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have no memory of any dreams


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#1    daavin

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Posted 29 July 2010 - 01:30 AM

Hello all,
even as a child I have no memory of ever dreaming at night... I know I must be but I have zero recollection of any of them.  Anyone have any ideas why, and how I could possibly recall them.

I spy with my little eye something that starts with come here and ends with OUCH
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#2    DreamyEye

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Posted 29 July 2010 - 04:38 AM

You could try like Einstein did and hold some metal beads or other noisemakers over the floor  while drifting off to sleep.  When you relax and move into the sleep state, you'll drop the beads, which will likely wake you up suddenly, causing you to remember a dream, or at least an inspiring insight.  You have to find something to hold that will make noise when it drops to your flooring.  A small bell, maybe, if it will be dropping on carpet.

Having a light snack of a protein every night a half hour before going to bed is said to help regulate the sleep cycle, which can boost the dream recall potential.

A therapist once told me to keep a notebook by the bed and the moment I wake up, jot down any thoughts and impressions that are on my mind before fully wake--whether they came in a dream or not.  Doing this did increase my dream recall nicely, though I still don't remember dreams every night.


#3    Mr Walker

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Posted 29 July 2010 - 02:07 PM

Personlly, i agree with einstein. The best way to ensure you remember your dreams is to wake up when in a full draming state. If you wake up slowly and gently, going through the full stages of the sleep cycle, you might not ever remember your dreams. As a teenager i used an alarm to wake uo regularly as part of a programme to develop lucid dreaming, then controlled dreaming states. These days the dog or my bladder wakes me up regularly :innocent:  

THe next step is to write down what you remember immediately. A third step is to discuss with someone your dreams. Tell them to another in story form. All these things help fix our dreams and also train our subconscious awareness to be more perceptive of our dreams.

Heres a simple trick which might help.  Try going to bed an hour or more earlier than you usually do. Get a couple more hours sleep than usual, for a week or so.

When we are tired and short on sleep we often sleep deeply, but when we arent tired we sleep more lightly, and it is this condition that we are more likely to enter that half awake/ half asleep transition zone where we can recall our dreams. I think that is one reason why children and adolescents remember dreams more. They just have more time to sleep, sleep more "lightly,' and thus wake more often.
The good news for me is that this also happens more in "old age" and when you arent working full time, allowing me to really spend some time revisiting and recreating my childhood dreaming skills.

Edited by Mr Walker, 29 July 2010 - 02:10 PM.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#4    Supermanfan77

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Posted 30 July 2010 - 08:54 AM

View Postdaavin, on 29 July 2010 - 01:30 AM, said:

Hello all,
even as a child I have no memory of ever dreaming at night... I know I must be but I have zero recollection of any of them.  Anyone have any ideas why, and how I could possibly recall them.

I know how you feel man, I have the same problem, but I only remember my dreams 99.9 percent of the time


#5    daavin

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Posted 31 July 2010 - 03:36 AM

thank you all for the tips will give the Einstein thing a try will let you know if it helps

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#6    Kazahel

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Posted 01 August 2010 - 02:19 AM

View Postdaavin, on 31 July 2010 - 03:36 AM, said:

thank you all for the tips will give the Einstein thing a try will let you know if it helps

Well I dont see how Einsteins method would work unless you think you can hold onto something while getting up to and through an REM cycle. It takes around 90 minutes before you even get to REM sleep when first going to sleep and you have to get through delta sleep which means imo you pretty much have no chance of holding onto those beads until even reaching REM stage sleep. You could try it after a full nights sleep so you get into REM stage sleep quicker but even then you will drop them before having a full dream which almost defeats the purpose.

Here is the stages/cycles of sleep and there timing..

Quote

Stage 1 sleep
Stage 1 sleep is experienced as falling to sleep and is a transition stage between wake and sleep. It usually lasts between 1 and 5 minutes and occupies approximately 2-5 % of a normal night of sleep. This stage is dramatically increased in some insomnia (restless legs) and disorders that produce frequent arousals such as apnea .

Stage 2 sleep
Stage 2 sleep follows stage 1 sleep and is the "baseline" of sleep. This stage is part of the 90 minute cycle and occupies approximately 45-60% of sleep.

Stage 3 and 4 or Delta sleep Stage 2 sleep evolves into "Delta" sleep or "slow wave" sleep in approximately 10-20 minutes and may last 15-30 minutes. It is called "slow wave" sleep because brain activity slows down dramatically from the "theta" rhythm of stage 2 to a much slower rhythm of 1 to 2 cycles per second called "delta" and the height or amplitude of the waves increases dramatically. In most adults these two stages are completed within the first two 90 minute sleep cycles or within the first three hours of sleep. Contrary to popular belief, it is delta sleep that is the "deepest" stage of sleep (not REM) and the most restorative. It is delta sleep that a sleep deprived person's brain craves the first and foremost. In children, delta sleep can occupy up to 40% of all sleep time and this is what makes children unwakeable or "dead asleep" during most of the night.

Stage 5 sleep
REM (Rapid Eye Movement Sleep): a very active stage of sleep. Composes 20-25 % of a normal nights sleep. Breathing , heart rate and brain wave activity quicken. Vivid Dreams can occur. Sleep Specialists call this 5th stage of sleep "REM" rapid eye movement sleep because if one is to watch a person in this stage, their eyes are moving rapidly about. After REM stage, the body usually returns to stage 2 sleep.

As found here.

So the best way I think is to wake up naturally because we naturally wake up after an REM stage. After you wake up just think what have you been thinking about before moving around and getting up. You could set an alarm to wake yourself up during a dream to help remember but that just means you miss out on some of the dream which kinda defeats what your trying to do in the first place, which is remember a dream. Unless of course your happy with just remembering maybe half of it.

Quote

Studies strongly suggest that a nap a few hours after waking in the morning is the most common time to have a lucid dream.Lucid dreams are strongly associated with REM sleep. REM sleep is more abundant just before the final awakening. This means they most commonly occur right before waking up.

As found here.

*Also maybe if your not remembering them you might have your alarm set to wake you up during deep sleep/before the final REM stage. So maybe try either go to sleep earlier or just adjust your sleeping pattern. You will know if you are waking up in deep sleep(delta)because you will feel groggy after you wake up and not refreshed.

Edited by Kazahel, 01 August 2010 - 02:37 AM.


#7    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 August 2010 - 03:09 AM

[quote]name='Kazahel' timestamp='1280629185' post='3516729']
Well I dont see how Einsteins method would work unless you think you can hold onto something while getting up to and through an REM cycle. It takes around 90 minutes before you even get to REM sleep when first going to sleep and you have to get through delta sleep which means imo you pretty much have no chance of holding onto those beads until even reaching REM stage sleep. You could try it after a full nights sleep so you get into REM stage sleep quicker but even then you will drop them before having a full dream which almost defeats the purpose.

Here is the stages/cycles of sleep and there timing..[/quote]

Actually there is no prescribed sleep cycle. It is differnt for both individuals and for groups Old people have significantly differnt sleep patterns from children. Adolscents are differt again, and so are adults.
It may well be the differnces which account for the differnces in peoples abilities to remember dreams and to learn lucid dreaming. I can go to sleep instantly, within a few seconds) and be dreaming within seconds, wake up write down the dream, go back to the same dream, wake up a few minutes later, write more down then go back to the dream.

As a kid we has an outside toilet about 30 yards from the house. I learned to get up, go out to the loo, and come back 5 minutes later, then slip back into my dream. Some people's dreams last for seconds, some people can dream one continuous dteam for an hour or more



[quote]As found [url="http://library.thinkquest.org/C005545/english/sleep/stage.htm"]here.[/url]

So the best way I think is to wake up naturally because we naturally wake up after an REM stage. After you wake up just think what have you been thinking about before moving around and getting up. You could set an alarm to wake yourself up during a dream to help remember but that just means you miss out on some of the dream which kinda defeats what your trying to do in the first place, which is remember a dream. Unless of course your happy with just remembering maybe half of it.[/quote] The trouble with this, isthat  some people dont wake up for a full 8 hours. And then they will never know what they dreamed or be able to recall anything but the last ew minutes of it(although one method of dream recall involves remembering one strong hook from a dream and then "recollecting the more mundane elements around tha t vivid hook.
If you wake up regularly you are more likely to remember the last bit of your dream and be able to work back from there (although this is some what a learned skill)

I've been working on my techniques lately, including regular wakenings, and most nights i have full recall of 5 or 6 dreams, and partial recall of as many again. And sometimes i am fully lucid, and occasionaly in conscious control of my dreams, as i was when a child and teenager.
My ultimate aim is to get back the ability to fully create and control my dreamscapes, including; characters setting s, plots, etc; which i had from the age of several years, up to adulthood.
A project for my retirement :innocent:


[quote]
As found [url="http://www.wikihow.com/Lucid-Dream"]here.[/url]

*Also maybe if your not remembering them you might have your alarm set to wake you up during deep sleep/before the final REM stage. So maybe try either go to sleep earlier or just adjust your sleeping pattern. You will know if you are waking up in deep sleep(delta)because you will feel groggy after you wake up and not refreshed.[/quote]

This is good advice up to a point, although i never wake up groggy. Always bright eyed and bushy tailed. My family has never needed much sleep but i know that the longer i sleep the better chance i have to dream and wake up/ Short tired sleeps when I dont wake up I, at least, am less likely to recall my dreams than light semi- conscious sleeping.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#8    Kazahel

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Posted 01 August 2010 - 03:35 AM

View PostMr Walker, on 01 August 2010 - 03:09 AM, said:

Actually there is no prescribed sleep cycle. It is differnt for both individuals and for groups Old people have significantly differnt sleep patterns from children. Adolscents are differt again, and so are adults.
It may well be the differnces which account for the differnces in peoples abilities to remember dreams and to learn lucid dreaming. I can go to sleep instantly, within a few seconds) and be dreaming within seconds, wake up write down the dream, go back to the same dream, wake up a few minutes later, write more down then go back to the dream.

Well the normal order(so for most people) is this "Sleep proceeds in cycles of REM and NREM, the order normally being N1 → N2 → N3 → N2 → REM. There is a greater amount of deep sleep (stage N3) early in the night, while the proportion of REM sleep increases later in the night and just before natural awakening." Taken from here.

So some cycles may be different but for most people it goes in these stages which is why I dont understand how this Einstein method would work(unless maybe done after a full nights sleep but even then it seems designed to wake you as you are falling asleep.. not after dreaming or even during). Does anyone have a link to this method btw because I am curious on it.

View PostMr Walker, on 01 August 2010 - 03:09 AM, said:

The trouble with this, isthat  some people dont wake up for a full 8 hours. And then they will never know what they dreamed or be able to recall anything but the last ew minutes of it(although one method of dream recall involves remembering one strong hook from a dream and then "recollecting the more mundane elements around tha t vivid hook.

Most people wake up after the last REM stage if they wake up naturally, which gives them a good chance to remember at least their last dream if they take the time to actually try remember rather than springing out of bed. So they might not remember the other dreams during the night but have a good chance to remember their last one. I tend to wake up after each dream through the night and I write down the cool ones so I dont forget after dreaming again.

View PostMr Walker, on 01 August 2010 - 03:09 AM, said:

I've been working on my techniques lately, including regular wakenings, and most nights i have full recall of 5 or 6 dreams, and partial recall of as many again. And sometimes i am fully lucid, and occasionaly in conscious control of my dreams, as i was when a child and teenager.
My ultimate aim is to get back the ability to fully create and control my dreamscapes, including; characters setting s, plots, etc; which i had from the age of several years, up to adulthood.
A project for my retirement :innocent:

Yes me too. I have been getting back into it as well and I found that having a more pure lifestyle has helped very much.  :) So not smoking... ummmm... for example has helped me lots especially in dream recall.

Edited by Kazahel, 01 August 2010 - 03:38 AM.


#9    000000000000000

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Posted 01 August 2010 - 03:39 AM

I personally used to not remember my dreams either. Now when I wake up I take 5 minutes to just lay there and remember. It usually gives me a vivid recollection of last couple dreams.


#10    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 August 2010 - 03:46 AM

View PostKazahel, on 01 August 2010 - 03:35 AM, said:

Well the normal order(so for most people) is this "Sleep proceeds in cycles of REM and NREM, the order normally being N1 → N2 → N3 → N2 → REM. There is a greater amount of deep sleep (stage N3) early in the night, while the proportion of REM sleep increases later in the night and just before natural awakening." Taken from here.

So some cycles may be different but for most people it goes in these stages which is why I dont understand how this Einstein method would work(unless maybe done after a full nights sleep but even then it seems designed to wake you as you are falling asleep.. not after dreaming or even during). Does anyone have a link to this method btw because I am curious on it.



Most people wake up after the last REM stage if they wake up naturally, which gives them a good chance to remember at least their last dream if they take the time to actually try remember rather than springing out of bed. So they might not remember the other dreams during the night but have a good chance to remember their last one. I tend to wake up after each dream through the night and I write down the cool ones so I dont forget after dreaming again.



Yes me too. I have been getting back into it as well and I found that having a more pure lifestyle has helped very much.  :) So not smoking... ummmm... for example has helped me lots especially in dream recall.
I think one reason "einsteins" method works is th t it wakes you up often. We all tend to remember dreams that we are awoken abruptly from. If we wake u gently and transit into awakeness slowly we might not even think about our dreams and th never recall them.

Thus the more times we are woken up the more dreams we will remember an the more sharp the transition from sleep to awakeness the more likely we are to think of our dream.
I know the studies about dreams and rem sleep but i am not sure how universally applicable they are.

Other studies show big differeces,as i ponted out,and unless there is a direct monitoring of dream activity  it is hard to establish the connection between dreaming and particular brain activity. I lknow i can be dreaming within seconds of falling asleep, and i have never consciously  awoken from a sleep where i was not in the middle of a dream. Ie i Appear to be dreaming all the time iam sleeping


Ps the wiki link was interesting and in any ways correc. It mirrors stuff i self learned as a child, 50 plus years ago. I was interested to see that lucid dreaming decreases with age.. Personally, I found it incresed, but changed in nature in adloescence, and didnt diminish until the responsibilities of adult life, andh he freedoms of adult hood made it both less accessible and less necessary.

However there is considerable research and detail on the biological/ neurological nature of dreaming that was not included. and a lot more on sleep patterns and cycles that was only touched on in this wiki article.

Edited by Mr Walker, 01 August 2010 - 03:55 AM.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#11    Kazahel

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Posted 01 August 2010 - 04:12 AM

View PostMr Walker, on 01 August 2010 - 03:46 AM, said:

I think one reason "einsteins" method works is th t it wakes you up often. We all tend to remember dreams that we are awoken abruptly from. If we wake u gently and transit into awakeness slowly we might not even think about our dreams and th never recall them.

Thus the more times we are woken up the more dreams we will remember an the more sharp the transition from sleep to awakeness the more likely we are to think of our dream.

But it doesnt seem to even give you the chance to dream(let alone dream fully). Unless you think you can manage to hold onto some beads after falling asleep and then drop them after or during a dream to wake you up. Imo most people would drop then as soon as they fall asleep, which means they wouldnt even get a chance to dream. So to me it doesnt make any sense. But if anyone can find a link to this technique I would be interested.  :)  It could maybe be a training thing but it wouldnt imo be a good method of trying to remember a dream because you would drop them before dreaming.

*Also personally I dont think it would be very nice sleeping with an arm hanging over the side of the bed inorder to do it.  :rofl:

Edited by Kazahel, 01 August 2010 - 04:18 AM.


#12    Torgo

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 04:40 AM

I think the times of night during which I dream cycle relative to my sleeping and wake up times such that I will wake up remembering dreams every morning for a week or so, followed by months of not remembering a single dream.  It's just as well, considering how bizarre and divorced from reality my dreams are...


#13    lookingfortruth

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Posted 05 August 2010 - 04:44 AM

I'll help you out. Wake up 2-4 hours before normal, stay up for about 2-4 hours then go back to bed. You'll have many dreams all the time without fail

Edited by lookingfortruth, 05 August 2010 - 04:44 AM.


#14    Toolite

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Posted 18 August 2010 - 04:27 PM

View Postdaavin, on 29 July 2010 - 01:30 AM, said:

Hello all,
even as a child I have no memory of ever dreaming at night... I know I must be but I have zero recollection of any of them.  Anyone have any ideas why, and how I could possibly recall them.


The only dreams I remember are they ones that I am to do something with.. showing me whats to come..

Recalling a dream I am to understand is done by simply thinking of the dream before falling asleep.. but, if you don't remember it how would you be able to recall it.. that's all I know.. I still think it's interesting that you don't remember but, I would think that you should of at least had a couple you do remember and maybe they had meaning..  Thats interesting...

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#15    Felyn

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Posted 23 August 2010 - 06:44 AM

I can verify lookingfortruth's suggestion.  I usually have my most vivid and meaningful dreams after I wake up and then fallen back asleep.  Daytime naps seems to bring on pretty strange dreams that I easily remember upon waking up.  I also keep a small notebook on my nightstand (which is actually my late great grandmother's laundry basket...lol...I have no clue why, I just can't get rid of it for real nightstand for some reason it feels natural to use it this way...but I digress)so when I wake up, I don't have to get out of bed and "disperse" my dream.  I find when I just write down a few of the major symbols or objects the rest just seems to flow out without much effort.  Good luck and sweet dreams...hopefully.





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