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Fluoridegate


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#166    Little Fish

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Posted 16 July 2011 - 03:36 PM

New study - fluoride consumption leads to brain damage

"The prolonged ingestion of fluoride may cause significant damage to health and particularly the nervous system," write researchers Valdez-Jiminez, et al. in their report. "Fluoride is capable of crossing the blood-brain barrier, which may cause biochemical and functional changes in the nervous system during pregnancy, since the fluoride accumulates in brain tissue before birth."

http://www.naturalne...ain_damage.html


#167    regeneratia

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Posted 16 July 2011 - 06:24 PM

View PostRafterman, on 14 July 2011 - 02:50 PM, said:

You're assuming that Ron Paul knows what in the hell he's talking about and isn't simply pandering to the kook fringe that support him.


Is there anything in that post that indicates that I am assuming anything?

He is pro-life. He will never get my vote.

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#168    regeneratia

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Posted 16 July 2011 - 06:25 PM

View Postpsychoticmike, on 16 July 2011 - 10:38 AM, said:

thats a valid point but the decision should still be left up to the individual whether they want fluoride or not! instead you are forced to consume it in high quantities every single day and you have no say in it, and now there is plenty of research saying it is bad in high quantities, the fda says we are not getting it in high enough doses but this is coming from a corrupt agency that approves drugs and then you later see on the tv those drugs being recalled because they are killing people and causing heart attacks etc. so clearly they were wrong when they studied the effects of those drugs, so they can also be wrong about the proper amount of fluoride! don't believe me about the corruption?

check this link out

Scientists inform Obama of Corruption at the FDA

They didn't mention how we are getting the fluoride. Is it all measured by ingestion? What about the topical applications of fluoridated tap water? What about the fluoridated water vapors we breathe in when we shower? Surely they have to count.


I saw that when it came out. Von E was a crook!! (head of the FDA during the Bush years, where I paid close attention to him due to the plight of Provenge.)

Edited by regeneratia, 16 July 2011 - 06:29 PM.

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#169    psychoticmike

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Posted 17 July 2011 - 02:49 AM

View Postregeneratia, on 16 July 2011 - 06:25 PM, said:

They didn't mention how we are getting the fluoride. Is it all measured by ingestion?



no i think its all measured in parts per million, and how much is in the water itself



What about the topical applications of fluoridated tap water? What about the fluoridated water vapors we breathe in when we shower? Surely they have to count.


yep like i said thats what concerns me the most, is all the sources there are so many sources people dont even realize, fluoride is in pills, cosmetics, deodorants, pop, water, all food, because its in the water, just about everything has fluoride in it! oh and your toothpaste of course! so with all these sources combined plus many more we are safe and it is still not high enough to cause any problems? but yet theres enough fluoride in just the tap water to help our teeth? not buying it!



I saw that when it came out. Von E was a crook!! (head of the FDA during the Bush years, where I paid close attention to him due to the plight of Provenge.)



#170    psychoticmike

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Posted 17 July 2011 - 02:52 AM

one more thing if its in the tap water, wouldn't some of that water make its way to lakes, rivers, and oceans? if so what happens when we have fog? or humidity? could that potentially cause the fluoride to turn into a gaseous state and float through the air in that fog? if thats the case then thats yet another huge source of exposure! but this is just speculation i don't know if that process happens or is possible.


#171    DieChecker

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Posted 17 July 2011 - 04:13 AM

View PostLittle Fish, on 16 July 2011 - 03:36 PM, said:

New study - fluoride consumption leads to brain damage

"The prolonged ingestion of fluoride may cause significant damage to health and particularly the nervous system," write researchers Valdez-Jiminez, et al. in their report. "Fluoride is capable of crossing the blood-brain barrier, which may cause biochemical and functional changes in the nervous system during pregnancy, since the fluoride accumulates in brain tissue before birth."

http://www.naturalne...ain_damage.html
That would be interesting, except it comes from the same Source as the articles a few posts back.

Quote

A new study published in the journal Neurologia reveals that chronic exposure to, and ingestion of, the synthetic fluoride chemicals added to water supplies can cause serious brain and neurological damage.
...
"The prolonged ingestion of fluoride may cause significant damage to health and particularly the nervous system," write researchers Valdez-Jiminez, et al. in their report.
I can't find this Neurologia magazine online, though and I find it only Quoted extensively only in reference to this one floride article.

Also I was not able to find out who "Valdez-Jiminez, et al" is. No first names, no university or corporate associations.

If anyone finds out something more, like who these guys are, or an online copy of the Actual article, not just people quoting it, please post links. Because I would like to read them.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

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#172    DieChecker

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Posted 17 July 2011 - 04:19 AM

View Postpsychoticmike, on 17 July 2011 - 02:52 AM, said:

one more thing if its in the tap water, wouldn't some of that water make its way to lakes, rivers, and oceans? if so what happens when we have fog? or humidity? could that potentially cause the fluoride to turn into a gaseous state and float through the air in that fog? if thats the case then thats yet another huge source of exposure! but this is just speculation i don't know if that process happens or is possible.
That seems possible, but to the extent that water vapor is itself measured in parts per million, you'd need to breath fog/vapor 24/7 in a rapid manner in order to equal just a single days worth of drinking tap water in a year of breathing. Same with the shower, I would suppose. Floride absorbed through the skin also would be very insignificant, as people usually are in for what... 10 to 20 minutes. With water actually resting on the person for a lot less. I'd be a lot more concerned about food.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

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Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#173    Little Fish

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Posted 17 July 2011 - 03:02 PM

View PostDieChecker, on 17 July 2011 - 04:13 AM, said:

That would be interesting, except it comes from the same Source as the articles a few posts back.

I can't find this Neurologia magazine online, though and I find it only Quoted extensively only in reference to this one floride article.

Also I was not able to find out who "Valdez-Jiminez, et al" is. No first names, no university or corporate associations.

If anyone finds out something more, like who these guys are, or an online copy of the Actual article, not just people quoting it, please post links. Because I would like to read them.
http://www.sciencedi...0003191#aff0005

Introduction
Fluoride (F) is a toxic and reactive element, and exposure to it passes almost unnoticed, with the consumption of tea, fish, meat, fruits, etcetera and articles of common use such as: toothpaste additives; dental gels, non-stick pans and razor blades as Teflon. It has also been used with the intention of reducing the dental cares.

Development
Fluoride can accumulate in the body, and it has been shown that continuous exposure to it causes damaging effects on body tissues, particularly the nervous system directly without any previous physical malformations.

Background
Several clinical and experimental studies have reported that the F induces changes in cerebral morphology and biochemistry that affect the neurological development of individuals as well as cognitive processes, such as learning and memory. F can be toxic by ingesting one part per million (ppm), and the effects they are not immediate, as they can take 20 years or more to become evident.

Conclusion
The prolonged ingestion of F may cause significant damage to health and particularly to the nervous system. Therefore, it is important to be aware of this serious problem and avoid the use of toothpaste and items that contain F, particularly in children as they are more susceptible to the toxic effects of F.

http://www.elsevier....(10)00319-1.pdf


#174    regeneratia

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Posted 17 July 2011 - 10:38 PM

As i have said before, when I went to my local government to talk about not fluoridating the tap water, I learned what the city officials position was, that the CDC oversaw what he was doing. But I found out also that he had the autonomy to lower the levels to the lowest levels possible, with very few people knowing it. He also told me that recently the price for Fluoride had doubled, so now was the time to act on it. I asked him to lower it to almost nothing, study the dental statistics due to that action, and take the risk that the CDC, already too busy to monitor every city, would not assess our levels. I left after telling him he would not hear from me again. I will not look to see if he lowered the levels. I knew that the cost of fluoridation was already a big concern for him, and with the city hurting for money, I knew that he would act in a totally responsible level.

IOW, I liked the guy and trusted him.

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#175    DieChecker

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Posted 18 July 2011 - 07:24 AM

View PostLittle Fish, on 17 July 2011 - 03:02 PM, said:

http://www.sciencedi...0003191#aff0005

Introduction
Fluoride (F) is a toxic and reactive element, and exposure to it passes almost unnoticed, with the consumption of tea, fish, meat, fruits, etcetera and articles of common use such as: toothpaste additives; dental gels, non-stick pans and razor blades as Teflon. It has also been used with the intention of reducing the dental cares.

Development
Fluoride can accumulate in the body, and it has been shown that continuous exposure to it causes damaging effects on body tissues, particularly the nervous system directly without any previous physical malformations.

Background
Several clinical and experimental studies have reported that the F induces changes in cerebral morphology and biochemistry that affect the neurological development of individuals as well as cognitive processes, such as learning and memory. F can be toxic by ingesting one part per million (ppm), and the effects they are not immediate, as they can take 20 years or more to become evident.

Conclusion
The prolonged ingestion of F may cause significant damage to health and particularly to the nervous system. Therefore, it is important to be aware of this serious problem and avoid the use of toothpaste and items that contain F, particularly in children as they are more susceptible to the toxic effects of F.

http://www.elsevier....(10)00319-1.pdf
While I admit all of that is true. It is also still true of hundreds of thousands of other chemicals, and every one has studies done under extremely controlled situations that indicate what levels are sustainably safe.

It is a matter of amount of exposure over time. Fringe literature insists that it is possibly more dangerous then is currently understood. Which I agree is possible, but unlikely. At least in my logical, partly educated (Medically) Opinion.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid. - Friedrich Nietzsche

Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#176    regeneratia

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Posted 24 July 2011 - 06:53 AM

View PostRafterman, on 14 July 2011 - 02:50 PM, said:

You're assuming that Ron Paul knows what in the hell he's talking about and isn't simply pandering to the kook fringe that support him.

How do you really know what I am assuming?
Are you psychic?

Truth is such a rare quality, a stranger so seldom met in this civilization of fraud, that it is never received freely, but must fight its way into the world
Professor Hilton Hotema
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Robert Heinlein: SECRECY IS THE HALLMARK OF TYRANNY!

#177    regeneratia

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Posted 24 July 2011 - 06:57 AM

Cant see the post I just made.

ON Coast To Coast, this very issue is being discussed tonight. With Paul Connet.

http://www2.fluoridealert.org/

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#178    psychoticmike

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 05:31 PM

Pool water may strip tooth enamel

Taking a dip in the backyard pool may cause permanent damage to teeth if chlorine and pH levels are not properly maintained.


My link



i know this isn't about fluoride but don't they use chlorine to clean water? lets say the fluoride does work in its current amount, couldn't this possibly counteract its effects?


#179    crystal sage

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 05:52 PM

View Postdanielost, on 26 February 2011 - 03:55 AM, said:

i cant believe that someone on here tried to compare a vitamin to a poison,.
  It appears that many of the synthetic vitamins.. ( which are most of them these days.. supplements of artificial vitamins included in the so called all natural ones if the are to fit the labeling laws.,.. Real vitamins vary in strength..

Quote

Animals fed synthetic vitamins had toxic reactions or died quickly of degenerative diseases compared to those fed whole foods.

Medical Research Shows Synthetic Vitamins and Nutritional Supplements Can Increase Cancer Risk
In a Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center study, 18,000 American men and women at risk of lung cancer took either a placebo or supplements of synthetic vitamin A.  The researchers, led by Dr. Gilbert Omen, stopped the study in January, 1996, because the group on nutritional supplements had a 28% higher incidence of lung cancer.  Regarding these troublesome findings, Dr. Susan Taylor Mayne of Yale University told New Scientist “I’m concerned about all of these nutrients that people go out and take in massive doses.  These nutrients have adverse effects.”  She was, of course, talking about synthetic vitamins.

Other studies show that synthetic beta carotene can block antioxidant activity and the anti-cancer activity of antioxidants (carotenoids) in the diet.

A study of 29,000 Finnish smokers proved that synthetic vitamins increased death rates significantly enough to stop a 10-year study prematurely.  To the researchers’ horror the risk of cancer increased by 16% and there were more heart attacks, more strokes, and an 8% higher increase in the overall death rate of those smokers taking the synthetic nutritional supplements.
  


http://www.healthy-v...ns-studies.html


Quote

Most mineral and vitamin brands on the market are (1) synthetic (made from oxide minerals and other substances), (2) contain harmful substances (i.e., preservatives, fillers, binders, coal tar, bitumen, gelatin, waste products), (3) cannot be digested by the human body and therefore cannot be assimilated,

Read more: http://www.dherbs.co...l#ixzz1TQIDsUE1



Quote

The fluoride added to our drinking water is not the naturally occurring calcium fluoride that is found in trace amounts in water from rivers and streams, it is in fact hydroflurosilicic acid. This is a toxic waste by product sourced from the the two Incitec Pivot organophosphate fertilizer plants in Victoria. The research relating to fluoride and dental has been done on calcium fluoride, while to my knowledge, no specific research has been done on the health effects and dental benefits of hydrofluorosilicic acid.

Unlike the fluoride used in toothpaste, hydroflurosilicic acid is not a pharmaceutical grade product. It is an unpurified, industrial grade corrosive acid which has been linked in recent studies to several adverse health outcomes. As it is an unpurified substance, trace amounts of other toxins are thought to present. As a corrosive substance it is also known to leech out heavy metals from older style pluming, adding to the environmental load we are exposed to. This is of particular concern when it comes to children, who are at greater risk of the detrimental effects of heavy metals.
   Then... too it may explain the fertility problems more and more people are experiencing these days..

http://www.fluoridation.com/sperm.htm


Quote

CONCLUSIONS: Decreased testosterone concentrations in skeletal fluorosis patients and in males drinking the same water as the patients but with no clinical manifestations of the disease compared with those of normal, healthy males living in areas nonendemic for fluorosis suggest that fluoride toxicity may cause adverse effects in the reproductive system of males living in fluorosis endemic areas.

Susheela AK, Kumar A, A Study of the Effect of High Concentrations of Fluoride on the Reproductive Organs of Male Rabbits, Using Light and Scanning Electron Microscopy, Fluoride, 1993 April, 26:2, 148 (from J. of Reproduction and Fertility, 1991, 92, 353-360).



#180    crystal sage

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 05:57 PM





Fluoride is a highly esteemed darling of the American Dental Association, yet in 2008 they strongly recommended that no fluoridated city water be used to make instant baby formula due to health effects.

   http://pul.se/Fluori...,j5CkdObxdFUE  


Quote

eleven Environmental Protection Agency employee unions representing over 7000 environmental and public health professionals called for a moratorium on drinking water fluoridation programs across the country, and have asked EPA management to recognize fluoride as posing a serious risk of causing cancer in people. (B)

Approximately, 80 US communities rejected fluoridation in 2008 & 2009 (1)

Since the professionals' statement was first issued (Aug 2007), the following occurred:

-- Water fluoride chemicals boosts lead absorption in lab animals’ bones, teeth and blood, was reported by Sawan, et al. (Toxicology 2/2010). Earlier studies already show children’s blood-lead-levels are higher in fluoridated communities, reports Sawan’s research team.

-- State University of New York researchers found more premature births in fluoridated than non-fluoridated upstate New York communities, according to a presentation made at the American Public Health Association’s annual meeting on November 9, 2009 in Philadelphia.

-- New York State Department of Health dentist J. V. Kumar published national statistics in the July 2009 Journal of the American Dental Association which show similar cavity rates regardless of water fluoride content, However, dental fluorosis rates increased along with water fluoride levels. See analysis “Fluoridation No Benefit; Definite Harm,” by Kathleen M. Thiessen, Ph.D., SENES Oak Ridge, Inc., Center for Risk Analysis here:http://www.newmediaexplorer.org/chris/Clinch_2009_No_Benefit_Definite_Harm.pdf]


Quote

Nobel Prize winner, Dr. Arvid Carlsson, says, “Fluoridation is against all principles of modern pharmacology. It's really obsolete.”

Fluoride jeopardizes health - even at low levels deliberately added to public water supplies, according to data presented in a 2006 National Academy of Sciences' (NAS) National Research Council (NRC) report. Fluoride poses risks to the thyroid gland, diabetics, kidney patients, high water drinkers and others and can severely damage children's teeth. (11) At least three panel members advise avoiding fluoridated water.

“The NRC fluoride report dramatically changed scientific understanding of fluoride's health risks," says Paul Connett, PhD, Executive Director, Fluoride Action Network. "Government officials who continue to promote fluoridation must testify under oath as to why they are ignoring the powerful evidence of harm in the NRC report,” he added.



Edited by crystal sage, 28 July 2011 - 06:09 PM.





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