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Do atheists feel empty?


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#76    White Crane Feather

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:44 AM

View PostEuphorbia, on 02 April 2012 - 02:56 AM, said:


So, how am I misinformed? Why am I not thinking critically? What rhetoric? Materialist indoctrination? I'm sorry, you don't even know me and you make these kind of statements?
it's ok to argue respectfully... it's fun.... ;)

I'm glad you asked. That is thinking critically. Now you can intelligently show me how I'm wrong instead of ranting against the funds ( something I'm prone to myself occasionally)

You are misinformed about religion and spirituality. Spirituality does not have it's roots in fundi religions, wishful thinking, and zelotry. It has it's roots in actual experiences of people real people throughout history and it's perfectly logical to have spiritual beliefs.

Read your last post. It's very clear that you are responding emotionally not critically.

Retorich and indoctrination because I have seen nearly  your exact statements 10 dozen times. It's regurgitated over and over again and is eronius. Regurgitators like parrots  repeat what they think sounds good without any real informed analysis. It's no diffrent than the fundies that you and I are so oposed to. If you want to broaden your perspective on the issues you have to be familure with the subject material instead of just bashing it. I understand your frustration with religion. I share it, but you are falling into nearly the identical trap on the otherside of the coin.

I'm the oposite of you. I believe respect should be given then taken away where due, not withheld and given where due.

Before bashing us illogical spiritual people, you might want to take hard look into facts with an open mind. You might be surprised.

http://www.unexplain...log&blogid=3212

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-

#77    Euphorbia

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:50 AM

View PostParsip, on 02 April 2012 - 03:17 AM, said:

That's not what a proper noun is. The names of fictional characters in novels are capitalized. And imaginary places or objects are capitalized as well (e.g., Mordor, Excalibur).



I neither believe in a god nor follow a religion. Respect is earned, but refusing to follow the rules of the English language simply to offend someone is immature and indecent.

Anyhoo, I don't want to argue this any further. Spelling threads are for the Off Topic forum.

I agree with you on what a proper noun is but some rules are just made to be broken. I am not trying to offend anyone.....it's just the way I spell "god". I'm sorry if you are offended but one must allow themselves to be offended. Obviously you allow yourself.....and that is your right.

I am done with this capitalization squabble as well.

Get three coffins ready.

My mistake, four coffins.

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#78    Euphorbia

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 04:21 AM

View PostSeeker79, on 02 April 2012 - 03:44 AM, said:

it's ok to argue respectfully... it's fun.... ;)

I'm glad you asked. That is thinking critically. Now you can intelligently show me how I'm wrong instead of ranting against the funds ( something I'm prone to myself occasionally)

You are misinformed about religion and spirituality. Spirituality does not have it's roots in fundi religions, wishful thinking, and zelotry. It has it's roots in actual experiences of people real people throughout history and it's perfectly logical to have spiritual beliefs.

Read your last post. It's very clear that you are responding emotionally not critically.

Retorich and indoctrination because I have seen nearly  your exact statements 10 dozen times. It's regurgitated over and over again and is eronius. Regurgitators like parrots  repeat what they think sounds good without any real informed analysis. It's no diffrent than the fundies that you and I are so oposed to. If you want to broaden your perspective on the issues you have to be familure with the subject material instead of just bashing it. I understand your frustration with religion. I share it, but you are falling into nearly the identical trap on the otherside of the coin.

I'm the oposite of you. I believe respect should be given then taken away where due, not withheld and given where due.

Before bashing us illogical spiritual people, you might want to take hard look into facts with an open mind. You might be surprised.

http://www.unexplain...log&blogid=3212

I'm not here to argue, just to learn, give and get input from religious and spiritual people. I took a long hiatus from these forums, at least posting wise. Been lurking for the last year or so. I took time off only because nobody has been able to put into words why they believe in god or are spiritual that has made any sense to me. Everything was just going around in circles.

I agree one doesn't have to be religious to be spiritual. You are right, I don't know what it's like to be religious or spiritual. I could never be religious as I simply don't believe. I really don't understand spirituality either outside of what my brother in law says. He and I like to go backpacking above the tree line in the Sierra mountains. My brother in law is not religious but considers the high country his church. I fully understand this statement as sitting there on top of a peak looking down on the world is something to really think about. I will say though that I think some spirituality is perceived and just a placebo effect. Not saying I'm right....just that that's what I see.

I think you are having a hard time understanding the non-religious and non-spiritual people. I don't parrot what others have said. My feelings are based on a lifetime of being an Atheist. Like I said, I require tangible proof of things for them to make sense to me. So far, I have seen no proof of god and as for spirituality, to each his own.

We will have to agree to disagree on the respect issue.

For the record, I never said spiritual people are illogical......nor do I feel like I've bashed anyone....so please don't put words in my mouth!

Other than that, have a nice one!

Get three coffins ready.

My mistake, four coffins.

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#79    White Crane Feather

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 05:20 AM

View PostEuphorbia, on 02 April 2012 - 04:21 AM, said:

I'm not here to argue, just to learn, give and get input from religious and spiritual people. I took a long hiatus from these forums, at least posting wise. Been lurking for the last year or so. I took time off only because nobody has been able to put into words why they believe in god or are spiritual that has made any sense to me. Everything was just going around in circles.

I agree one doesn't have to be religious to be spiritual. You are right, I don't know what it's like to be religious or spiritual. I could never be religious as I simply don't believe. I really don't understand spirituality either outside of what my brother in law says. He and I like to go backpacking above the tree line in the Sierra mountains. My brother in law is not religious but considers the high country his church. I fully understand this statement as sitting there on top of a peak looking down on the world is something to really think about. I will say though that I think some spirituality is perceived and just a placebo effect. Not saying I'm right....just that that's what I see.

I think you are having a hard time understanding the non-religious and non-spiritual people. I don't parrot what others have said. My feelings are based on a lifetime of being an Atheist. Like I said, I require tangible proof of things for them to make sense to me. So far, I have seen no proof of god and as for spirituality, to each his own.

We will have to agree to disagree on the respect issue.

For the record, I never said spiritual people are illogical......nor do I feel like I've bashed anyone....so please don't put words in my mouth!

Other than that, have a nice one!
That's cool. I actually could be your brother in law.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-

#80    Meiliken

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 07:19 AM

I'm not an atheist, nor agnostic.  I don't talk about my belief structure because like it should be for everyone, a personal thing that is no one else's business.  That being said, I don't follow a single religion that was made by man which is all of them.  Do I feel empty?  Getting there.  My humanity is diminishing not for myself, but for mankind.  Or should I say instead of emptiness, it is more a sorrow.  Mankind is circling the drain.  When mankind relearns love and honor, then hope will be restored.  Will that be in my lifetime?  Doubtful.  Hope for the best, expect the worst.

The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshipped anything but himself
Sir Richard Francis Burton

There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the latter ignorance
Hippocrates

A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence.
David Hume

Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.
Aldous Huxley

#81    Paranoid Android

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 09:59 AM

View PostEuphorbia, on 02 April 2012 - 02:00 AM, said:

As an Atheist, I never capitalize god. Why, because a proper noun would be for something that actually exists like a persons name. I simply don't believe that your god exists! I have no reason to believe....none! Just because most of the world believes in a god doesn't make god real.
Just to clarify, if you don't believe something exists, then you don't capitalise the word.  Am I reading you correctly?  Thanks in advance :tu:

~ PA

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#82    Alienated Being

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 11:15 AM

View PostParanoid Android, on 02 April 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

Just to clarify, if you don't believe something exists, then you don't capitalise the word.  Am I reading you correctly?  Thanks in advance :tu:

~ PA
Harry Potter never existed, however, it is still appropriate to capitalize the first letter of the first name, and the last name. I, too, am confused.  :blink:


#83    Raptor

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 12:52 PM

I can see that the model of the godless universe provides many depressing truths, but I recognize that it provides many uplifting ones too. Ultimately I think it's a matter of an individual's own perspective/interpretation, which is an ever-changing thing. The most concise answer I can give is that my sense of fulfilment in life is compounded by certain beliefs that I hold but it's certainly not entirely dependent on them; as much as there are highs and lows associated with the realization of different truths, I'm always able to source a sense of satisfaction from a well cooked steak. I am an animal, after all, not a purpose-built thinking machine.

So, is the cup half full or half empty? Well, the size and shape of the cup is always changing, but I don't always need to drink from it anyway. I might get thirsty sometimes but I'm satisfied most of the time.

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 31 March 2012 - 10:22 PM, said:

If you chose to be atheist, you are not going to remain atheist if it makes you so depressed and empty  wondering about the afterlife?....  This does not make any sense ... and you make this the foundation for a thread
Question -  ................Why?

I'm sure many people are religious for this reason, but your reasoning doesn't hold true for everyone. You're speaking as though belief is fundamentally a choice, but in many cases it isn't. My beliefs are largely a function of the information available to me so I cannot necessarily change them to just suit what's convenient for me. I don't like to believe that my bank account is running low when it is and yet I must, rather than pretending that my balance is a few extra digits longer than it really is and splashing out money I don't have. Try to recall some of the inconvenient truths you've come to accept and it should be easy to see how some atheists might approach the topic of the afterlife and whatnot.


#84    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 02:26 PM

View PostRaptor, on 02 April 2012 - 12:52 PM, said:

I'm sure many people are religious for this reason, but your reasoning doesn't hold true for everyone.

First of all  I do not ever class Atheism as a religious choice...    In fact I do not class Atheism as a religion and I care not to get into a dispute over  who thinks it is or is not a religion ...

Secondly..  I did in fact note  that  there are many reasons why people take on a religion..  noted twice  in the same post..  like this below....

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 31 March 2012 - 11:20 PM, said:

Just one of the many reasons.. No point in being part of something that will make you feel like crap....You have to at least feel good about it and it has to  appeal to you...  Of course other reasons too.. but yes,  feeling better  is a good start...If it doesn't make you feel better.. wouldn't you just leave it? ...Remember I said  it is only ONE of the many reasons...


Quote

   You're speaking as though belief is fundamentally a choice              

I think not.. my post above  already shows you have this part  wrong...

Quote

My beliefs are largely a function of the information available to me so I cannot necessarily change them to just suit what's convenient for me.                

A belief in No God  is hardly something to expand on.. And what you just note in the above quote, is the same for many people.. Something I already  know about and noted ...   But  I find it odd you feel to make your lack of belief in God  out as if it is something new and  you have no choice..  Truth is you do have a choice if you really think about it...  If you think harder.. the term  - BELIEF  is  all these things stem from.. It is a matter of belief and ONLY belief.. No facts are required  in any  personal belief  or even in religions  like Christianity... It depends on what you beleive is truth...

If you can provide facts and real evidence that IE - God does not exist.. then what you therefore will hold is not a belief  or lack of  ..it will be accepted as absolute fact and we all will be able to observe it...

So yes you have a choice...  Any other little add on personal touches you might have added to your  lack of belief in God,  does not in any way  hold any real relevance, nor will it interest me.. Sorry if that sounds a bit off.. but I care only for  the term belief in God  or  lack of beliefs in God...  

Only time one does not seriously have a choice in  real religious beliefs, is when it is law to follow them  OR they are raised to and do so out of respect for their family...  Other than that  the majority will make it a choice on what appeals and makes sense to them... If it doesn't make sense, they wont follow it or take it on...

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 02 April 2012 - 02:30 PM.

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#85    Paranoid Android

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 02:50 PM

View PostAlienated Being, on 02 April 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

Harry Potter never existed, however, it is still appropriate to capitalize the first letter of the first name, and the last name. I, too, am confused.  :blink:
Indeed, but both "Harry" and "Potter" are common names given to real people, so therefore it is correct to capitalise his name.  I was thinking along the lines of mythical creatures who would not have a name if someone did not assign them a name.  Things like Nessie, Bigfoot, Chupacabra.... they are all proper nouns, and clearly do not exist.  Their names would not exist if no one had ever claimed to have seen a monster in Loch Ness or a hairy creature in some random wilderness.

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#86    Euphorbia

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:22 PM

View PostParanoid Android, on 02 April 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

Just to clarify, if you don't believe something exists, then you don't capitalise the word.  Am I reading you correctly?  Thanks in advance :tu:

~ PA

Like I stated in an earlier post, some rules are made to be broken. I don't capitalize "god" simply because that's the way I am. Not believing is a big part of my reason. I have had the religious try to force their rules on me all of my life and have even been told that I'm going to hell. My lack of religion caused a rift between my ex-wife's  family and myself. It ultimately killed my marriage.

I know that the English language has certain rules, but yes, I don't necessarily believe fictionalized creatures names should be capitalized. Is your god's name really god or is that what you just perceive him/her/it to be? At any rate, I will continue spelling it "god", no disrespect intended.

Get three coffins ready.

My mistake, four coffins.

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#87    Raptor

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:37 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 02 April 2012 - 02:26 PM, said:

If it doesn't make sense, they wont follow it or take it on...


Right. Theism makes no sense to me so I cannot adopt it. Until I discover evidence of a god, atheism is my only option. If it caused me to be depressed then I'd be out of luck.


#88    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 03:55 PM

View PostRaptor, on 02 April 2012 - 03:37 PM, said:

Right. Theism makes no sense to me so I cannot adopt it. Until I discover evidence of a god, atheism is my only option. If it caused me to be depressed then I'd be out of luck.

And I can fully understand why it makes no sense to you... It is just a belief after all ...  Facts have no place in beliefs of the supernatural.. and never will  ..that Is why they call it belief/ faith...  

I agree with you if it made you feel depressed  you would be out of luck...Same with a job role.. if you felt depressed in that job.. you would go looking for something else..

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#89    Magicjax

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 04:07 PM

wHO CARES IF THE WORD IS CAPITALIZED OR NOT? wE ALL STILL UNDERSTAND THE WORDS.  

I purposefully capitalized the wrong letters above to make my point. :)

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#90    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 02 April 2012 - 04:17 PM

View PostMagicjax, on 02 April 2012 - 04:07 PM, said:

wHO CARES IF THE WORD IS CAPITALIZED OR NOT? wE ALL STILL UNDERSTAND THE WORDS.  

I purposefully capitalized the wrong letters above to make my point. :)

What point was that?  and  typing in full CAPS  in full sentences is considered yelling...      I only type the odd few words here and there in  CAPS to lay the emphasis... just like  I bold  words and sentences..   But see even that fails for some.. my posts still get blanked out  by a few lol Posted Image

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