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Fish on Friday..............Pagan Practice?


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#1    ChloeB

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 05:51 PM

I was curious about this practice by Catholics, the roots of it, are they pagan?  Friday is the day denoted sacred to the goddesss, Venus, and a book I have about symbols says eating fish on Fridays was once thought to be an aphrodisiac in anticipation of sexual rites honoring the Goddess, later copied and changed by Christians, and not to mention the connection with fish, so much you hear of the goddess, the feminine associated with water, the tides, the moon.  So just wanted to hear thoughts about this, was it copied and is this tradition practiced so many Catholics pagan inspired, and truly a celebration of the goddess?

About Friday:

The name Friday comes from the Old English Frīġedćġ, meaning the "day of Frige". The same holds for Frīatag in Old High German, Freitag in Modern German and Vrijdag in Dutch.

(*Frijjō (given as "Frigg-Frija" when referring to a hypothesis of a shared origin) is the reconstructed name or epithet of a hypothesized Common Germanic love goddess giving rise to both Frigg and Freyja.)

The expected cognate name in Old Norse would be *friggjar-dagr. However, the name of Friday in Old Norse is frjá-dagr instead, indicating a loan of the weekday names from Low German.[c] The modern Scandinavian form is Fredag in Swedish, Norwegian and Danish.

The word for Friday in most Romance languages is derived from Latin dies Veneris, "day of Venus" (a translation of Greek Aphrodites hemera)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday

Boticell's famous Birth of Venus (in a seashell coming from the sea)
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#2    Leonardo

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:14 PM

I can't say I've heard of this practice before, seems strange however.

Maybe Friday night became 'business time' with the introduction of the Mon-Fri working week? And so the connection to any pagan ritual might just be the belief in fish being an aphrodisiac?

On a side note, was Venus commonly depicted as a red-head? Any connection to the association of red-heads with witches or evil women?

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#3    danielost

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:18 PM

View PostChloeB, on 25 February 2011 - 05:51 PM, said:

I was curious about this practice by Catholics, the roots of it, are they pagan?  Friday is the day denoted sacred to the goddesss, Venus, and a book I have about symbols says eating fish on Fridays was once thought to be an aphrodisiac in anticipation of sexual rites honoring the Goddess, later copied and changed by Christians, and not to mention the connection with fish, so much you hear of the goddess, the feminine associated with water, the tides, the moon.  So just wanted to hear thoughts about this, was it copied and is this tradition practiced so many Catholics pagan inspired, and truly a celebration of the goddess?

About Friday:

The name Friday comes from the Old English Frīġedćġ, meaning the "day of Frige". The same holds for Frīatag in Old High German, Freitag in Modern German and Vrijdag in Dutch.

(*Frijjō (given as "Frigg-Frija" when referring to a hypothesis of a shared origin) is the reconstructed name or epithet of a hypothesized Common Germanic love goddess giving rise to both Frigg and Freyja.)

The expected cognate name in Old Norse would be *friggjar-dagr. However, the name of Friday in Old Norse is frjá-dagr instead, indicating a loan of the weekday names from Low German.[c] The modern Scandinavian form is Fredag in Swedish, Norwegian and Danish.

The word for Friday in most Romance languages is derived from Latin dies Veneris, "day of Venus" (a translation of Greek Aphrodites hemera)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friday

Boticell's famous Birth of Venus (in a seashell coming from the sea)
Posted Image


in part it has to due with christ said not to eat meat everyday.  but the last time i checked fish was meat.

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#4    fullywired

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:20 PM

In the first century, Jews fasted on Mondays and Thursdays. The original     Christians were all Jewish and were used to the fasting as a spiritual discipline.     They moved the fast days to Wednesdays and Fridays, because Judas engineered     Jesus' arrest on a Wednesday and Jesus was crucified on a Friday. Most often     that fast took the form of avoiding meat in the diet. In those days, meat     was a luxury food. You either had to buy it in a market or you had to own     enough land to keep cattle. On the other hand, anyone could grow vegetables     or forage for them, and anyone could catch a fish in a lake or a stream.     You could buy better fish and vegetables, but the point is that you could     eat without money if you were poor. So meat was rich people's food and fish     was poor people's food. That is why the most common form of fasting was to     omit meat and eat fish.
             http://www.kencollins.com

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#5    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:27 PM

In the primary catholic schools I ever attended, they always served us fish on a friday

I never knew it was once a pegan practie...so there ya go..I hav larned something today  lol

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#6    ChloeB

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:28 PM

View PostLeonardo, on 25 February 2011 - 07:14 PM, said:

I can't say I've heard of this practice before, seems strange however.

Maybe Friday night became 'business time' with the introduction of the Mon-Fri working week? And so the connection to any pagan ritual might just be the belief in fish being an aphrodisiac?

On a side note, was Venus commonly depicted as a red-head? Any connection to the association of red-heads with witches or evil women?

LMAO @ that video!!!  OMG, that's funny.  You've never heard of it, Leo?  I guess I shouldn't have just assumed everyone had, but okay, this is what I googled and found about the practice:  http://www.kencollins.com/question-38.htm  I was just curious, getting Mardis Gras time, about to be lent, and got me thinking about this fish on Friday thing, I'd just heard of it all my life, not a real strict thing, but where it came from really.  

I don't know about the red-head connection, I've heard things like that, bad-temperament and such.  I'll have to dig around and see what I can find.

“You've gotta dance like there's nobody watching,
Love like you'll never be hurt,
Sing like there's nobody listening,
And live like it's heaven on earth.”
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#7    eight bits

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:31 PM

Lol, Chloe. Catholics have an underlying obligation to do some form of penance every Friday, in commemoration of Jesus' death. For centuries that was meatless Fridays.Meat in that phrase means fleshmeat, land animal meat.

In the United States, except during Lent, other forms of penance may be substituted for going meatless. This has been so since 1966. (Bishops have long had prerogatives to waive observance. The day after Thanksgiving, for example, was often waived in the US before 1966).

Canons 1250-1253 cover the rules.

http://www.vatican.v...G1104/__P4O.HTM

Fish, then, are kosher, so to speak. I suppose that reflects so many of the Apostles having been in the fish biz more than pagan influence.

Fasting is a common religious practice, regardless of doctrine. Partial fasts (don't eat or drink something in particular, or during some part of the day, or ...) are an obvious variation on the underlying idea of fasting.

I don't think the pagans did this one. Of course, the day is named after the goddess, but then days of the week are like that.

-

Edited by eight bits, 25 February 2011 - 07:36 PM.

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#8    Leonardo

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:31 PM

View PostChloeB, on 25 February 2011 - 07:28 PM, said:

LMAO @ that video!!!  OMG, that's funny.  You've never heard of it, Leo?  I guess I shouldn't have just assumed everyone had, but okay, this is what I googled and found about the practice:  http://www.kencollins.com/question-38.htm  I was just curious, getting Mardis Gras time, about to be lent, and got me thinking about this fish on Friday thing, I'd just heard of it all my life, not a real strict thing, but where it came from really.  

I don't know about the red-head connection, I've heard things like that, bad-temperament and such.  I'll have to dig around and see what I can find.

Flight of the Conchords is one of my favourites!

I never knew about the whole fasting and fishies business that fullywired posted. Wonderful to learn something!!!

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#9    ChloeB

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:32 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 25 February 2011 - 07:27 PM, said:

In the primary catholic schools I ever attended, they always served us fish on a friday

I never knew it was once a pegan practie...so there ya go..I hav larned something today  lol

That's what this book I was reading said, that it was copied from a pagan practice, but I just knew it was always a common thing, but never really knew why.  I didn't know if they really had a reason for it, or just kind of another thing they incorporated back in the day to transition pagans over to Christianity, crossing over some of their practices.  My book didn't say much other than it was copied.

“You've gotta dance like there's nobody watching,
Love like you'll never be hurt,
Sing like there's nobody listening,
And live like it's heaven on earth.”
― William W. Purkey

#10    ChloeB

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:42 PM

View Posteight bits, on 25 February 2011 - 07:31 PM, said:

Lol, Chloe. Catholics have an underlying obligation to do some form of penance every Friday, in commemoration of Jesus' death. For centuries that was meatless Fridays.Meat in that phrase means fleshmeat, land animal meat.

In the United States, except during Lent, other forms of penance may be substituted for going meatless. This has been so since 1966. (Bishops have long had prerogatives to waive observance. The day after Thanksgiving, for example, was often waived in the US before 1966).

Canons 1250-1253 cover the rules.

http://www.vatican.v...G1104/__P4O.HTM

Fish, then, are kosher, so to speak. I suppose that reflects so many of the Apostles having been in the fish biz more than pagan influence.

Fasting is a common religious practice, regardless of doctrine. Partial fasts (don't eat or drink something in particular, or during some part of the day, or ...) are an obvious variation on the underlying idea of fasting.

I don't think the pagans did this one. Of course, the day is named after the goddess, but then days of the week are like that.

-

Hehe, I don't have my book right now Eighty, but this is similar to what it had:  

The link between the goddess and fish was found in various areas of the ancient world:

In Greece the Greek word "delphos" meant both fish and womb. The word is derived from the location of the ancient Oracle at Delphi who worshiped the original fish goddess, Themis. The later fish goddess, Aphrodite Salacia, was worshiped by her followers on her sacred day, Friday. They ate fish and engaged in orgies. From her name comes the English word "salacious" which means lustful or obscene. Also from her name (Aphrodite) comes the name of our fourth month, April. In later centuries, the pagan christian catholic church adsorbed this tradition by requiring the faithful to eat fish on Friday - a tradition that was only recently abandoned.

In ancient Rome Friday is called "dies veneris" or Day of Venus, the Pagan goddess of Love. The fish symbol "was so revered throughout the Roman empire that pagan Christian authorities insisted on taking it over, with extensive revision of myths to deny its earlier female-genital meanings. Sometimes the pagan christ child was portrayed inside the vesica, which was superimposed on Mary's belly and obviously represented her womb, just as in the ancient symbolism of the goddess."

In China, Great Mother Kwan-yin often portrayed in the shape of a fish.

In India, the goddess Kali was called the "fish-eyed one."

In Egypt, Isis was called the Great Fish of the Abyss.

In the Middle East, the Great goddess of Ephesus was portrayed as a woman with a fish amulet over her genitals.

In Scandinavia, the Great goddess was named Freya; fish were eaten in her honor. The 6th day of the week was named "Friday" after her.

The symbol itself, the eating of fish on Friday and the association of the symbol with deity were all taken over by the early catholic church from Pagan sources. Only the sexual component was deleted.

http://www.sabbatari...nism/Dagon.html

I don't know I was just wondering, they gave up meat, but seemed to focus on fish in particular as a substitute instead of veggie day so I was just curious.

“You've gotta dance like there's nobody watching,
Love like you'll never be hurt,
Sing like there's nobody listening,
And live like it's heaven on earth.”
― William W. Purkey

#11    eight bits

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 07:56 PM

Yeah, I hear you. There is also a lot of Christian fish symbology, and astronomical stuff as well.

I can do twenty minutes on fish as archetypal contents of the unconscious :).

But, fish is simply a convenient fleshmeat substitute. The Roman Catholic legislation never was to eat fish, just to refrain from eating fleshmeat.

Now, the pagan sources of bean burritos are a whole 'nother thing.

Happy Mardi Gras :).

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#12    ChloeB

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 08:12 PM

View Posteight bits, on 25 February 2011 - 07:56 PM, said:

Yeah, I hear you. There is also a lot of Christian fish symbology, and astronomical stuff as well.

I can do twenty minutes on fish as archetypal contents of the unconscious :).

But, fish is simply a convenient fleshmeat substitute. The Roman Catholic legislation never was to eat fish, just to refrain from eating fleshmeat.

Now, the pagan sources of bean burritos are a whole 'nother thing.

Happy Mardi Gras :).

*rushes off to search for the sacred goddess of the bean*  :P

Happy Mardi Gras, Eighty!  I might have to take you upon the fish archetypal contents of the unconscious sometime. :)

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Love like you'll never be hurt,
Sing like there's nobody listening,
And live like it's heaven on earth.”
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#13    The Silver Thong

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 08:55 PM

Great, now I want fish and chips  <_<

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#14    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 09:21 PM

View PostChloeB, on 25 February 2011 - 07:32 PM, said:

That's what this book I was reading said, that it was copied from a pagan practice, but I just knew it was always a common thing, but never really knew why.  I didn't know if they really had a reason for it, or just kind of another thing they incorporated back in the day to transition pagans over to Christianity, crossing over some of their practices.  My book didn't say much other than it was copied.

It most likely was copied from the pagan practice Chloe... I wouldn't be the slightest bit surprised if it were

All I know is - any Catholic primary school  ( primary school = elementary school)  I attended... they would only ever serve you fish on a friday

In high schools  we didn't notice.. we had more of a choice in the canteen.... I normally bought my lunch at the local swimming complex... it's were most of us went at lunch time... ( just accross the road from our school )

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 25 February 2011 - 09:22 PM.

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#15    Sherapy

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 11:24 PM

.

View Posteight bits, on 25 February 2011 - 07:31 PM, said:

Lol, Chloe. Catholics have an underlying obligation to do some form of penance every Friday, in commemoration of Jesus' death. For centuries that was meatless Fridays.Meat in that phrase means fleshmeat, land animal meat.

In the United States, except during Lent, other forms of penance may be substituted for going meatless. This has been so since 1966. (Bishops have long had prerogatives to waive observance. The day after Thanksgiving, for example, was often waived in the US before 1966).

Canons 1250-1253 cover the rules.

http://www.vatican.v...G1104/__P4O.HTM

Fish, then, are kosher, so to speak. I suppose that reflects so many of the Apostles having been in the fish biz more than pagan influence.

Fasting is a common religious practice, regardless of doctrine. Partial fasts (don't eat or drink something in particular, or during some part of the day, or ...) are an obvious variation on the underlying idea of fasting.

I don't think the pagans did this one. Of course, the day is named after the goddess, but then days of the week are like that.

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