[Ufo Believer]

From - CNN

A third beluga whale belonging to the world's largest aquarium has died, the Georgia Aquarium announced late Monday.

The exact cause of Nico's sudden death on Saturday is inconclusive from the initial necropsy or animal autopsy. The Georgia Aquarium hopes to find out more information in the months ahead from a more detailed necropsy.

"As we work with and care for the many animals at the Georgia Aquarium, we become attached emotionally," said Dr. Gregory D. Bossart, chief veterinary officer at the aquarium. "The loss is not unlike that of faithful dog or special horse that has been a part your life for years."

Nico died at Sea World in San Antonio, where he and two other beluga whales had been moved temporarily while the Georgia Aquarium is undergoing renovation. Nico was scheduled to return home to Atlanta next month with companions Maris and Natasha.

More here: http://edition.cnn.c...hale/index.html

[Mattshark]

This is why many places are making cetacean captivity illegal, because they are completely unsuitable.

[Cetacea]

"The exact cause of Nico's sudden death is inconclusive."
Unknown cause of death in a captive cetacean?! Never! With all the expert vet care, what could possibly have been overlooked?
Apart from the fact that belugas have a radically shortened lifespan in captivity and cetaceans in general fare poorly in captivity, but I'm sure the artificial and stressful conditions he was kept under have no bearing on his death... Never mind the fact that transporting cetaceans results in a sixfold chance of death
Georgia are not exactly known for their great animal care, just look at what they did to their whale sharks.

This post has been edited by Cetacea: 03 November 2009 - 01:10 PM

[Neognosis]

don't dolphins and killer whales live longer in captivity?

Couldn't it be something as elementary as elevated nitrite levels in their water? Or a bacteria that the previous inhabitants had an immunity to, but new animals do not?

I've never kept a whale, obviously, but with the fish I've kept, these are the things that typically kill them when you move them to new or different water.

[Mattshark]

Neognosis, on 03 November 2009 - 01:12 PM, said:

don't dolphins and killer whales live longer in captivity?

Couldn't it be something as elementary as elevated nitrite levels in their water? Or a bacteria that the previous inhabitants had an immunity to, but new animals do not?

I've never kept a whale, obviously, but with the fish I've kept, these are the things that typically kill them when you move them to new or different water.

No orca's average under half their wild life span in captivity.

Can't really compare cetaceans to fish!

[Cetacea]

Neognosis, on 03 November 2009 - 01:12 PM, said:

don't dolphins and killer whales live longer in captivity?

Couldn't it be something as elementary as elevated nitrite levels in their water? Or a bacteria that the previous inhabitants had an immunity to, but new animals do not?

I've never kept a whale, obviously, but with the fish I've kept, these are the things that typically kill them when you move them to new or different water.

Quite the contrary. Bottlenose dolphins are barely approaching a 'normal' lifespan in captivity whereas belugas and orcas (which are the biggest species of dolphins) have massively shortened lifespans. Female orcas live an average of about 40-50 years in the wild, males 30, the average even goes up again once they are past the first 20 years, 60-70 and 50 respectively I believe, there have been numerous cases of orcas living well into their 90s as well. Yet all orcas that have died in captivity in the last 10 years have been under the age of 25 and there are only two females over the age of 40 in captivity, Corky and Lolita which are both perceived as 'old and ill' by their respective aquariums and there is good reason most aquariums give the maximum age at about 30, SeaWorld only changed their information site after an older version of 'The Case against Marine Mammals in Captivity' quoted their website giving false information.
There are a lot of issues with cetacean captivity but it does not help that they are confining wide ranging animals in a tiny paddling pool with barely any enrichment, in unsuitable social groups and artificial seawater and constant human interaction whether they like it or not.

[Bill Hill]

While it's not ideal keeping marine live in captivity, they are well cared for, loved and the main advantage is in educating the public. Education is the key.
Otherwise the only people who are going to see whales/ dolphins close up are rich elitists.
"Jah just been swimming with the dolphins Soo coOl like, I'm sending my thesis next tuesday, oh damn the flight and my boat has really screwed up my carbon footprint for the year... oh"

[Mattshark]

Bill Hill, on 03 November 2009 - 02:09 PM, said:

While it's not ideal keeping marine live in captivity, they are well cared for, loved and the main advantage is in educating the public. Education is the key.
Otherwise the only people who are going to see whales/ dolphins close up are rich elitists.
"Jah just been swimming with the dolphins Soo coOl like, I'm sending my thesis next tuesday, oh damn the flight and my boat has really screwed up my carbon footprint for the year... oh"

Actually no they are not well cared for and they attack far more people in captivity than they do in the wild. What educating them on cruelty to animals? They do nothing for educating the public, that is why it is becoming increasingly banned worldwide.

Oh you know you could drive (get a train, bus, walk) to most coasts in most countries and see them for either very little or free.

But don't let your complete ignorance get in the way.

This post has been edited by Mattshark: 03 November 2009 - 06:19 PM

[Cetacea]

Bill Hill, on 03 November 2009 - 02:09 PM, said:

While it's not ideal keeping marine live in captivity, they are well cared for, loved and the main advantage is in educating the public. Education is the key.
Otherwise the only people who are going to see whales/ dolphins close up are rich elitists.
"Jah just been swimming with the dolphins Soo coOl like, I'm sending my thesis next tuesday, oh damn the flight and my boat has really screwed up my carbon footprint for the year... oh"

So well cared for they die at half their natural lifespan.... I'm sure being 'loved' by their trainers makes them feel so much better when they are ramming their heads against the aquarium walls or constantly regurgitating and re-eating their own vomit, wearing down their teeth while gnawing on the artificial rocks out of boredom and frustration. I guess it's that special bond between trainer and dolphin that causes the frequent attacks on people in captivity. I mean you can really feel the love when you look at the few animals that have been released that completely ignore or even get aggressive towards their trainers once the food connection is gone. Yes, all this love must really makes up for the poor welfare, premature separation between mother and calves, unsuitable pod constellation, stress, boredom, disease and early deaths they experience. I know if I was kept in a broom cubboard all my life with a beach ball doing demeaning tricks to earn my food I would feel SO much better if someone told me they really love me ever so much, it would make up for everything!
What education? So it's educational to provide false facts to the public? SeaWorld's educational standard has been compared to the level of a fairly good third grade book and I think that's being generous! Plenty of countries do not keep cetaceans in captivity, as for example the UK, and there is still plenty of support for cetacean conservation. No place in the world keeps humpbacks in captivity and still they are popular and held in high esteem by the public around the world. The minimal amount of education focussing on already very well known species is by far outweighed by the disadvantages.
Only rich elitists get to see dolphins otherwise, eh? you do realise that most whale watch tour operators are by far cheaper than a SeaWorld day pass, right? And if it's allegedly all about getting people educated, you are getting by far a better deal there as you actually get to see animals behaving naturally rather than jumping through hoops, all documented by an educated naturalist, not a media student in a wet suit who thinks making orcas touch tongues and stand on their backs is an adequate representation of their true nature.

[stevewinn]

how long did these whales live in the wild before being caught and put in the aquarium?.

[Cetacea]

stevewinn, on 03 November 2009 - 06:36 PM, said:

how long did these whales live in the wild before being caught and put in the aquarium?.

I am unsure to be honest, I know Niko was caught in Russia around 1996, they usually get caught young because young animals are easier to train. Admittedly that makes him extremely unsuitable to be released into the wild but that changes very little about the conditions at Georgia Aquarium.

[stevewinn]

Cetacea, on 03 November 2009 - 06:57 PM, said:

I am unsure to be honest, I know Niko was caught in Russia around 1996, they usually get caught young because young animals are easier to train. Admittedly that makes him extremely unsuitable to be released into the wild but that changes very little about the conditions at Georgia Aquarium.

my feelings are whales etc. shouldn't be in captivity. but seeing how these whales are captive and with no chance of ever being returned to the wild, the best they can hope for is a Aquarium that has plenty of space. and i couldn't think of a more suitable place than the worlds largest Aquarium.

[Cetacea]

stevewinn, on 03 November 2009 - 08:09 PM, said:

my feelings are whales etc. shouldn't be in captivity. but seeing how these whales are captive and with no chance of ever being returned to the wild, the best they can hope for is a Aquarium that has plenty of space. and i couldn't think of a more suitable place than the worlds largest Aquarium.

Thing is their animal care is appalling, they've already killed all their original whale sharks and they are not merely providing a 'retirement home' to these belugas, they are intent on breeding with them to produce yet more cetaceans in captivity.

[Mattshark]

Cetacea, on 03 November 2009 - 08:42 PM, said:

Thing is their animal care is appalling, they've already killed all their original whale sharks and they are not merely providing a 'retirement home' to these belugas, they are intent on breeding with them to produce yet more cetaceans in captivity.

They also killed all the hammerheads they took from Mote too.

[BlindMessiah]

It should of thought twice before it bombed Hiroshima.