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Lockheed Skunk Works Directer...Ben Rich


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#31    booNyzarC

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Posted 11 November 2010 - 03:15 PM

View Post747400, on 11 November 2010 - 02:59 PM, said:

The question is, though, should the actual things that Ben Rich is quoted as saying be disregarded, just because of an over-excited reporter? I mean, these kind of comments have been attributed to him before. All the things that people have been picking apart are things that have been added by the reporter. These people priding themselves that they're smart and logical, and they're not going to be misled like all these gullible fools, does that mean that the actual substance of what Ben Rich is quoted as saying should be disregarded?
I understand where you are coming from with this 747400, and I'm certainly not intending to label anyone here as a gullible fool.  But perhaps you, or someone else, can answer a couple of questions relevant to the point you've raised.

What did Ben Rich actually say?  And how exactly can we confirm that he actually said it?


#32    IamsSon

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Posted 11 November 2010 - 03:25 PM

View PostbooNyzarC, on 11 November 2010 - 02:44 PM, said:

I honestly don't understand how anyone can see these points as anything but contradictory...
Maybe you need to re-read my post then.

"But then with me that horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man's mind which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey's mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?" - Charles Darwin, in a letter to William Graham on July 3, 1881

#33    snuffypuffer

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Posted 11 November 2010 - 09:31 PM

One of those generals or engineers or CEOs, somebody "in the know," anyhow, said that many of these secret military projects are at least 15 years ahead of anything we know about now. So the simplest way to find out if any of this is true or not is just wait it out and see what's we're doing 15 years from now. Think about it, the stealth fighter had been around since the 70's but it was only brought into the light in early 90's. Now, it's being retired from service I think. Which means its replacement had been here since at least the 80's.

I admit I'm not 100 percent sure I'm getting any of this right, though.

Nothing to see here.

#34    Moonie2012

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Posted 11 November 2010 - 09:40 PM

View PostIamsSon, on 11 November 2010 - 03:25 PM, said:

Maybe you need to re-read my post then.

I think I understand what you were getting at, but for the US military to be able to build something like an interdimensional starship and not have a clue of how it works doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Edited by Moonie2012, 11 November 2010 - 09:41 PM.


#35    IamsSon

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Posted 11 November 2010 - 09:43 PM

View PostMoonie2012, on 11 November 2010 - 09:40 PM, said:

I think I understand what you were getting at, but for the US military to be able to build something like a interdimensional starship and not have a clue of how it works doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
That's the thing, if you notice what he is reputed to have said, and what I am pointing out, we may not have built our own ship yet, but may already be operating one because we found or "borrowed" one or more.

"But then with me that horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man's mind which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey's mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?" - Charles Darwin, in a letter to William Graham on July 3, 1881

#36    Moonie2012

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Posted 11 November 2010 - 09:44 PM

View PostIamsSon, on 11 November 2010 - 09:43 PM, said:

That's the thing, if you notice what he is reputed to have said, and what I am pointing out, we may not have built our own ship yet, but may already be operating one because we found or "borrowed" one or more.

The article gives me the impression that we are building/have built them on our own. Then again, it's a horribly written article - which was my point in the first place.


#37    bee

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 02:23 AM

View Postbee, on 11 November 2010 - 02:07 PM, said:

A little story to share...


I have a friend who goes cold-calling...selling 'energy'...you know getting
people to swap their energy provider.


So...he goes to this one house and there's a man living alone..in his 80s.

He's got lots of pictures around of aeroplanes.

My mate is engaging him in conversation...noting the pictures, asking him about them.
(part of the sales patter...lol...although he IS genuinely interested)


To cut a longer story short...



The guy chats away..yes he's travelled the world...he worked as an aeronautical engineer
for Boeing.

Yes he has worked in America...for Boeing...alongside Lookheed Martin.


My mate slips in..... " Did you work at Area 51?"

NOW the guy...who was still very sharp...realised that my friend knew about the subject
and started to get a bit wary.


But "Yes".....he said he HAD worked at area 51.


So  my friend goes straight in and asks 'Did you see a 'Craft' ?

The guy knew what he meant...and just smiled and nodded.


He wouldn't be drawn anymore....so the sale was wrapped up and on to the next house.....


View PostCoffey, on 11 November 2010 - 02:19 PM, said:

Thanks for sharing that. It's very interesting!  :tu:


:tu:


Yeah...I thought so.

What I'm talking about only happened last week.


Funny how thoughts...leads...kind of dovetail.


#38    booNyzarC

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 04:12 AM

View Postbee, on 12 November 2010 - 02:23 AM, said:

:tu:


Yeah...I thought so.

What I'm talking about only happened last week.


Funny how thoughts...leads...kind of dovetail.
Now, I don't want to give the wrong impression with what I'm about to say.  I'm not calling you a liar and I'm not saying that you are wrong.  But in order for anyone to believe this we must:

  • Assume that you are telling a true story.  (Again, I'm not saying that you aren't...)
  • Assume that your friend is telling a true story.  (Again, I'm not saying that he isn't...)
  • Assume that the random person he ran into is agreeing with the leading questions of your friend, which allude to some possible assumptions.  (Again, I'm not saying that he isn't...)
  • Assume that if you are in England, your friend is in England, and this encounter took place in England and that this previous employee of Area 51 migrated to England for some reason or another.  (Again, I'm not saying that this isn't the case...)

In my opinion, and with no intent to cause disrespect, this is taking hearsay to an extreme which I am not willing to accept without some kind of verifiable documentation as proof.


#39    SolarPlexus

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 09:43 AM

booNyzarC do you doubt the computer screen infront of your face with the same zeal with which you doubt everything else?

Do you need 'verifiable documentation' for the sandwich you're eating?

Come on you obviously shouldn't believe ANYTHING but this is absurd...

No disrespect... :)

Edited by SolarPlexus, 12 November 2010 - 09:47 AM.

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#40    bee

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 09:44 AM

View PostbooNyzarC, on 12 November 2010 - 04:12 AM, said:

Now, I don't want to give the wrong impression with what I'm about to say.  I'm not calling you a liar and I'm not saying that you are wrong.  But in order for anyone to believe this we must:

  • Assume that you are telling a true story.  (Again, I'm not saying that you aren't...)
  • Assume that your friend is telling a true story.  (Again, I'm not saying that he isn't...)
  • Assume that the random person he ran into is agreeing with the leading questions of your friend, which allude to some possible assumptions.  (Again, I'm not saying that he isn't...)
  • Assume that if you are in England, your friend is in England, and this encounter took place in England and that this previous employee of Area 51 migrated to England for some reason or another.  (Again, I'm not saying that this isn't the case...)

In my opinion, and with no intent to cause disrespect, this is taking hearsay to an extreme which I am not willing to accept without some kind of verifiable documentation as proof.


HA!   Now I know what the whistleblowers feel like.....LOL


For what it's worth...I am 100% telling the truth and so is my friend.


The conversation he had with the guy was longer than my post shows.
My friend is very sharp when it comes to people and their honesty.

The guy became very wary and would only NOD to the 'leading question'...he wouldn't discuss it
and wasn't even pressed to do so.

He is English (and said) he lived and worked in America for 15 years. And was in the
aeronautics industry for many many years,
even having some part to play in the design of Concorde, he said at some point.


The conversation with my friend and him...built up from chatting about planes, jet propulsion
and whatnot...but the guy kind-of did a double-take when it got onto quantum physics...he
wasn't expecting an 'energy' cold-calling salesman to be au fait with that kind of thing.


There is NO documentary proof...and we (my friend and I) would never...drop him in it if
there was....ie. researching him. It's over. That's all there is.


My friend and I even discussed whether the guy might have thought 'someone' had come from
an 'agency' to test out if he was a blabber-mouth. Which he wasn't regarding Area 51..because
he only did a NOD with a smile.

If he was a BS-er he would have gone-to-town on the  whole thing...embellishing his story.

So that's it. Make of it what you will...believe what you want..... :)


#41    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 09:48 AM

I don't think there need be any reason why someone being un-American need preclude them from being in on secret US programs, no. RAF pilots have flown Stealth Fighters on part-exchange with the USAF and so on, even when they were top secret, and there are strong rumours that Secret US aircraft have operated from bases in the UK (Boscombe Down, Macrihanish in Scotland and so on).

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#42    bee

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 10:20 AM

View PostSolarPlexus, on 12 November 2010 - 09:43 AM, said:

booNyzarC do you doubt the computer screen infront of your face with the same zeal with which you doubt everything else?

Do you need 'verifiable documentation' for the sandwich you're eating?

Come on you obviously shouldn't believe ANYTHING but this is absurd...

No disrespect... :)


LOL....the die-hard sceptics are sitting pretty when it comes to all the
toppy top secret stuff..because if the agencies are doing their job properly
we are extremely unlikely to be able to get our hands on any documentation
that could be termed 'definitive' proof.


Even when a whistleblower has 'something'....they are in a precarious position
and are then subjected to the 'character assassination' treatment. With fake stuff
inserted in the story..via other agency-members..?

As long as doubt can be cast on a 'story'....that's JOB DONE.



View Post747400, on 12 November 2010 - 09:48 AM, said:

I don't think there need be any reason why someone being un-American need preclude them from being in on secret US programs, no. RAF pilots have flown Stealth Fighters on part-exchange with the USAF and so on, even when they were top secret, and there are strong rumours that Secret US aircraft have operated from bases in the UK (Boscombe Down, Macrihanish in Scotland and so on).


Good point/s.


#43    booNyzarC

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 01:29 PM

View PostSolarPlexus, on 12 November 2010 - 09:43 AM, said:

booNyzarC do you doubt the computer screen infront of your face with the same zeal with which you doubt everything else?

Do you need 'verifiable documentation' for the sandwich you're eating?

Come on you obviously shouldn't believe ANYTHING but this is absurd...

No disrespect... :)
Pointing out the assumptions that would be required in order to believe a third hand account like that is not absurd.  Trying to compare a third hand account with something physically in front of me as though each example has equal validity...  that is absurd.


#44    Belial

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 01:35 PM

View Postbee, on 10 November 2010 - 09:18 AM, said:

LOL......thanks for the amusing dancing plane pic.


Where did you get it from?


:innocent:

I made it lol.

Where it states "For official use only" - gently rub a white wax candle over the area indicated.

Kick a habit - i never did like Tolkien...

#45    booNyzarC

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Posted 12 November 2010 - 01:46 PM

View Postbee, on 12 November 2010 - 09:44 AM, said:

HA!   Now I know what the whistleblowers feel like.....LOL


For what it's worth...I am 100% telling the truth and so is my friend.


The conversation he had with the guy was longer than my post shows.
My friend is very sharp when it comes to people and their honesty.

The guy became very wary and would only NOD to the 'leading question'...he wouldn't discuss it
and wasn't even pressed to do so.

He is English (and said) he lived and worked in America for 15 years. And was in the
aeronautics industry for many many years,
even having some part to play in the design of Concorde, he said at some point.


The conversation with my friend and him...built up from chatting about planes, jet propulsion
and whatnot...but the guy kind-of did a double-take when it got onto quantum physics...he
wasn't expecting an 'energy' cold-calling salesman to be au fait with that kind of thing.


There is NO documentary proof...and we (my friend and I) would never...drop him in it if
there was....ie. researching him. It's over. That's all there is.


My friend and I even discussed whether the guy might have thought 'someone' had come from
an 'agency' to test out if he was a blabber-mouth. Which he wasn't regarding Area 51..because
he only did a NOD with a smile.

If he was a BS-er he would have gone-to-town on the  whole thing...embellishing his story.

So that's it. Make of it what you will...believe what you want..... :)
I wasn't saying that you were lying.  Nor was I saying that your friend or the chap he talked about was lying.  I was merely pointing out the assumptions that we would have to make in order to accept this story beyond face value and when it comes to something like Area 51, UFOs, and aliens - I'm not willing to accept this as though it is absolute fact.

It was a good story, don't get me wrong.





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