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Hawaii is not legally a state!


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#1    ExpandMyMind

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Posted 18 January 2010 - 05:46 PM

i thought this may be an interesting one for some out there to read. not sure if it has much, or any merit though. the voice of reason will no doubt appear in the thread and explain.

Quote

It is easy to find the courage necessary to support a moral position if that position benefits oneself. True moral courage, however, is proven when one chooses to support that which is morally and ethically right even when such a position is to one's one detriment.

The people of the United States find themselves in such a position right now, forced to choose between a moral and ethical position that carries with it the potential for "inconvenience", or supporting the status quo and having to admit to themselves that they are not the champions of justice they imagine themselves to be. By the end of this article, you will know for yourself which one you are.

Most folks have heard that Hawaii is a state, one of the United States of America. Most people, including those who live in Hawaii, accept that statement as a fact.

But the reality is that in a world in which nations are as bound by the rule of laws as are the citizens of nations (if not more so), the truth is quite different!

http://whatreallyhap...AII/hawaii.html

this was the part that caught my attention.

On November 23, 1993, President Clinton signed United States Public Law 103-150, which not only acknowledged the illegal actions committed by the United States in the overthrow of the legitimate government of Hawaii, but also that the Hawaiian people never surrendered their sovereignty. The latter is the most important part of United States Public Law 103-150 for it makes it quite clear that the Hawaiian people never legally ceased to be a sovereign separate independent nation. There is no argument that can change that fact.

United States Public Law 103-150, despite its polite language, is an official admission that the government of the United States illegally occupies the territory of the Hawaiian people.



#2    danielost

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Posted 18 January 2010 - 06:28 PM

Hawaii would lose the massive and complex bureaucracy that connects Hawaii to the mainland, and Hawaii's citizens would be free of their shares of the $7 trillion dollar federal debt and its ruinous interest, but who would mourn the loss?


this is what this is all about.  sounds to me like the rich in hawaii don't want to play the governments game no more.  ie tax and spend.


as for alaska, it is an illegal state.  at the time that it was made a state it didn't have the minimum number of citizens required by the united states constituiton.


as for the rest, when the king allowed/surrendered to american forces he surrendered unconditionlly at least from what i read.

Edited by danielost, 18 January 2010 - 06:31 PM.

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#3    Corp

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Posted 19 January 2010 - 04:59 PM

From what I remember US businessmen slowly took over the country as settlers began to outnumber the natives. The Queen tried to do something about it so those settlers called on the US to help them. The US military invaded and the settlers used their majority to vote Hawaii into the Union.

Of course we only talked about Hawaii in passing in my one class so I could very well be wrong.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things: the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth a war, is much worse...A man who has nothing which he is willing to fight for, nothing which he cares more about than he does about his personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

#4    Siara

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Posted 19 January 2010 - 05:01 PM

ROTFLMAO

Wow.


#5    THE MATRIX

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Posted 19 January 2010 - 08:47 PM

View Postexpandmymind, on 18 January 2010 - 05:46 PM, said:

i thought this may be an interesting one for some out there to read. not sure if it has much, or any merit though. the voice of reason will no doubt appear in the thread and explain.



http://whatreallyhap...AII/hawaii.html

this was the part that caught my attention.

On November 23, 1993, President Clinton signed United States Public Law 103-150, which not only acknowledged the illegal actions committed by the United States in the overthrow of the legitimate government of Hawaii, but also that the Hawaiian people never surrendered their sovereignty. The latter is the most important part of United States Public Law 103-150 for it makes it quite clear that the Hawaiian people never legally ceased to be a sovereign separate independent nation. There is no argument that can change that fact.

United States Public Law 103-150, despite its polite language, is an official admission that the government of the United States illegally occupies the territory of the Hawaiian people.


See what you've done? Now you going to riled up these Birthers into coming here and bring up the whole dead issue of Obamas BC again.


#6    flyingswan

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Posted 20 January 2010 - 11:01 AM

Interesting.

Have any similar apologies been issued to the indigenous inhabitants of other US states?

"Man prefers to believe what he prefers to be true" - Francis Bacon (1561-1626)
In which case it is fortunate that:
"Science is the best defense against believing what we want to" - Ian Stewart (1945- )

#7    ExpandMyMind

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Posted 20 January 2010 - 03:34 PM

View Postwolfram&hart12345, on 19 January 2010 - 08:47 PM, said:

See what you've done? Now you going to riled up these Birthers into coming here and bring up the whole dead issue of Obamas BC again.

that wasn't my intention and if any do bring up the eligibility in this thread then i'll ask a mod to keep 'em in line. :)

i just find it interesting. i knew, and indeed still do know, very little about hawaii and to find out that, (possibly) technically, that the US could be considered to be illegaly occupying this state, caught my attention enough to post about it.

regardless of the legalities, something that is clear is that what i have learned about the US' seizure of this state is at the very least shocking.

Edited by expandmymind, 20 January 2010 - 03:35 PM.


#8    MARAB0D

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Posted 22 January 2010 - 02:13 AM

View Postexpandmymind, on 20 January 2010 - 03:34 PM, said:

that wasn't my intention and if any do bring up the eligibility in this thread then i'll ask a mod to keep 'em in line. :)

i just find it interesting. i knew, and indeed still do know, very little about hawaii and to find out that, (possibly) technically, that the US could be considered to be illegaly occupying this state, caught my attention enough to post about it.

regardless of the legalities, something that is clear is that what i have learned about the US' seizure of this state is at the very least shocking.

To me it seems Corp is right and this is a confusion between the Hawaiians and Hawaii as a territory. Historically most of the areas with indigenous population are annexed without asking for permission, and most of the modern countries are located on such lands. Indigenous population usually does not have a legal system, developed enough for them to claim land property and express their political will, this civilizational difference is often abused by more "civilized" nations. Moreover, this abuse legally does not contradict to the "laws" of the indigenous people, as technically they are not losing their lands physically, and actually do not have any laws in our sense. Primitive tribes do not know the land ownership and do not know the sales of the land, they simply live on this land, for many of them it is like air or water cannot belong to anyone.


#9    icet925

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 12:55 AM

I believe Guam is also part of the US too.
Correct me if i'm wrong.


#10    Axon555

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 01:14 PM

I learned about this first in class, most "history" teachers dont tell you the truth about the gov./america but mine dose!! and i am one of the people that knows the Gov. is evil, and tecnicaly since Hawaii isnt legaly a state Obama shouldent Legaly be a President!


#11    preacherman76

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 04:55 PM

View PostTHE MATRIX, on 19 January 2010 - 08:47 PM, said:

See what you've done? Now you going to riled up these Birthers into coming here and bring up the whole dead issue of Obamas BC again.

But if what he is saying is true, then he certainly should be removed. No? :ph34r:

Some things are true, even if you dont believe them.

#12    pallidin

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 07:38 PM

Oh, so the fact that Europeans overthrew native Americans, means that America actually belongs only to the natives?

Or that Hawaii only belongs to it's natives?

BS.

That argument could be suggested for nearly EVERY CURRENT COUNTRY ON THE PLANET.

Yeah, let's just go back to the cavemen days before territory was acquired by occupation, treaty or force.
In doing so, that wipes-out 99% of all current country territorial clams.

This premise is just silly, IMHO.

EVERYONE  BACK TO AFRICA.  Blah...

Edited by pallidin, 20 May 2013 - 07:54 PM.


#13    Otto von Pickelhaube

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 07:53 PM

heavens, just when you thought we'd seen the last of all the Birther nonsense, someone goes and digs up a three year old thread ... :rolleyes:

Edited by Colonel Rhuairidh, 20 May 2013 - 07:53 PM.

If, as it seems, we are in the process of becoming a totalitarian society in which the state apparatus is all-powerful, the ethics most important for the survival of the true, free, human individual would be: cheat, lie, evade, fake it, be elsewhere, forge documents, build improved electronic gadgets in your garage that’ll outwit the gadgets used by the authorities.

- Philip K. Dick.


#14    Mr.United_Nations

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Posted 20 May 2013 - 10:09 PM

Alaska

View PostAxon555, on 20 May 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

I learned about this first in class, most "history" teachers dont tell you the truth about the gov./america but mine dose!! and i am one of the people that knows the Gov. is evil, and tecnicaly since Hawaii isnt legaly a state Obama shouldent Legaly be a President!
If I was a die hard Monarchy I would say America still belongs to Britain


#15    xFelix

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Posted 21 May 2013 - 03:26 PM

So basically 'Merica did what it does best.. Bully people and get what it wants.. What exactly is shocking here?
We've perfected the art of taking from others, don't just take my word for it.. Open history books.

They give you an option to sell/surrender, if you don't.. That is an act of war. lol

My posts consist of my opinions, beliefs, and experiences, feel free to disagree in a respectful manner.

I have a right to my beleifs, just as you have a right to not agree with them.

So long as we respect each other's beliefs, we won't have a single problem.





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