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a question on bible


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#1    eizal

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 07:45 AM

is there anywhere in the bible that states in detail which part of the body of jesus that was nailed when he was crusified? because i saw a documantary once where they did an experiment and concluded its imposible to be nailed at the palm of the hand coz it cant support the body. i think the documantary is about stigmata.


#2    Paranoid Android

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 08:03 AM

One example is when Thomas meets the resurrected Jesus and is sceptical, Jesus tells him to "put your finger here, and see my hands (John 20:27).  Your documentary was spot on.  From what I understand, the palm of the hand is way to fleshy to ever hold the weight of a human being on a cross.  However, crucifixion is a well-known historical fact, and whatever we may believe about Jesus, we know that criminals in Ancient Rome were routinely executed via the crucifix.  Two theories exist as to how the nails were driven in:

1- The nails might have been driven in to the palms, and then lashings of some kind used to tie the wrist to the crucifix.  In this manner, the lashings would support the weight that the palm could not.

2- The other theory is that the nails were driven in through the wrist, in between the radius and the ulna.  

A third theory (much less accepted) is that nails were put in both through the wrist AND through the palm, incorporating themes from both theories above.  Whichever happens to be right, it appears true that nails through the palms without any other support is indeed impossible.  Hope this is helpful :tu:

~ Regards, PA

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#3    eizal

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 08:31 AM

thank u for the info. so meaning, how jesus was crusified till now remains only in theory/guessing. so there is no writing in the bible or any other historical documents stating how exactly he was crusified? it just bothers me to think that jesus was a very important person but yet from the day he was born till his resurection, alot still remains a mistery.


#4    Paranoid Android

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 09:07 AM

View Posteizal, on 09 April 2012 - 08:31 AM, said:

thank u for the info. so meaning, how jesus was crusified till now remains only in theory/guessing. so there is no writing in the bible or any other historical documents stating how exactly he was crusified? it just bothers me to think that jesus was a very important person but yet from the day he was born till his resurection, alot still remains a mistery.
The Bible just says he was crucified.  It details the days in the lead-up to the crucifixion, the pain and torture he allegedly went through, and then culminates with him being nailed to a cross.  I don't see why it would be necessary for the text to say exactly how the nails went in, just that they went in.  I mean, many people were crucified in ancient times, it didn't detail how the nails went into their hands and feet.  The use of the phrase "hands and feet" in the Bible do possibly suggest nails through the palms (and therefore likely lashings around the wrist) but "hands and feet" might just be a rough statement to point out that his arms were outstretched and he was nailed to a t-shaped crucifix.  

As a Christian I don't find it too important exactly which part of the body a nail went through.  It's enough to know that he was nailed to a cross, and that he did die an extremely painful death.  Where the nail went bears no importance to that greater issue, in my opinion.

~ PA

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#5    eizal

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 11:16 AM

it is not my intention to question ure faith. its just jesus is a very important person in history. he is god to many people. my reason to ask questions about him is to know how he was raised, how did he lived and finaly how he died. to the question on how he was crusified is bcoz i want to know his pain. yes he was in pain, but to what extent was his pain. to imagine how painful to endure to such pain in a period of time. where and how the nail goes through is important to know how painful it was.


#6    and then

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 11:58 AM

If I may offer a little perspective from a personal view, last year I suffered multiple blood clots in both lungs.  I went from being able to walk for miles to only being able to walk a few feet before resting and catching my breath.  Being unable to breathe creates a horrible, panicking feeling that you cannot control.  I used to think that burning would be the worst imaginable death but now I realize that slow suffocation would be by far, worse.  And from what I understand of crucifixion it is just such slow suffocation that accompanies the excruciating pain in the flesh.  
I'm not sure why you need to understand the intricacies of His death.  Suffice that in mankind's long history of inhumanity, crucifixion is considered the worst form of execution.  Suffering in agony,barely able to breathe while people laugh at your nakedness.  The ultimate horror accompanied by humiliation.

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
  for what could be, the darkest age...

#7    Paranoid Android

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Posted 09 April 2012 - 05:53 PM

Hi eizal,

I understand you weren't questioning my faith, I did not think you were.  I've never had breathing problems, but I do agree with "and then".  Where the nail went during crucifixion isn't actually that important, in my opinion.  Suffice it to say that according to the text, he was beaten and whipped by the Jews, carried his own large piece of wooden torture device throughout town, and then after torture and blood loss nails were driven through skin (whether it was a palm or wrist, not so important) he then was raised up and left to the elements for several hours before eventually drowning in his own internal liquid (the act of crucifixion put pressure on the chest and brought suffocation and eventual drowning when the lungs filled with your own water - hence the water spilling forth from Jesus' side when the soldier put the spear through his chest).  

Of course, if you don't believe the description of the crucifixion story, that's another matter entirely.  Just from where I sit I find it hard to see how something as minor as where the nails actually went is of importance in the larger theme of Jesus' suffering.  Wrist, palm, both contributed to the pain of the cross, and as "and then" already noted, crucifixion is one of the most heinous torture methods ever designed by mankind in our bloody history.

~ Regards,

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#8    Copen

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Posted 10 April 2012 - 06:00 PM

View PostParanoid Android, on 09 April 2012 - 05:53 PM, said:

Hi eizal,

I understand you weren't questioning my faith, I did not think you were.  I've never had breathing problems, but I do agree with "and then".  Where the nail went during crucifixion isn't actually that important, in my opinion.  Suffice it to say that according to the text, he was beaten and whipped by the Jews, carried his own large piece of wooden torture device throughout town, and then after torture and blood loss nails were driven through skin (whether it was a palm or wrist, not so important) he then was raised up and left to the elements for several hours before eventually drowning in his own internal liquid (the act of crucifixion put pressure on the chest and brought suffocation and eventual drowning when the lungs filled with your own water - hence the water spilling forth from Jesus' side when the soldier put the spear through his chest).  

Of course, if you don't believe the description of the crucifixion story, that's another matter entirely.  Just from where I sit I find it hard to see how something as minor as where the nails actually went is of importance in the larger theme of Jesus' suffering.  Wrist, palm, both contributed to the pain of the cross, and as "and then" already noted, crucifixion is one of the most heinous torture methods ever designed by mankind in our bloody history.

~ Regards,

The Old Testament prophesy was that not a bone would be broken. A nail could have sliced between palm bones without breaking them. As noted, He showed the nail scars which were in the palm of his hands to Thomas. Also, the custom was to break their legs when they were taken off the cross to be sure they weren't going anywhere if there was any life left in them. When they pierced His side and were satisfied Jesus was dead, they didn't bother to brake His legs. Thus they inadvertently fulfilled OT prophesy.
God bless us all in my need and prayer





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