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Atheists and Fundamentalists


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#286    The Silver Thong

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Posted 30 June 2010 - 05:15 PM

View Postmklsgl, on 30 June 2010 - 04:28 PM, said:

Check out the United Way scandal, ST. If my memory is not suffering from "Too Many Grateful Dead Tours-itis," I think the numbers involved were somewhere around 12 cents per dollar.


I have heard that as well most aren't that low .12 cents. However it gives people an idea of just how little trickles down. I was trying to find some numbers last night online but it appears charities are very tight lipped about this subject.

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#287    Mr. Miyagi

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Posted 30 June 2010 - 08:07 PM

View Postmklsgl, on 30 June 2010 - 04:28 PM, said:

Check out the United Way scandal, ST. If my memory is not suffering from "Too Many Grateful Dead Tours-itis," I think the numbers involved were somewhere around 12 cents per dollar.

There have been many, particularly with the United Way. Remember Aramony? the issue with the United way is how it's structured. I just don't think there are enough checks and balances on a national level. Every smaller "satellite" seems largely responsible for itself. Which can be a huge problem especially when the president is a thief.

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#288    Mr. Miyagi

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Posted 30 June 2010 - 08:17 PM

View PostLeonardo, on 30 June 2010 - 10:46 AM, said:

It is a difficult proposition, Miyagi-san.

If we take the view that spiritual aid is irrelevant, then we can view the physical aid as 'trumping' the teaching of a belief. However, the simple act of teaching a belief can result in future behaviour which is detrimental to the society through the very interpretive nature of belief.

Beliefs are dangerous because people can choose how to interpret them and behave accordingly. Teaching someone that holding a particular belief results in a particular benefit can lead to division, bigotry and even violence.

If these missionary organisations are focussed solely on providing physical aid, I would prefer to see them provide that aid through non-denominational organisations like Medicins Sans Frontiers, etc. There is no need for them to send their religion with the aid.

If we take the view that the spiritual aid is relevant, then we have to consider what particular 'brand' of religious aid is 'true'. Both in 'eternal terms' and for the immediate succor of the recipient. Teaching only the belief held by the missionary is gambling with the 'eternal well-being' of that recipient. As I said earlier, fine to gamble with your own eternal well-being, but one does not have the right to gamble with another's. That smacks of arrogance.

I understand where you're coming from here, as I've made similar statements in my own posts on the subject. I guess, my outlook upon the spiritual is that if an individual feels they need "spiritual" aid they can gain that from Christianity, Judaism, Islam, you choose, etc... I'm not so much concerned with where that comes from, only that the need is indeed a genuine need and not the result of living within extreme circumstances. The much more pressing issue is physical need imho. There are no gray areas here unless it's a community of ascetics or something.

Thanks agin Leo! much appreciated brother.

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#289    mklsgl

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Posted 01 July 2010 - 03:53 PM

View PostThe Silver Thong, on 30 June 2010 - 05:12 PM, said:

Robert De Niro right? Wow it's been awhile since i'v seen that, pretty good flick. Think I'll watch it tonight, refresh my memory.

You are thinking of The Mission with De Niro and Jeremy Irons, which is just as apt, but the film I am speaking of is detailed here: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0101465/

Edited by mklsgl, 01 July 2010 - 03:53 PM.

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#290    The Silver Thong

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Posted 01 July 2010 - 06:00 PM

View Postmklsgl, on 01 July 2010 - 03:53 PM, said:

You are thinking of The Mission with De Niro and Jeremy Irons, which is just as apt, but the film I am speaking of is detailed here: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0101465/


Quit right, thx now I have two movies I look forward to visiting again.

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#291    Blood_Sacrifice

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 04:09 PM

View PostTiggs, on 16 June 2010 - 12:25 PM, said:

On the basis that the most religious Western country is a place where two thirds of people believe that the Sun revolves around the Earth, and still hasn't worked out that sexuality doesn't matter, you'll have to excuse me if I don't buy your assertion about Science and tolerance being the norm.

Huh, is it, really? I can understand belief in creationism overriding evolution in numbers, but this one seems a bit too implausible, in today's day and age and that too in US. Do you have a source?

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#292    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 04:33 PM

View PostBlood_Sacrifice, on 24 November 2012 - 04:09 PM, said:

Huh, is it, really? I can understand belief in creationism overriding evolution in numbers, but this one seems a bit too implausible, in today's day and age and that too in US. Do you have a source?

Probing a more universal measure of knowledge, Gallup also asked the following basic science question, which has been used to indicate the level of public knowledge in two European countries in recent years: "As far as you know, does the earth revolve around the sun or does the sun revolve around the earth?" In the new poll, about four out of five Americans (79%) correctly respond that the earth revolves around the sun, while 18% say it is the other way around. These results are comparable to those found in Germany when a similar question was asked there in 1996; in response to that poll, 74% of Germans gave the correct answer, while 16% thought the sun revolved around the earth, and 10% said they didn't know. When the question was asked in Great Britain that same year, 67% answered correctly, 19% answered incorrectly, and 14% didn't know.  

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#293    Blood_Sacrifice

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 06:11 PM

^ Thanks. So more people believe in the heliocentric model in US.

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#294    Tiggs

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 04:20 PM

Apparently so. Goodness knows where I magic'd two-thirds up from.


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