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No man shall see God and live?


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#16    ambelamba

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 02:43 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 02:30 AM, said:

MOYERS: Jesus did talk of bringing a sword, and I don’t believe he meant to use it against your fellow. He meant it in terms of opening the ego –I come to cut you free from the binding ego of your own self.

That is a pretty lame interpretation, IMO. I think it clear enough that the 'sword' was that which could unbind people from temporal affections of every kind, including familial.

Maybe he was just pissed when he was talking about bringing sword to this world.

They came with a Bible and their religion. stole our land, crushed our spirit, and now they tell us we should be thankful to the Lord for being saved.

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#17    Alienated Being

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 02:51 AM

God doesn't exist.


#18    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 02:53 AM

View PostRon Jeremy, on 10 February 2012 - 02:43 AM, said:

Maybe he was just pissed when he was talking about bringing sword to this world.
It was intended to convey to the masses that he was not a messianic leader intent on restoring peace to the oppressed masses under the Roman yoke via the literal sword, but an altogether different teaching to bring personal transformation via a cutting of bonds to worldly concerns.


#19    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:01 AM

View PostAlienated Being, on 10 February 2012 - 02:51 AM, said:

God doesn't exist.
Not in the dominant hemisphere of your brain, but the other side knows better !


#20    Alienated Being

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:08 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 03:01 AM, said:

Not in the dominant hemisphere of your brain, but the other side knows better !
I have yet to be presented with a shroud of evidence to make me believe otherwise.


#21    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:13 AM

View PostAlienated Being, on 10 February 2012 - 03:08 AM, said:

I have yet to be presented with a shroud of evidence to make me believe otherwise.
You don't buy the Shroud of Turin either ?  :P That makes two of us, but think of it this way, when the sun is blazing in the sky, there is no evidence from your eyes that there is a universe of stars out there, it is only when the sun disappears we see what is there, . In this case, your blazing, dominant, rational mind is the Sun.


#22    Mystic Crusader

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:28 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 02:53 AM, said:

It was intended to convey to the masses that he was not a messianic leader intent on restoring peace to the oppressed masses under the Roman yoke via the literal sword, but an altogether different teaching to bring personal transformation via a cutting of bonds to worldly concerns.

To hell with the world?

Thomas Paine wrote in The Age of Reason that “Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous execution, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be consistent that we called it the word of a demon, than the word of God."
http://www.astrology...ead.php?t=81593
http://www.astrology...&pictureid=6193

#23    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:38 AM

View PostHavocWing, on 10 February 2012 - 03:28 AM, said:

To hell with the world?
For an interval.


#24    Alienated Being

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 03:55 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 03:13 AM, said:

You don't buy the Shroud of Turin either ?  :P That makes two of us, but think of it this way, when the sun is blazing in the sky, there is no evidence from your eyes that there is a universe of stars out there, it is only when the sun disappears we see what is there, . In this case, your blazing, dominant, rational mind is the Sun.
Are you implying that the reason that I can't accept the feasibility of a God is simply because I haven't opened my eyes?


#25    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 04:00 AM

View PostAlienated Being, on 10 February 2012 - 03:55 AM, said:

Are you implying that the reason that I can't accept the feasibility of a God is simply because I haven't opened my eyes?
Not literally, but figuratively. In time, we can "see" things differently.


#26    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 04:51 AM

View PostChloeB, on 10 February 2012 - 02:42 AM, said:

Why though, what would be the point of unbinding you from temporal affections of every kind?  We talked about this before, Buddha leaving his family.  Why did they all do that?  Trying to be free of attachments, correct?  I would assume that he's talking about is the attachment to the idea of self, ego as the final one or the foundation of what all other attachments are built upon, imo.
Once again, I am not advocating anyone do this, but to have the awareness that this is really the essence of true religiosity, is knowledge well worth having. As long as you are distracted by the external, or your memories of it, you cannot "tune in" to the God-like within, because it owes nothing to the "accident" of your personal history.. But such withdrawl is difficult and dangerous, and it does require "faith" that the goal is worth the travail.

As Christ is reputed to have said, "No one who puts his hand to the plough, and looks back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
We have to rely on the reportage of the likes of Meister Eckhart, that the consummation of this work is of such gravity, that anything that happened in your previous life seems the merest nothing by comparison.


#27    ambelamba

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 05:04 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 02:53 AM, said:

It was intended to convey to the masses that he was not a messianic leader intent on restoring peace to the oppressed masses under the Roman yoke via the literal sword, but an altogether different teaching to bring personal transformation via a cutting of bonds to worldly concerns.

Eye of a beholder, man. Bible is like a kaleidoscope.

They came with a Bible and their religion. stole our land, crushed our spirit, and now they tell us we should be thankful to the Lord for being saved.

-Chief Pontiac (1718-1769)

#28    Habitat

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 05:08 AM

View PostRon Jeremy, on 10 February 2012 - 05:04 AM, said:

Eye of a beholder, man. Bible is like a kaleidoscope.
Not that ambiguous, in this instance. He was asked if he came to bring peace.....and attempted to explain that he was not that kind of messiah, of which there was no shortage in leading rebellions against Roman domination.


#29    ambelamba

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 05:19 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 05:08 AM, said:

Not that ambiguous, in this instance. He was asked if he came to bring peace.....and attempted to explain that he was not that kind of messiah, of which there was no shortage in leading rebellions against Roman domination.

You and I can see that way. But it can be still ambiguous if you try hard to interpret in a certain way. Human mind is a weird thing.

They came with a Bible and their religion. stole our land, crushed our spirit, and now they tell us we should be thankful to the Lord for being saved.

-Chief Pontiac (1718-1769)

#30    Leonardo

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 09:21 AM

View PostHabitat, on 10 February 2012 - 04:51 AM, said:

Once again, I am not advocating anyone do this, but to have the awareness that this is really the essence of true religiosity, is knowledge well worth having. As long as you are distracted by the external, or your memories of it, you cannot "tune in" to the God-like within, because it owes nothing to the "accident" of your personal history.. But such withdrawl is difficult and dangerous, and it does require "faith" that the goal is worth the travail.

As Christ is reputed to have said, "No one who puts his hand to the plough, and looks back, is fit for the kingdom of God."
We have to rely on the reportage of the likes of Meister Eckhart, that the consummation of this work is of such gravity, that anything that happened in your previous life seems the merest nothing by comparison.

Why would Jesus bother healing people of physical ailments if he was unconcerned about "the external"?

You paint a picture of a Buddha-like figure, but is purely your personal take on the whole narrative and ignores many of it's more earthly elements.

Chloe,

I suspect the admonition against looking at the face of God may have it's roots in mystic beliefs surrounding the eyes.

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