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HAARP software: biblical targets ?


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#46    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 03:15 PM

View PostMentalcase, on 25 June 2011 - 05:49 PM, said:

Good debunking MID!

We can't deny there are effects being created that we don't hear about. Just like with any science, stuff goes wrong. More then likely though, these effects would be corrected and not associated with weather control/manipulation, etc.


"oh OK" is not a good argument nor is it "good debunking", I posted a patent for the the HAARP technology. Why is it that you can believe all other official documentation regarding this technology but not the patent itself?

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#47    Rafterman

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 04:07 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 03:15 PM, said:

"oh OK" is not a good argument nor is it "good debunking", I posted a patent for the the HAARP technology. Why is it that you can believe all other official documentation regarding this technology but not the patent itself?

No you didn't.

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#48    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 04:52 PM

View PostRafterman, on 28 June 2011 - 04:07 PM, said:

No you didn't.

Yes i did , seriously standing there plugging your ears and shouting down the truth doesn't change the truth. The patent posted is the exact same technology as HAARP. No one has denied that with other than the ever convincing "oh OK" or even better "no you didnt".

Now in that patent it clearly states that weather modification is a potential.

http://www.google.co...EBAJ&dq=4686605

http://en.wikipedia....ernard_Eastlund

http://www.eastlunds....com/HAARP.html

Now that that's resolved. When people speak of HAARP they should keep in mind that the Gakona HAARP facility isnt the only facility with this technology.

Edited by bigtroutak, 28 June 2011 - 04:56 PM.

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#49    Mentalcase

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 07:19 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 03:15 PM, said:

"oh OK" is not a good argument nor is it "good debunking", I posted a patent for the the HAARP technology. Why is it that you can believe all other official documentation regarding this technology but not the patent itself?

Show me a good argument. Where's the official statements that coincide with all these natural disasters?


Quote

According to HAARP's management, the project strives for openness and all activities are logged and publicly available. Scientists without security clearances, even foreign nationals, are routinely allowed on site. The HAARP facility regularly (once a year on most years according to the HAARP home page) hosts open houses, during which time any civilian may tour the entire facility. In addition, scientific results obtained with HAARP are routinely published in major research journals (such as Geophysical Research Letters, or Journal of Geophysical Research), written both by university scientists (American and foreign) or by US Department of Defense research lab scientists. Each summer, the HAARP holds a summer-school for visiting students, including foreign nationals, giving them an opportunity to do research with one of the world's foremost research instruments.

A patent is a patent. I want to see something which makes me believe there's some malevolence going on. Just because HAARP has been blown out of proportion by the media, doesn't give CTs any merit. Everything negative I've heard as of yet, has been purely fictional. If this tech were in the wrong hands, my view of the subject would be reversed.

Well, whatever. These types of conspiracies are filled with so much nonsense, it's next to impossible to know for sure.

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#50    ZEB

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 07:36 PM

View PostMentalcase, on 28 June 2011 - 07:19 PM, said:

Show me a good argument. Where's the official statements that coincide with all these natural disasters?




A patent is a patent. I want to see something which makes me believe there's some malevolence going on. Just because HAARP has been blown out of proportion by the media, doesn't give CTs any merit. Everything negative I've heard as of yet, has been purely fictional. If this tech were in the wrong hands, my view of the subject would be reversed.

Well, whatever. These types of conspiracies are filled with so much nonsense, it's next to impossible to know for sure.

What the Air Force and Military hold secrets from us?????  NO way  no secrets are ever kept from the sheep,,,


#51    Rafterman

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 07:40 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 04:52 PM, said:

Yes i did , seriously standing there plugging your ears and shouting down the truth doesn't change the truth. The patent posted is the exact same technology as HAARP. No one has denied that with other than the ever convincing "oh OK" or even better "no you didnt".

And continually stating and restating something that isn't at all accurate is what exactly?

Let's see what Brian Dunning has to say on the matter:

Dr. Eastlund's patent, which has since become popularly known (though inaccurately) as the "HAARP patent", is widely reproduced online, often with much commentary from authors making their own interpretations of how it might be used. Specifically, the patent involves using natural gas to generate electricity to create electromagnetic radiation to excite a tiny section of the ionosphere to about 2 electron volts, thus moving it upward along the lines of the magnetic field. The conspiracy theorists, once again, completely ignore the fact that this can only happen in the ionosphere, and they interpret it as a weather control system or earthquake generating system. Such extrapolations are without any plausible foundation.

A further disconnect in this conspiracy claim is that Dr. Eastlund's patent was for a speculative and unproven device approximately one million times as powerful as HAARP. The patent does not mention HAARP, and none of its drawings remotely resemble anything built at HAARP. For perspective, HAARP's antenna array measures about 1000 feet on a side. A device such as that imagined by Dr. Eastlund would have been 14 miles on a side, with one million antenna elements, compared to HAARP's 180. Furthermore, Dr. Eastlund left APTI to found his own company before the HAARP program began, and was never associated with the program.


Here's the full Skeptoid link:  http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4122

There's just nothing to any of this HAARP conspriracy silliness.  It's a simple research facility that is very open and very public, with hundreds of scientists, professors, and students coming and going on a yearly basis.  If this thing were as dangerous as you'd like us to believe, wouldn't it have Groom Lake or Los Alamos type security?  It doesn't.

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#52    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 07:57 PM

View PostMentalcase, on 28 June 2011 - 07:19 PM, said:

Show me a good argument. Where's the official statements that coincide with all these natural disasters?




A patent is a patent. I want to see something which makes me believe there's some malevolence going on. Just because HAARP has been blown out of proportion by the media, doesn't give CTs any merit. Everything negative I've heard as of yet, has been purely fictional. If this tech were in the wrong hands, my view of the subject would be reversed.

Well, whatever. These types of conspiracies are filled with so much nonsense, it's next to impossible to know for sure.


You state "a patent is a patent" as if dismissing the information contained therein.

I'm not trying to prove anything other than the fact that this technology has the ability, was in fact designed with the ability to modify weather and have a physical effect on terrestrial and airborne objects.

I cant understand MID and Rafterman's objection to that. Its right there in the patent

You ask for an official statement that coincides with these natural disasters but official from who, the Russians, the US or Norway? We know these three nations are operating this kind of tech, are there any more are out there that we DONT know about?

Finally I will agree that these CT's are so convoluted that the average Joe will never know the WHOLE truth.

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#53    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 08:02 PM

View PostRafterman, on 28 June 2011 - 07:40 PM, said:

And continually stating and restating something that isn't at all accurate is what exactly?

Let's see what Brian Dunning has to say on the matter:

Dr. Eastlund's patent, which has since become popularly known (though inaccurately) as the "HAARP patent", is widely reproduced online, often with much commentary from authors making their own interpretations of how it might be used. Specifically, the patent involves using natural gas to generate electricity to create electromagnetic radiation to excite a tiny section of the ionosphere to about 2 electron volts, thus moving it upward along the lines of the magnetic field. The conspiracy theorists, once again, completely ignore the fact that this can only happen in the ionosphere, and they interpret it as a weather control system or earthquake generating system. Such extrapolations are without any plausible foundation.

A further disconnect in this conspiracy claim is that Dr. Eastlund's patent was for a speculative and unproven device approximately one million times as powerful as HAARP. The patent does not mention HAARP, and none of its drawings remotely resemble anything built at HAARP. For perspective, HAARP's antenna array measures about 1000 feet on a side. A device such as that imagined by Dr. Eastlund would have been 14 miles on a side, with one million antenna elements, compared to HAARP's 180. Furthermore, Dr. Eastlund left APTI to found his own company before the HAARP program began, and was never associated with the program.


Here's the full Skeptoid link:  http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4122

There's just nothing to any of this HAARP conspriracy silliness.  It's a simple research facility that is very open and very public, with hundreds of scientists, professors, and students coming and going on a yearly basis.  If this thing were as dangerous as you'd like us to believe, wouldn't it have Groom Lake or Los Alamos type security?  It doesn't.

Good (if slightly convoluted )information, even that though still doesn't dispute the fact that the HAARP tech is based Eastlund's patent, or heck vice versa if that makes you happier - but the point stands that the tech is the same

. As for security UM ive been there and yes it does have pretty intense security, hell its location alone adds a measure of security which los alamos and groom lake dont have

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#54    Rafterman

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 08:12 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 08:02 PM, said:

Good (if slightly convoluted )information, even that though still doesn't dispute the fact that the HAARP tech is based Eastlund's patent, or heck vice versa if that makes you happier - but the point stands that the tech is the same

. As for security UM ive been there and yes it does have pretty intense security, hell its location alone adds a measure of security which los alamos and groom lake dont have

Oh please...saying the tech is the same is like saying someone made a patent for a space shuttle rocket motor and then a related company built and operated a go-kart engine.

Even when the truth is staring you right in the face you still deny it.

Um, yes, right off of a highway.  And I'm still trying to find the Groom Lake and Los Alamos webcams on their sites or when the open houses are scheduled - you know, like at HAARP.  Man that's crazy super secret!!!!

"For me, it is better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
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#55    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 08:20 PM

View PostRafterman, on 28 June 2011 - 08:12 PM, said:

Oh please...saying the tech is the same is like saying someone made a patent for a space shuttle rocket motor and then a related company built and operated a go-kart engine.

Even when the truth is staring you right in the face you still deny it.

Um, yes, right off of a highway.  And I'm still trying to find the Groom Lake and Los Alamos webcams on their sites or when the open houses are scheduled - you know, like at HAARP.  Man that's crazy super secret!!!!

So HAARP and its kin don't affect the ionosphere ? Ok thanks for educating me  :rolleyes:

To quote someone else on this forum: Even when the truth is staring you right in the face you still deny it.

And as I stated earlier Gakona is not the only place on earth with this tech.

Edited by bigtroutak, 28 June 2011 - 08:23 PM.

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#56    MID

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 09:26 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 08:20 PM, said:

So HAARP and its kin don't affect the ionosphere ? Ok thanks for educating me  :rolleyes:


iNDEED... :rolleyes:
No one here ever denied that HAARP energy excited the ionosphere  (That's what it's designed to do!).

What you failed to grasp is the idea that the Ionosphere has NO effect on weather below in the troposphere.
I trust you've learned something and will drop the CT and this nonsensical association with Eastland and HAARP (an association that has only ever come from the Eastland camp...).


Quote

To quote someone else on this forum: Even when the truth is staring you right in the face you still deny it.

We trust THEN, that you will cease the denials, put away your dearest illusions, and enjoy the process of learning.

Quote

And as I stated earlier Gakona is not the only place on earth with this tech.

Well known by those of us with an interest is that there are, and were, several HAARP-similar sites worldwide.  Not Eastland.  HAARP-like sites.
What's the point?

..rhetorical.  Don't bother.  I think this discussion has finally concluded.
You were incorrect.  There's nothing about HAARP that has any weather modification or geologic effect.  You may entertain your illusions as long as you like, but it gets boring after a while.


#57    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 09:45 PM

View PostMID, on 28 June 2011 - 09:26 PM, said:

iNDEED... :rolleyes:
No one here ever denied that HAARP energy excited the ionosphere  (That's what it's designed to do!).

What you failed to grasp is the idea that the Ionosphere has NO effect on weather below in the troposphere.
I trust you've learned something and will drop the CT and this nonsensical association with Eastland and HAARP (an association that has only ever come from the Eastland camp...).




We trust THEN, that you will cease the denials, put away your dearest illusions, and enjoy the process of learning.



Well known by those of us with an interest is that there are, and were, several HAARP-similar sites worldwide.  Not Eastland.  HAARP-like sites.
What's the point?

..rhetorical.  Don't bother.  I think this discussion has finally concluded.
You were incorrect.  There's nothing about HAARP that has any weather modification or geologic effect.  You may entertain your illusions as long as you like, but it gets boring after a while.


You are correct this conversation has run its course. *snip*

Edited by Saru, 29 June 2011 - 10:22 AM.
Edited for personal attacks

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#58    Farmer77

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Posted 28 June 2011 - 09:52 PM

View PostRafterman, on 28 June 2011 - 08:12 PM, said:

Oh please...saying the tech is the same is like saying someone made a patent for a space shuttle rocket motor and then a related company built and operated a go-kart engine.

Even when the truth is staring you right in the face you still deny it.

Um, yes, right off of a highway.  And I'm still trying to find the Groom Lake and Los Alamos webcams on their sites or when the open houses are scheduled - you know, like at HAARP.  Man that's crazy super secret!!!!


Los alamos webcam:  http://www.kob.com/a.../S1213237.shtml

HAARP webcam : http://www.haarp.ala...haarp/cam1.html

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#59    Rafterman

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Posted 29 June 2011 - 01:58 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 09:52 PM, said:


You do see the difference in the two right?

"For me, it is better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
                                                                                                                                           - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World:  Science as a Candle in the Dark

#60    Rafterman

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Posted 29 June 2011 - 02:00 PM

View Postbigtroutak, on 28 June 2011 - 08:20 PM, said:

So HAARP and its kin don't affect the ionosphere ? Ok thanks for educating me  :rolleyes:
To quote someone else on this forum: Even when the truth is staring you right in the face you still deny it.

And as I stated earlier Gakona is not the only place on earth with this tech.

Typical CT bait and switch nonsense.

"For me, it is better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring."
                                                                                                                                           - Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World:  Science as a Candle in the Dark




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