Those who oppose the Patriot Act for example. Whether you believe we need the Patriot Act or not, there is no denying that is titled as such to gain support. If one opposes it they are simply unpatriotic. Labels are a powerful tool in controlling public opinion.

I oppose the patriot act.

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