11638 replies to this topic

[cormac mac airt]

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Swede's only as informed as the most recent scholastic decisions are made, which are not always correct and of which, many are only guesses.

You obviously understand nothing about Swede nor the information he presents. That's sad.

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His posts lack imagination and feeling...

The only think Swede's posts "lack" are fabrication and manipulation of the facts. And much thanks to him for that, as we have enough people at UM making it up as they go along. Reality is evidently too much for some to handle.

cormac

[The Puzzler]

cormac mac airt, on 09 March 2012 - 03:43 AM, said:

You obviously understand nothing about Swede nor the information he presents. That's sad.



The only think Swede's posts "lack" are fabrication and manipulation of the facts. And much thanks to him for that, as we have enough people at UM making it up as they go along. Reality is evidently too much for some to handle.

cormac

Lucky I'm not one of those.

There's not much to understand except he posts the latest general scientific information.

Sometimes you need some imagination to push science further in it's investigations which often seem to give no clear answers at the best of times.

According to current knowledge, Tunguska-like impacts occur every 100 years or so. It is, therefore, not far-fetched to hypothesise that a super-Tunguska may occur every 2,000, 3,000 or 5,000 years and would be capable of triggering ecological crises on a continental or even global scale. In the past, sceptics have demanded the evidence of a crater before they would accept an argument of cosmic impact, but it is now becoming understood that no crater is necessary for disastrous consequences to ensue. The difficulty this leaves scholarship, however, is that in a Tunguska Event no direct evidence is left behind. It may be impossible to prove that one ever took place in the distant past.
http://www.britarch....0/Ba30feat.html

Even science (and therefore Swede) may be beyond giving us the true answers, when science is incapable of finding them.

[Otharus]

Knul, on 09 March 2012 - 12:52 AM, said:

Please ask the board to remove this list from this site. It has nothing to do with the subject.

If you didn't like that post, why did you quote all of it?

We are discussing a manuscript that is supposed to be a copy from the 13th century.

My post was a bridge of family relations (24 generations) from the 13th century till now.

It shows many things.

To give only a few examples:
- names that were used through time (names are an important part of language and culture)
- the connection with Leeuwarden of our current royal family
- the fact that our royal family is hardly of Dutch origin, but nearly 100% German (not judging that)

[Otharus]

The Puzzler, on 09 March 2012 - 02:50 AM, said:

That picture is terrible, it's giving me the creeps.

I have changed it.

It was too small anyway.

But in a way it was funny and relevant, I thought, because it shows a bit of Dutch folklore and playing with language and tradition.

OLB is seen by some as a hilarious, blasphemic parody too.

It was a performance in 1970 near Volendam (NH) by artist Jan Cremer (1940), titled:

"Hans Brinker saves Holland by putting his thumb in the Dyke"

[Otharus]

Abramelin, on 08 March 2012 - 10:30 PM, said:

No one is interested in that long and winding list, Otharus.

Speak for yourself.

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I have posted about "Friso" the son of the Queen of the Netherlands who is now almost dead after his skiing accident.

Now THAT was irrelevant information.

[Otharus]

Knul, on 08 March 2012 - 11:53 PM, said:

Who knows the meaning of ULK ?

Check any Oldfrisian dictionary.

VLKE, ULKE = wolk (dutch), wolke (german), cloud (english)

And ofcourse it does make sense; the priests were creating a supernatural myth about her.

[Otharus]

Otharus, on 08 March 2012 - 09:39 PM, said:

generation 14
15 364. Willem van Oranje, stadtholder of Holland, Zeeland and Utrecht *Dillenburg 24.04.1533 +Delft 10.07.1584
15 365. Louise de Coligny *Châtillon-sur-Loing 23.09.1555 +Fontainebleau 13.11.1620

The Dutch national anthem refers to this Willem.
It starts with:

"Wilhelmus van Nassouwe
ben ik, van Duitsen bloed,
den Vaderland getrouwe
blijf ik tot in den dood."

translated:
"William of Nassau
I am, of German blood,
loyal to the fatherland
I remain till death."

The royals descend at least twice from him.
After I posted the long list, I found:

03 849. Sophia Dorothea van de Palts *Den Haag 14.10.1630 +Herrenhausen 08.06.1714
= = = = = =
07 698. Frederik van de Palts *Oberpfalz 26.08.1596 +Mainz 29.11.1632
07 699. Elizabeth Stuart *Fifeshire Schotland 19.08.1596 +Londen 13.02.1662
= = = = = =
15 396. Frederik van de Palts *Amberg 05.03.1574 +Heidelberg 19.09.1610
15 397. Louise Juliana van Nassau *Delft 31.03.1576 +Königsberg 15.03.1644
= = = = = =
30 794. = 15 364.
30 795. Charlotte de Bourbon *ca.1546 +Antwerpen 5.05.1582

[bom shankra]

Abramelin, on 02 March 2012 - 09:12 AM, said:

Well, if it's not that interesting then you better go read other threads, right?

There are more than enough threads about Atlantis and aliens intervening in ancient cultures and pyramids.

Maybe more to your liking?

yep your right, and fair go, i deserve a tounge lashing no doubt, though FYI, the only other threads i tend to read on UM recently would be about AE + the great pyramid (so you divined that right). Alien intervention and atlantis is a bit bellow the belt though, nevermind, believe it or not i would actually rather make friends here (i think?), so if your not feeling too superior perhaps you'll forgive the faux pas i've made on my very first comment in UM.  like i say i'll take it on the chin; what i should have said perhaps was, on the contrary, there's actually TOO much of interest in this thread; stuff about antiquity, cultures, races, geological events even etymology (which up to now really did/does bore me), etc, etc. The fascinating thing being that its all been generated by a book that is surely a fabrication, but as a thread, it is practically idigestable unless you were following it from the begining,(it's not just the thread lengh, if you read the links too, it triples or quadruples in size). Anyway, at least I had a go, and may come back to it now and then, no hard feelings my man...ok,  off to post on some dumb ass fringe thread thats more suited to my itellectual capacity - right.(ha ha, just kidding Abe.)

[Abramelin]

Otharus, on 09 March 2012 - 08:01 AM, said:

Speak for yourself.


Now THAT was irrelevant information.

It was as relevant as your huge list. Why would the queen have called her son "Friso"?

Btw, I am not going to ask the admins to remove your list, lol.

[Abramelin]

shanka boom, on 09 March 2012 - 10:29 AM, said:

yep your right, and fair go, i deserve a tounge lashing no doubt, though FYI, the only other threads i tend to read on UM recently would be about AE + the great pyramid (so you divined that right). Alien intervention and atlantis is a bit bellow the belt though, nevermind, believe it or not i would actually rather make friends here (i think?), so if your not feeling too superior perhaps you'll forgive the faux pas i've made on my very first comment in UM.  like i say i'll take it on the chin; what i should have said perhaps was, on the contrary, there's actually TOO much of interest in this thread; stuff about antiquity, cultures, races, geological events even etymology (which up to now really did/does bore me), etc, etc. The fascinating thing being that its all been generated by a book that is surely a fabrication, but as a thread, it is practically idigestable unless you were following it from the begining,(it's not just the thread lengh, if you read the links too, it triples or quadruples in size). Anyway, at least I had a go, and may come back to it now and then, no hard feelings my man...ok,  off to post on some dumb ass fringe thread thats more suited to my itellectual capacity - right.(ha ha, just kidding Abe.)

My post to you wasn't even meant to sound "superior" or anything, I was just amazed your first post in this thread was nothing but "it's not interesting". I could wander around on this site and add that comment to about a 100 topics, lol.

And about reading all of it (or not): what I myself sometimes do is just go back a couple of 100 pages and re-read like 10 or 20 pages.

You are right: this thread covers many things, and again yes: the etymology is also not much of my thing. But I realize that it is necessary to discuss it; the OLB is supposed to be written in a really ancient language, but is it? I don't think it is.

[The Puzzler]

Otharus, on 09 March 2012 - 07:56 AM, said:

I have changed it.

It was too small anyway.

But in a way it was funny and relevant, I thought, because it shows a bit of Dutch folklore and playing with language and tradition.

OLB is seen by some as a hilarious, blasphemic parody too.

It was a performance in 1970 near Volendam (NH) by artist Jan Cremer (1940), titled:

"Hans Brinker saves Holland by putting his thumb in the Dyke"

OK, well maybe I didn't get the joke. I'm not really into 'Benny Hill' humour. People could think it was you and it's really terribly crass, sorry.

[Abramelin]

Knul, on 08 March 2012 - 11:53 PM, said:

Who knows the meaning of ULK ?

MS 38, line 03 (P. 54):Thêr thrvch ne thuradon hja nên strid wither an to spinnande. Nv skolde aejder wâna, thaet hja vral-et folk to hâpe hropen hêde vmbe vs algadur to-t land ut to driwande. Nêan an stêde fon hja to bihluda gvngon hja allerwêikes, âk to tha hêinde Krêkalana til tha Alpa ut to kêthane, thaet et thene allervrste drochten hâgth hêde sin wisa toghater Min-erva, to nômth Nyhellênia êmong tha maenniska to sendane in overa sê mith-en ulk, vmbe tha manniska gode rêd to jêvane aend that allermannalik, thêr hja hêra wilde, rik aend lukich skolde wertha, aend ênis bâs skolde wertha ovir alle kêningkrik irtha.s. Hira byldnese staeldon hja vppe hjara aeltaerum, jeftha hja vrsellade-t anda dvma maenniska.

Ottema translates wolk (cloud), but it makes no sense.I think it was a horn or shell  (h-ulk ?) to make one's voice louder as used on ships, so that commands are heard nevertheless the noise of wind and waves. An attribute of Minerva is a flute, which comes close. This flute (vuvuzela) is used by stockmen, shepherds. We meet the sheep in the story of Nyhellenia (= Minerva). The horn (toethoorn) is also used during the Maifest (pag. 130).

The problem with Ottema was, that he didn't know about marine terminology, so he asked Cornelis over de Linden to explain marine items.The Halbertsma's used to sail (skutjesilen) on the lakes between Grouw and Sneek.

Funny, I read your post and the answer is already in it.... it's a HULK:

hulk (n.)
O.E. hulc "light, fast ship" (but in M.E. a heavy, unwieldy one), probably from O.Du. hulke and M.L. hulcus, perhaps ultimately from Gk. holkas "merchant ship," lit. "ship that is towed," from helkein "to pull" (from PIE root *selk- "to pull, draw").

http://www.etymonlin...searchmode=none

Minerva wasn't sent on a 'cloud'. she was sent overseas with a hulk, a ship.

[Knul]

Abramelin, on 09 March 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

Funny, I read your post and the answer is already in it.... it's a HULK:

hulk (n.)
O.E. hulc "light, fast ship" (but in M.E. a heavy, unwieldy one), probably from O.Du. hulke and M.L. hulcus, perhaps ultimately from Gk. holkas "merchant ship," lit. "ship that is towed," from helkein "to pull" (from PIE root *selk- "to pull, draw").

http://www.etymonlin...searchmode=none

Minerva wasn't sent on a 'cloud'. she was sent overseas with a hulk, a ship.

Beautifil, Abe ! There is a Wikipedia article about the hulk with a nice picture.  It is interesting, what they say about it''s function in the 19th century. http://nl.wikipedia....iki/Hulk_(schip)

Edited by Knul, 09 March 2012 - 05:47 PM.

[Abramelin]

Knul, on 09 March 2012 - 05:16 PM, said:

Beautifil, Abe ! There is a Wikipedia article about the hulk with a nice picture: http://upload.wikime...ing-09-hulk.jpg It is interesting, what they say about it's function in the 19th century. http://nl.wikipedia....iki/Hulk_(schip)

Yeah, I thought this was a bit more of a realistic translation.

And the OLB uses 2 words for clouds: "wolka" & "wolkum".

.

Edited by Abramelin, 09 March 2012 - 05:50 PM.

[Knul]

Otharus, on 09 March 2012 - 08:23 AM, said:

Check any Oldfrisian dictionary.

VLKE, ULKE = wolk (dutch), wolke (german), cloud (english)

And ofcourse it does make sense; the priests were creating a supernatural myth about her.

Unfortunately for you, Abe came with the relevant solution: hulk = type of ship.