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Look Mama, no diamond saw

ancient workmethods

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#1    questionmark

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    Cinicus Magnus

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 11:21 AM

In view of the club of the pre-historic diamond-saw coming around trying to tell us that certain things are impossible I decided to start this thread with images, instructions and videos of how things can be done by using tools and methods available since the earliest metal age. In this post we will have splitting granite with a relatively small mallet and a dozen or so metal wedges:



All are invited to post similar evidence of "how it can't be done" here...

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#2    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 11:47 AM

Was he able to get to the precision of the the blocks in the next video?




#3    Old Man Waffles

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 11:48 AM

lol



Edited by Insightful Waffles, 03 May 2012 - 11:54 AM.


#4    questionmark

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:03 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2012 - 11:47 AM, said:

Was he able to get to the precision of the the blocks in the next video?



Ho hum:

http://annali.unife....hengsophady.pdf

Posted Image

No diamond saw either...

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#5    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:07 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 03 May 2012 - 12:03 PM, said:

Ho hum:

http://annali.unife....hengsophady.pdf

Posted Image

No diamond saw either...

Although I was far from suggesting 'aliens' did it, or that diamond cutters had been used, I'd like to see someone copy those Puma Punku stones using the tools like we see in the video and the pdf you posted.


#6    questionmark

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:10 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2012 - 12:07 PM, said:

Although I was far from suggesting 'aliens' did it, or that diamond cutters had been used, I'd like to see someone copy those Puma Punku stones using the tools like we see in the video and the pdf you posted.

Abe, even the Illinois were capable of grooving stone, though here it was unintentional:
Posted Image

They used the stone with the grove to form stone axes. Just one stone rubbing against the other with some sand and water in between. And that is from the late stone age.

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#7    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:12 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 03 May 2012 - 12:10 PM, said:

Abe, even the Illinois were capable of grooving stone, though here it was unintentional:
Posted Image

They used the stone with the grove to form stone axes. Just one stone rubbing against the other with some sand and water in between. And that is from the late stone age.

Yes, and not even remotely accurate as those Puma Punku stones.

It's the high accuracy and precison that is remarkable.


#8    cenobite

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:13 PM

Excellent post mate, we hear so much of the they couldn't have done that with the tools they had then crap, its nice to see something that vindicates my belief that good ole humanity is much more clever and resourceful than some would have us believe

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#9    questionmark

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:16 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2012 - 12:12 PM, said:

Yes, and not even remotely accurate as those Puma Punku stones.

It's the high accuracy and precison that is remarkable.

Just a question of time and dedication. And lots of discarded rocks....

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#10    Oniomancer

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:16 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 03 May 2012 - 12:10 PM, said:

Abe, even the Illinois were capable of grooving stone, though here it was unintentional:
Posted Image

They used the stone with the grove to form stone axes. Just one stone rubbing against the other with some sand and water in between. And that is from the late stone age.
That's for grinding down the bit actually, though they could've done the whole thing that way theoretically. The main shaping was by pecking and grinding, and there are people who've replicated the technique.

http://flintknapper....a stone axe.htm

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#11    questionmark

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:22 PM

View PostOniomancer, on 03 May 2012 - 12:16 PM, said:

That's for grinding down the bit actually, though they could've done the whole thing that way theoretically. The main shaping was by pecking and grinding, and there are people who've replicated the technique.

http://flintknapper....a stone axe.htm

I like that example because it shows clearly that you can use a softer rock/metal to form a harder one, most won't notice but up there they are using sandstone (Mohs ~0) to form granite (Mohs 2-7).

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#12    Abramelin

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:23 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 03 May 2012 - 12:16 PM, said:

Just a question of time and dedication. And lots of discarded rocks....

Still, I'd like to see a stone worker recreate one of those Puma Punku stones using the tools we have been shown.

Proof is in the pudding, as they say.




#13    questionmark

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:28 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 03 May 2012 - 12:23 PM, said:

Still, I'd like to see a stone worker recreate one of those Puma Punku stones using the tools we have been shown.

Proof is in the pudding, as they say.



As soon as I can lay my hands on a diorite block  I'll let you know.... But remember, glass has a hardness of 5.5 and can be easily cracked by a rubber ball with a hardness of near zero. Hardness is no measure of maleability of any material, brittleness is. And I am afraid that diorite has bad cards there.

Edited by questionmark, 03 May 2012 - 12:28 PM.

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#14    Oniomancer

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:39 PM

QM, you must've read my mind. I recently found some links on a similar theme I was going to post to the other thread when I had the time.

Regarding the earlier point about precision being a function of craftsmanship vs. time:





Notice even though he's using a steel chisel and occasionally resorts to a  power chisel, both remove material in only slightly greater amounts at a time than hitting them with a rock would do.

Edited by Oniomancer, 03 May 2012 - 12:51 PM.

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#15    Oniomancer

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Posted 03 May 2012 - 12:41 PM

As for splitting stone:



"Apparently the Lemurians drank Schlitz." - Intrepid "Real People" reporter on finding a mysterious artifact in the depths of Mount Shasta.




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