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Mark 3.29 - The unforgiven


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#16    third_eye

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 09:18 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 20 February 2011 - 09:03 PM, said:

A sin is a sin...it is written... many christians will say  (and have said on here) that they do not differ

Fact is it's still a  yea but no but yea but contradiction :w00t:

Well my other sister who is a Muslim and my Muslim friends says that there are different levels of sins
there are sins that one can be atoned for by prayers or redemption and sins that is "eternal" I guess
JC just said I'll deal with them, just come to me, say my name
and more importantly, this many neglects to add, don't do them no more :lol:  


Quote

PS you seem a nice chappie...welcome to the forum  <-- the late arrival of the BM welcome express...haha

PPS I love that line - Judge not lest ye be judged  <-- and christians believe they own the right to ..........well judge :lol:

hardly a chappie here mom, thanks kindly for the welcome, better late than never, at least I got one
I'll be as nice a chappie for ye as I can :D

He who postpones the hour of living rightly ... is like the rustic who waits for the river to run out ... before he crosses.

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#17    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 09:24 PM

View Postthird_eye, on 20 February 2011 - 09:18 PM, said:

Well my other sister who is a Muslim and my Muslim friends says that there are different levels of sins
there are sins that one can be atoned for by prayers or redemption and sins that is "eternal" I guess
JC just said I'll deal with them, just come to me, say my name
and more importantly, this many neglects to add, don't do them no more :lol:  



Sin is still sin...and when jesus says ALL sins  <-- he means all of them even if you like to level them out   lol...it don't matter..........Mark 3.29 contradicts JC's words on sin and forgiviness

Quote

   hardly a chappie here mom, thanks kindly for the welcome, better late than never, at least I got one
I'll be as nice a chappie for ye as I can :D

I am late with the welcome due to the fact I went away in Nov 2010...didn't come back here until Feb this year... so you seem new to me

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#18    third_eye

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 09:52 PM

Quote

Sin is still sin...and when jesus says ALL sins <-- he means all of them even if you like to level them out lol...it don't matter..........Mark 3.29 contradicts JC's words on sin and forgiviness


I hear ya mom, Mark probably got tired of the other christians saying JC wasn't God like he said and got ... well ... furious :lol:

So he tossed in an eternal sin for blaspheme just so no one will "accuse" and "deny" anymore

Quote

I am late with the welcome due to the fact I went away in Nov 2010...didn't come back here until Feb this year... so you seem new to me

well, I'm glad we seem like old friends now ... :)

He who postpones the hour of living rightly ... is like the rustic who waits for the river to run out ... before he crosses.

Horace - Roman lyric poet & satirist 65 BC - 8 BC

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#19    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 09:59 PM

View Postthird_eye, on 20 February 2011 - 09:52 PM, said:

I hear ya mom, Mark probably got tired of the other christians saying JC wasn't God like he said and got ... well ... furious :lol:

So he tossed in an eternal sin for blaspheme just so no one will "accuse" and "deny" anymore




Hang on let me try and give my context twist to it all....

Look Mark was a lonely chap........got taken into heaven and saw a - run for saviour competition...so he enters the competition...and loses  to Jesus...

Jesus get to call the shots...poor Mark gets to write all down.............so Mark gets wind of Jesus aying - all sins can be forgiven...and he thinks  - RIGHT that does it, I am sick of him calling the shots...wellllllll  I have news for them all - BAM 3.29 is written... take that JC  cheat me out of a saviour competition will ya?

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 20 February 2011 - 10:01 PM.

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#20    third_eye

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 10:12 PM

wow ! :blink:

I think JC won that competition close to a hundred years before Mark learned to write

Some say about seventy some say over , they don't know :lol:

Don't think JC needed to cheat though since his mom Mary already got that wrapped up even before baby Jesus was born :D

*edit* dyslexia attack

Edited by third_eye, 20 February 2011 - 10:15 PM.

He who postpones the hour of living rightly ... is like the rustic who waits for the river to run out ... before he crosses.

Horace - Roman lyric poet & satirist 65 BC - 8 BC

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#21    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 10:26 PM

View Postthird_eye, on 20 February 2011 - 10:12 PM, said:

wow ! :blink:

I think JC won that competition close to a hundred years before Mark learned to write



You don't get it - They were both in heaven...and whoever won the competition got to go down fist and live as son of god ...the saviour... Mark had to wait    lol

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#22    third_eye

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 10:40 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 20 February 2011 - 10:26 PM, said:

You don't get it - They were both in heaven...and whoever won the competition got to go down fist and live as son of god ...the saviour... Mark had to wait    lol


Ahhh ... now I see ... :lol:

sorry mom ... now you know how slow I am :tu:

6.37am I'm going back to bed, got to be up by 9.30 am

I hate unemploymentism :lol:

He who postpones the hour of living rightly ... is like the rustic who waits for the river to run out ... before he crosses.

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#23    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 10:44 PM

View Postthird_eye, on 20 February 2011 - 10:40 PM, said:

Ahhh ... now I see ... :lol:

sorry mom ... now you know how slow I am :tu:

6.37am I'm going back to bed, got to be up by 9.30 am

I hate unemploymentism :lol:

I too need to be up for 8am...gotta leave the little one off to school... then drive to my granfathers funeral.( I was at his wake a few hours ago).......... its a long ole drive... then come back and get stuck into work for a few hours....take a wee poke at UM  ( if I can)...then kick the cat...later pick up Becky and the beat goes on...............lol

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 20 February 2011 - 10:44 PM.

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#24    third_eye

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Posted 21 February 2011 - 06:08 AM

that's what being mom is :)

be safe, take care , be strong :tu:

He who postpones the hour of living rightly ... is like the rustic who waits for the river to run out ... before he crosses.

Horace - Roman lyric poet & satirist 65 BC - 8 BC

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#25    Paranoid Android

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Posted 21 February 2011 - 07:22 AM

Two questions leap out, BM:

1- Where does Jesus say that ALL sins can be forgiven?  Except for Mark 3 (and the parallel account in Matthew), I don't think Jesus does.  But since both Mark 3 and its parallel in Matthew pretty much say "all sins can be forgiven except blasphemy of the Holy Spirit", I can't see how that is a contradiction - it's like me saying "all my students are going on an excursion, except for little Johnny, since he was naughty".

2- What is your understanding of "blasphemy of the Holy Spirit"?  How does one go about achieving this unpardonable feat?

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#26    Karlis

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Posted 21 February 2011 - 02:58 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 20 February 2011 - 03:04 PM, said:

Mark 3.29  - He who blasphems against the holy spirit, never has forgiviness and is guilty of eternal sin

( source...my bible.....lol)

Jesus said himself - ALL sins can be forgiven... so it looks more of a contradiction when Mark 3.29 says likewise as not all can be forgiven..............the word ALL means -> ALL ...

~~~   ... (snip for brevity and context) ...



Beckys Mom, your train of context missed out the exception to "all sins". The exception is ... what? ;)
Mar 3:28  Verily I say unto you, All sins shall be forgiven unto the sons of men, and blasphemies wherewith soever they shall blaspheme:
Mar 3:29  But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:

Beckys Mom, what do you think the word "But" in verse 29 says?


#27    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 21 February 2011 - 11:29 PM

View PostParanoid Android, on 21 February 2011 - 07:22 AM, said:

Two questions leap out, BM:

1- Where does Jesus say that ALL sins can be forgiven?  Except for Mark 3 (and the parallel account in Matthew), I don't think Jesus does.  But since both Mark 3 and its parallel in Matthew pretty much say "all sins can be forgiven except blasphemy of the Holy Spirit", I can't see how that is a contradiction - it's like me saying "all my students are going on an excursion, except for little Johnny, since he was naughty".

2- What is your understanding of "blasphemy of the Holy Spirit"?  How does one go about achieving this unpardonable feat?


But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. - John 1.7 ( my own bible)


If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. http://bible.cc/1_john/1-9.htm

There it is...it clearly says if you confess, all sins will e forgiven...  no Vicky Pollard s - yea but no but yea   lol  all means all ... so I am afraif it is a contradiction with Mark 3.29

2 - answer - Anyone who denies Jesus as god...and accuses the holy spirit of evil...( summed up)...

Reading your bible, you will recall how many jews all mocked Jesus, calling him evil and yes they did deny him as god  <--- thats the ' unforgiveable sin

If you read - John 8.52... the jews claim Jesus is pocessed... he has the devil in him....

Later Jesus is stationed on the cross.... his words where - Father forgive them, they know not what they do...and they were fogiven

That is ref to al of those that accussed him of being pocessed and they denied him as god............( actually it is worldly known that many jews did in fact deny Jesus as god)

Jesus forgave them regardless

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 21 February 2011 - 11:30 PM.

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#28    willowdreams

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Posted 21 February 2011 - 11:41 PM

I was taught that it is near impossible to blaspheme..

in order to deny the holy spirit.. you must actually be 100% absolute in KNOWING the holy spirit.. not just having 'faith', but actual knowledge..

which is also tying in with jesus saying 'they know not what they do'..

They were not really 100 thousand percent positive he was jesus.. so denying him wasnt really much.. they did not KNOW.

But to know absolute.. then deny... that is when you commit the unforgivable sin.

well, thats what I was taught

pple deny that man went to the moon, seems stupid.. but there ya go.. but then again, in their hearts they honestly do not 'know' for a fact and so seems easier to deny.

I do not believe in god.. not the god everyone talks about.. I just dont.. so is my denial.. my not believing, mean i commit blaspheme?

I just dont know that god exists, no proof has been shown me that makes me believe the god of the bible or any other holy book pple try to use for is proof.. i just dont.. ergo i am agnostic.

To have clear, absolute knowledge of something, then deny and turn your back.. thats blaspheme.

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#29    Paranoid Android

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 04:23 AM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 21 February 2011 - 11:29 PM, said:

But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. - John 1.7 ( my own bible)


If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. http://bible.cc/1_john/1-9.htm

There it is...it clearly says if you confess, all sins will e forgiven...  no Vicky Pollard s - yea but no but yea   lol  all means all ... so I am afraif it is a contradiction with Mark 3.29

2 - answer - Anyone who denies Jesus as god...and accuses the holy spirit of evil...( summed up)...
First, you have consistently said throughout this thread that it was Jesus who said all sins could be forgiven. As such I asked you to show where Jesus said this. In your quote from 1 John it's not Jesus speaking. It's still from the Bible, so I'm not denying it, I just want to clarify who said it, just so we can be accurate  in all our information and not spreading misinformation that people might falsely assume is true.

Second, your second response has given you your own answer to 1 John. It says "if we confess" to our unrighteousness, then all our sins will be forgiven. Only a follower of Jesus would go to Jesus to confess, so they clearly cannot be committing blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, so therefore that sin is irrelevant.

All sin can be forgiven. By approaching Jesus for repentance, you're already clear that you aren't blaspheming the Holy Spirit

Edited by Paranoid Android, 22 February 2011 - 04:34 AM.

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#30    Paranoid Android

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Posted 22 February 2011 - 04:31 AM

View Postwillowdreams, on 21 February 2011 - 11:41 PM, said:

I was taught that it is near impossible to blaspheme..

in order to deny the holy spirit.. you must actually be 100% absolute in KNOWING the holy spirit.. not just having 'faith', but actual knowledge..
That is one possible understanding. A person who fully knows Jesus and then knowingly says "I reject you" or "the Holy Spirit is stoopid" while still believing it to be true could be argued to have blasphemed the holy Spirit.

However, another equally possible understanding is as BM suggested- rejection of Jesus. By dying without accepting Jesus you never receive the gift of the holy Spirit and this can be argued to have blasphemed against it.

Either way, blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is not a simple thing people do every day.

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