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Pim van Lommel (part one) Consciousness


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#1    markdohle

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Posted 05 June 2011 - 07:14 PM

Pim van Lommel (part one)
Consciousness Beyond Life




#2    marharthm

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:23 PM

Consciousness is just the intelligence to know you have influences around you.


#3    0011235813

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:39 PM

This means that entities that never lived could have conscious thought. Maybe demons do exist?


#4    Taut

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:43 PM

Hmmm. Well I think it's a much bigger mystery than that. I think you left out some considerations there marharthm,
No offense intended.

Edited by Taut, 06 June 2011 - 02:45 PM.


#5    digitalartist

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 04:31 PM

Consciousness after life is just an unproved concept.


#6    StarMountainKid

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 04:31 PM

So it's like a sort of generic, non-local Consciousness is floating around and attaches itself to a human brain at some point in the brain's early development, and becomes that brain's conscious personality.

After death, that consciousness, infused with that specific personality, continues to exist separate from space and time.

I'm not criticizing, this just seems to me what possibly is happening if all this is true.

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#7    Mr. Miyagi

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 04:37 PM

View PostStarMountainKid, on 06 June 2011 - 04:31 PM, said:

So it's like a sort of generic, non-local Consciousness is floating around and attaches itself to a human brain at some point in the brain's early development, and becomes that brain's conscious personality.

After death, that consciousness, infused with that specific personality, continues to exist separate from space and time.

I'm not criticizing, this just seems to me what possibly is happening if all this is true.

That's roughly the traditional Buddhist notion as well. Not believeing in the existance of a soul an all. Although after death that conciousness "attaches" itself to a new person upon birth, as the story goes until that cycle has ended.

I haven't watched the vid yet. I will as soon as I get the chance!

Edited by Mr. Miyagi, 06 June 2011 - 04:41 PM.


#8    StarMountainKid

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 06:51 PM

What's also interesting to me, as the gentleman says at the end of the video, the brain generates electro-chemical information. What entity is transforming this information into our conscious experience?

When we consciously see something, how is this visual brain-data represented in our consciousness as an image? How does our brain create light within our consciousness when there is no light in our skulls, for instance? As the gentleman says, who is seeing?

As consciousness is conscious of itself, is this consciousness-of-itself a separate entity from raw consciousness?

If consciousness is an activity of the brain as a method created by the brain to be an awareness of the brain's information, it seems to me that this would be only brain self-awareness, and would not necessarily be consciousness as we personally experience it as self. Without this consciousness-of-itself, would we experience self at all?

Perhaps this recursive consciousness-of-itself is non-local consciousness, of which the speaker in the video is talking about.

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#9    0011235813

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 08:04 PM

View PostStarMountainKid, on 06 June 2011 - 06:51 PM, said:

What's also interesting to me, as the gentleman says at the end of the video, the brain generates electro-chemical information. What entity is transforming this information into our conscious experience?

When we consciously see something, how is this visual brain-data represented in our consciousness as an image? How does our brain create light within our consciousness when there is no light in our skulls, for instance? As the gentleman says, who is seeing?

As consciousness is conscious of itself, is this consciousness-of-itself a separate entity from raw consciousness?

If consciousness is an activity of the brain as a method created by the brain to be an awareness of the brain's information, it seems to me that this would be only brain self-awareness, and would not necessarily be consciousness as we personally experience it as self. Without this consciousness-of-itself, would we experience self at all?

Perhaps this recursive consciousness-of-itself is non-local consciousness, of which the speaker in the video is talking about.
You have used the word "conscious" so many times it no longer makes sense.

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#10    StarMountainKid

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Posted 06 June 2011 - 08:09 PM

0011235813 said:

You have used the word "conscious" so many times it no longer makes sense.

Lol, I was conscious of that when I wrote that post. You just have to sort it out. I had to.  :wacko:

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#11    Khrono

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 12:00 AM

Imagine if you will a programmed virtual world. The characters within this virtual world would have a number of pre set values and possible actions indicating this characters unique existence within this world. If given millions of pre-set values and a localized form of memory for each character, these rendered beings may begin to resemble conscious individuals. However it is at this point that we must remember that a more complex , powerful , and in most programs separate A.I server exists. This A.I. server does not completely define the existence of the character in this world, the millions of presets for each character controls the calculations behind the individual. Much like our brains conduct the calculations of consciousness. However, this A.I. Server contains a copy of these calculations, and actions, and memories in order to check against the world server for inconsistencies thus maintaining position consistancy across all computers accessing this world server. Changes are made on the localized program, this data is sent to the A.I. Server who checks constancy with the world server. What if our concsiousness exists in a similar fashion? The holographic nature and the algorithmic progression of the universe already indicates a posability that we exist in a rendered environment. Maybe this too adds to that idea.


#12    StarMountainKid

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 12:44 AM

Interesting idea, Khrono. It brought to my mind Arthur C. Clarke's novel, 'The City and the Stars':

Quote

The City and the Stars takes place a billion years in the future, in the city of Diaspar.

In Diaspar, the entire city is run by the Central Computer. Not only is the city repaired by machines, but people's lives are created by the machines as well. The computer creates bodies for the people of Diaspar to live in and stores their minds in its memory when they die. At any time, only a small number of these people are actually living in Diaspar, the rest sleeping in the computer's memory banks.
http://en.wikipedia....y_and_the_Stars

We may live in some kind of rendered environment, as well. Human's quest for the ultimate reality may always be thwarted by our mind's inability to comprehend the A.I. Server, which lies external to our programmed consciousness.

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#13    Khrono

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 01:10 AM

Sounds like an interesting read, I've always rather respected Mr. Clark, I'll have o check it out!


#14    Khrono

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 01:12 AM

Sounds like an interesting read, I've always rather respected Mr. Clark, I'll have o check it out!


#15    philbo

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 11:47 PM

The whole NDE experience may be real...but as for consciousness surviving the death of the brain....bunkem.





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