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Ayatollah lays out basis for Israel attack


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#1    Erikl

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:45 PM

Quote

A website with close ties to Iran's supreme leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei has outlined why it would be acceptable to kill all Jews and annihilate Israel. Conservative site Alef has published a doctrine detailing why the destruction of the nation and the slaughter of all its people would be legally and morally justified.
SOURCE

Edited by Saru, 07 February 2012 - 07:49 PM.
Edited to remove mountain of copyrighted material

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"We live in a world where when Christians kill Muslims, it's a crusade; When Jews kill Muslims, it's a massacre; When Muslims kill Muslims, it's the weather channel. Nobody cares"

#2    keithisco

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 08:07 PM

He is just an old man with little life left. He wants to "shuffle off this mortal coil" with the God he purportedly believes in, as a Martyr or saint or whatever the Islamic equivalent of that is. Perhaps he is just looking forward to his 40 odd virgins that he has been promised. I really dont know, except that this is no threat, and giving him any kind of publicity will only inflate his enormous sense of self - importance.


#3    Erikl

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 10:04 PM

That might well be, but he's still the supreme leader of Iran. The ones who claimed Ahmadinejad has no real power in Iran and so his rants, as barbaric as they are, mean nothing, need to revise at it seems this line of genocidal nazi-like thinking runs all the way to the top.

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#4    and then

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 10:30 PM

View PostErikl, on 07 February 2012 - 10:04 PM, said:

That might well be, but he's still the supreme leader of Iran. The ones who claimed Ahmadinejad has no real power in Iran and so his rants, as barbaric as they are, mean nothing, need to revise at it seems this line of genocidal nazi-like thinking runs all the way to the top.
No, Erikl, Keithisco has probably already stated the consensus opinion you'll receive here..."it's nothing, there's no real threat".  I wonder how he'd feel if the rant was directed against,say, Brit expats in Spain?  The thing that really sickens me is that when Jews ARE killed or when Israel IS attacked the same people here who think this way will just say Israel and the Jews "had it coming" if they have the guts to be honest. <_<

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#5    DieChecker

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 04:00 AM

View PostErikl, on 07 February 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

I guess this pretty much bombshells the Iran-appologists who said that Iran simply wanted to remove Israel from its maps and text books. They admit openly that they want to wipe out the Jews in Israel.

Hopefully for both nations, this is just a lot of Talk.

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#6    Fluffybunny

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 05:02 AM

View Postand then, on 07 February 2012 - 10:30 PM, said:

No, Erikl, Keithisco has probably already stated the consensus opinion you'll receive here..."it's nothing, there's no real threat".  I wonder how he'd feel if the rant was directed against,say, Brit expats in Spain?  The thing that really sickens me is that when Jews ARE killed or when Israel IS attacked the same people here who think this way will just say Israel and the Jews "had it coming" if they have the guts to be honest. <_<
In my opinion you are not accurate on the "consensus". Perhaps that is how you see it, because not everyone agrees with you, but there are plenty of people who have a legitimate concern for israel, but simply do not wish to be pulled into another war.

More to the bottom line, people are tired of ten years of war with nothing to show for it but a mountain of debt and a lot of hurt, dead, and damaged soldiers. The US has been giving israel billions of dollars in military supplies and cash, that should allow them to have an amazing military right? Well they do have an amazing military, well trained, well equipped and ready to go in a moments notice. If they wish to start something, then that is their right. We do not need to be there to hold their hand.

It is going to take several years to get our Army back to the shape it was once in before endless tours with dwindling supplies of equipment in working order, and soldiers in healthy shape and not torn up mentally and physically by multiple tours. I have had several tours of several bases over the last few years, the condition of our equipment is frightening, and the soldiers(always ready to fight) are mentally shot from years of combat duty, something that not even their grandparents would have dreamed of in WWII when the average tour of duty on the battlefront was 90 days. Now it is close to a year, with multiple returns. We do not have a big enough military to be in perpetual war. If we really had to defend ourselves from an attack at this point, we would be in trouble.

If you really want to help, I bet Erik knows some recruiters that would be able to take you so you can be a part of this action you feel so strongly about. It would give you a chance to see war firsthand and have a better idea as to how willing you might be in the future to jump on the "Let's bomb'em Bandwagon".

Too many people on both sides of the spectrum have fallen into this mentality that a full one half of the country are the enemy for having different beliefs...in a country based on freedom of expression. It is this infighting that allows the focus to be taken away from "we the people" being able to watch, and have control over government corruption and ineptitude that is running rampant in our leadership.

People should be working towards fixing problems, not creating them.

#7    and then

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 07:51 AM

View PostFluffybunny, on 08 February 2012 - 05:02 AM, said:

In my opinion you are not accurate on the "consensus". Perhaps that is how you see it, because not everyone agrees with you, but there are plenty of people who have a legitimate concern for israel, but simply do not wish to be pulled into another war.

More to the bottom line, people are tired of ten years of war with nothing to show for it but a mountain of debt and a lot of hurt, dead, and damaged soldiers. The US has been giving israel billions of dollars in military supplies and cash, that should allow them to have an amazing military right? Well they do have an amazing military, well trained, well equipped and ready to go in a moments notice. If they wish to start something, then that is their right. We do not need to be there to hold their hand.

It is going to take several years to get our Army back to the shape it was once in before endless tours with dwindling supplies of equipment in working order, and soldiers in healthy shape and not torn up mentally and physically by multiple tours. I have had several tours of several bases over the last few years, the condition of our equipment is frightening, and the soldiers(always ready to fight) are mentally shot from years of combat duty, something that not even their grandparents would have dreamed of in WWII when the average tour of duty on the battlefront was 90 days. Now it is close to a year, with multiple returns. We do not have a big enough military to be in perpetual war. If we really had to defend ourselves from an attack at this point, we would be in trouble.

If you really want to help, I bet Erik knows some recruiters that would be able to take you so you can be a part of this action you feel so strongly about. It would give you a chance to see war firsthand and have a better idea as to how willing you might be in the future to jump on the "Let's bomb'em Bandwagon".
Kind of a "one trick pony" aren't you, guy?  Enough with the I bled and if you didn't you have no right to speak.  You have no clue who I am or what I've done and the last time I checked, this forum was open to anyone who's willing to be CIVIL.  I GET what you're saying about the military.  I AGREE with what you're saying about the military.  Maybe you should actually READ my comments thoughtfully instead of going off with the same old drivel every time.  I have no need of history lessons from you.  And NOTHING you've said in any way invalidates my opinions or changes them.  And in what way are my OPINIONS threatening to anyone, anyway?  As was pointed out to me a little earlier this day, this is a discussion forum.  So why complain to me about about a war I didn't START and you VOLUNTEERED to fight?  Just know it gets tiresome to read after awhile.

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#8    ExpandMyMind

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 11:31 AM

:huh:

Anyone else think Pseudo Intellectual has been reincarnated?

;)


#9    Wyvernkeeper

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 11:59 AM

View Postexpandmymind, on 08 February 2012 - 11:31 AM, said:

:huh:

Anyone else think Pseudo Intellectual has been reincarnated?

;)

Think I remember arguing with that guy about something, whatever happened to him>?

edit: And on the OP, hardly surprising...  The apologists seem to be quiet too...

Edited by Wyvernkeeper, 08 February 2012 - 12:05 PM.


#10    and then

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 12:28 PM

View PostWyvernkeeper, on 08 February 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

Think I remember arguing with that guy about something, whatever happened to him>?

edit: And on the OP, hardly surprising...  The apologists seem to be quiet too...
Did I miss something?  I kind of lost my temper a bit there and then the next two posts don't seem to be about the OP.  Who is/was "pseudo intellectual"?

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#11    odas

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 05:13 PM

View PostErikl, on 07 February 2012 - 10:04 PM, said:

That might well be, but he's still the supreme leader of Iran. The ones who claimed Ahmadinejad has no real power in Iran and so his rants, as barbaric as they are, mean nothing, need to revise at it seems this line of genocidal nazi-like thinking runs all the way to the top.
So you would not cooperate with genocidal nazi like thinking countries and views?


#12    Fluffybunny

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 05:32 PM

View Postand then, on 08 February 2012 - 07:51 AM, said:

Kind of a "one trick pony" aren't you, guy?  Enough with the I bled and if you didn't you have no right to speak.  You have no clue who I am or what I've done and the last time I checked, this forum was open to anyone who's willing to be CIVIL.  I GET what you're saying about the military.  I AGREE with what you're saying about the military.  Maybe you should actually READ my comments thoughtfully instead of going off with the same old drivel every time.  I have no need of history lessons from you.  And NOTHING you've said in any way invalidates my opinions or changes them.  And in what way are my OPINIONS threatening to anyone, anyway?  As was pointed out to me a little earlier this day, this is a discussion forum.  So why complain to me about about a war I didn't START and you VOLUNTEERED to fight?  Just know it gets tiresome to read after awhile.
Where did I say you had no right to speak? I did read your post thoughtfully, and I did respond in same, you seem to be reading something that I am not saying. I didn't mention myself or my military time, only speculation on how many are tired of ten years of war and how it has impacted our ability to fight, I wrote something completely different for 3 paragraphs that you seem to not even notice in response to the op, and your earlier post, Interesting.

I have a different opinion than you do, but I think "drivel" is a tad strong, but it seems interesting that you fall back on a comment like that after just a couple discussions, and brief ones at that. Hmmm. Very interesting.

Quote

Anyone else think Pseudo Intellectual has been reincarnated?
Yeah, something seems rather familiar huh? :huh:

Too many people on both sides of the spectrum have fallen into this mentality that a full one half of the country are the enemy for having different beliefs...in a country based on freedom of expression. It is this infighting that allows the focus to be taken away from "we the people" being able to watch, and have control over government corruption and ineptitude that is running rampant in our leadership.

People should be working towards fixing problems, not creating them.

#13    Q24

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:02 PM

Can anyone here translate Persian?

From what I can determine, the original article appears to specifically note the plan is the opinion of the author and not endorsed by the Iranian government.

Which would make the source headline and article entirely disingenuous.

Not that I'd be surprised coming from American right wing media.

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#14    and then

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 02:01 AM

View PostFluffybunny, on 08 February 2012 - 05:02 AM, said:

In my opinion you are not accurate on the "consensus". Perhaps that is how you see it, because not everyone agrees with you, but there are plenty of people who have a legitimate concern for israel, but simply do not wish to be pulled into another war.

More to the bottom line, people are tired of ten years of war with nothing to show for it but a mountain of debt and a lot of hurt, dead, and damaged soldiers. The US has been giving israel billions of dollars in military supplies and cash, that should allow them to have an amazing military right? Well they do have an amazing military, well trained, well equipped and ready to go in a moments notice. If they wish to start something, then that is their right. We do not need to be there to hold their hand.

It is going to take several years to get our Army back to the shape it was once in before endless tours with dwindling supplies of equipment in working order, and soldiers in healthy shape and not torn up mentally and physically by multiple tours. I have had several tours of several bases over the last few years, the condition of our equipment is frightening, and the soldiers(always ready to fight) are mentally shot from years of combat duty, something that not even their grandparents would have dreamed of in WWII when the average tour of duty on the battlefront was 90 days. Now it is close to a year, with multiple returns. We do not have a big enough military to be in perpetual war. If we really had to defend ourselves from an attack at this point, we would be in trouble.

If you really want to help, I bet Erik knows some recruiters that would be able to take you so you can be a part of this action you feel so strongly about. It would give you a chance to see war firsthand and have a better idea as to how willing you might be in the future to jump on the "Let's bomb'em Bandwagon".
Yes, I've noticed the many pro Israel posters here...
I considered the last paragraph tantamount to a taunt and the several that preceded it as a lecture.  It pissed me off and I reacted.  That doesn't often happen to me but it did in this instance.  As far as my response being "very interesting", glad you found something of value in it.  
Apparently I post in a fashion that reminds some people here of another individual.  I have enough baggage of my own without being compared to someone else but if anyone needs to make that an issue - so be it :rolleyes:

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
  for what could be, the darkest age...
“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#15    Yamato

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 04:17 AM

View PostQ24, on 08 February 2012 - 08:02 PM, said:

Can anyone here translate Persian?

From what I can determine, the original article appears to specifically note the plan is the opinion of the author and not endorsed by the Iranian government.

Which would make the source headline and article entirely disingenuous.

Not that I'd be surprised coming from American right wing media.

It's even worse than that.  We can't even get the context of many sound bytes right when translating from English to English.  The gang of liars known as the US media is already proven to butcher the meaning of rhetoric coming out of Iran in whatever way they can to sell the hapless dupes their war.

The attitude this story carries is rife with double standard as usual.  As if, Iran doesn't have a right to weapons, doesn't have a right to self-defense, doesn't have a right to attack anyone, doesn't have a right to arm other people that someone doesn't politically agree with.   We presume all of these rights for ourselves and those we politically agree with, so should they.  Everyone who really wants to squabble over this hypocritical nonsense should go get suited up and get themselves killed over it; there's some self-responsibility and a silly little conflict I would actually endorse for once.  It's always way too damned convenient when it's someone else's blood and someone else's money.

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