Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


* * * * * 5 votes

Oera Linda Book and the Great Flood [Part 2]


  • Please log in to reply
5930 replies to this topic

#3646    Abramelin

Abramelin

    -

  • Member
  • 18,115 posts
  • Joined:07 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:"Here the tide is ruled, by the wind, the moon and us."

  • God created the world, but the Dutch created the Netherlands

Posted 20 April 2013 - 08:16 PM

View PostNO-ID-EA, on 20 April 2013 - 07:56 PM, said:

In Tresoar page 4 , line 6 , under the letters in this line there is some colour , it looks like blue and orange , as if this line was illuminated at some time  ???


have you already discussed this , or have any explanation for it ?   the letters also seem slightly smaller in this line.....weird

Very good observation, NO !

No, we haven't discussed this, but medieval ink should not discolor like that.

+++

EDIT:

The galls contain large amounts of tannic acid, which was used for making iron gall ink and for dyeing cloth.[3][8] According to recent research, traces of iron-gall ink have been found on the Dead Sea scrolls and on the 'lost' Gospel of Judas. Iron-gall ink may have been used for 1,800 years, but it does not withstand the test of time well. Over the course of centuries, the ink fades, and discolours and damages the paper.[19] Other water-proof formulae, better suited for writing on paper, became available in the 20th century. Iron gall ink is manufactured chiefly by artists enthusiastic about reviving old methods or possibly forgers of old documents.

A recipe for preparing the ink is as follows: Take one lb. of bruised galls, one gallon of boiling water, 5½ oz of ferrous sulfate in solution, 3 oz of gum arabic previously dissolved, and a few drops of an anti-septic, such as carbolic acid. Macerate the galls for 24 hours, strain the infusion and add the other ingredients.

British galls have too little tannic acid (about 17%) for the best results - Aleppo galls have three times as much

https://en.wikipedia...ak_marble_galls

Iron gall ink (also known as iron gall nut ink or oak gall ink) is a purple-black or brown-black ink made from iron salts and tannic acids from vegetable sources. It was the standard writing and drawing ink in Europe, from about the 5th century to the 19th century, and remained in use well into the 20th century.

The ink was generally prepared by adding some iron(II) sulfate (FeSO4) to a solution of tannic acid (C6H2(OH)3COOH), but any iron ion donor (e.g. nails, iron metal scraps, etc.) can be used. The gallotannic acid was usually extracted from oak galls (also known as "oak apples"), or galls of other trees; hence the name. Fermentation or hydrolysis of the extract releases tannic acid, which yields a darker black ink.

The fermented extract was combined with the ferrous iron(II) sulfate. After filtering, the resulting pale-gray solution had a binder added to it, (most commonly gum arabic) and was used to write on paper or vellum. A well-prepared ink would gradually darken to an intense purplish black. The resulting marks would adhere firmly to the vellum or parchment, and (unlike india ink or other formulas) could not be erased by rubbing or washing. The marks could only by erased by actually scraping a thin layer off the writing surface.

By mixing tannin with iron sulfate, a water soluble ferrous tannate complex is formed. Because of its solubility, the ink is able to penetrate the paper surface, making it difficult to erase. When exposed to oxygen a ferric tannate pigment is formed. This complex is not water-soluble, contributing to its permanence as a writing ink.[1]

The gradual darkening of the ink is due to the oxidation of the iron ions from ferrous (Fe2+) to ferric (Fe3+) state by atmospheric oxygen. (For that reason, the liquid ink had to be stored in a well-stoppered bottle, and often became unusable after a time.) The ferric ions react with the tannic acid or some derived compound (possibly gallic acid or pyrogallol) to form a polymeric organometallic compound.[citation needed] The specifics of the chemistry of iron gall ink can be found at realscience.com.[2]

While a very effective ink, the formula was less than ideal. Iron gall ink is acidic ranging from roughly equivalent to a lemon (pH ˜ 2) to that of a cup of black coffee (pH ˜ 5). In chemistry, pH is a measure of the activity of the (solvated) hydrogen ion, where a lower pH level indicates a more acidic solution. For this reason some makers of iron gall ink used crushed egg shells (which contain calcium carbonate (CaCO3)) to temper the ink solution acidity, bringing it closer to a neutral pH (pH = 7) value. Depending on the writing surface being used iron gall ink can have unsightly "ghost writing" on the obverse face of the writing surface (most commonly vellum or paper.) Also any excess of ferrous ions remaining in the ink over years, decades, and centuries, could create a rusty halo around the marks and ultimately it might eat holes through the surface it was on.

Paper has its own special problems with iron gall ink. The iron-tannic pigment did not make chemical bonds with the cellulose fibers. The ink stuck firmly to the paper, but largely by mechanical bonding; namely, the dried ink penetrated the spaces between the fibers and, after drying, became entangled in them. The process of decaying the writing surface is accelerated on paper when compared to vellum, doing the damage in decades or years that could take more than a millennium on vellum.

The acidity of iron gall ink is well known but it must also be observed that the case for the acidity of iron gall ink is somewhat overstated. There are several thousands of manuscripts, some of them well over 1,000 years old, with iron gall ink on them that have no damage or degradation whatsoever from the iron gall ink. This understanding however should not be taken to ignore the potential issues of documents that use iron gall ink for the writing.

The earliest recipes on how to make oak gall ink come from Pliny the Elder and are vague at best. Many famous and important manuscripts have been written using ferrous oak gall ink including the Codex Sinaiticus the oldest most complete Bible currently known to exist thought to be written in the middle of the fourth century.[3] Due to the ease of making iron gall ink and its quality of permanence and water resistance this ink became the favored ink for scribes in the European corridor as well as around the Mediterranean Sea. Surviving manuscripts from the Middle Ages as well as the Renaisance bear this out as the vast majority are written using iron gall ink the balance being written using lamp black or carbon black inks. Laws were enacted in Great Britain and France specifying the content iron gall ink for all royal and legal records to ensure permanence in this time period as well.

The popularity of iron gall ink traveled around the world during the colonization period and beyond. The United States Postal Service had its own official recipe that was to be used in all post office branches for the use of their customers. It was not until the invention of more chemically produced inks and writing fluids in the latter half of the 20th century that iron gall ink fell out of common use.



https://en.wikipedia...i/Iron_gall_ink
http://travelingscri.../iron-gall-ink/

http://www.friesgeno...n/olbottema.htm

.

Edited by Abramelin, 20 April 2013 - 08:30 PM.


#3647    NO-ID-EA

NO-ID-EA

    Apparition

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 343 posts
  • Joined:14 Oct 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:wherever im at

Posted 20 April 2013 - 10:42 PM

Not sure it is from the ink ,,, if you look on the far right edge , near the tear , there is some orange colour , which is not near the ink  ? is it my eyes or do the letters look smaller on this line ??


#3648    The Puzzler

The Puzzler

    Forum Divinity

  • Member
  • 10,711 posts
  • Joined:23 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious. ~ Einstein

Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:57 PM

Ottema seems to find no problem with the ink.

To make the lines they used a thin piece of lead, a ruler, and a pair of compasses to mark the distances.
In old writings the ink is very black or brown; but while there has been more writing since the thirteenth century, the colour of the ink is often grey or yellowish, and sometimes quite pale, showing that it contains iron. All this affords convincing proof that the manuscript before us belongs to the middle of the thirteenth century, written with clear black letters between fine lines carefully traced with lead. The colour of the ink shows decidedly that it does not contain iron. By these evidences the date given, 1256, is satisfactorily proved, and it is impossible to assign any later date. Therefore all suspicion of modern deception vanishes.

http://www.sacred-te...l/olb/olb02.htm

Can someone give the Tresoar OLB website link please, I'm having trouble finding it.

"The agony and the irony, they're killing me"
Flagpole Sitta - Harvey Danger

#3649    The Puzzler

The Puzzler

    Forum Divinity

  • Member
  • 10,711 posts
  • Joined:23 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious. ~ Einstein

Posted 20 April 2013 - 11:59 PM

View PostKnul, on 20 April 2013 - 05:48 PM, said:

So the author of the OLB made an association between the name of Buddha and the Dutch word buidel = sack.

Yes, that could be simple enough.

"The agony and the irony, they're killing me"
Flagpole Sitta - Harvey Danger

#3650    NO-ID-EA

NO-ID-EA

    Apparition

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 343 posts
  • Joined:14 Oct 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:wherever im at

Posted 21 April 2013 - 12:23 AM

View PostThe Puzzler, on 20 April 2013 - 11:57 PM, said:


Can someone give the Tresoar OLB website link please, I'm having trouble finding it.

www.oeralindaboek.nl/boek/index.html

one good turn deserves another , could you tell me the link for the fris dictionary you mentioned the other day please puz.

Edited by NO-ID-EA, 21 April 2013 - 12:38 AM.


#3651    The Puzzler

The Puzzler

    Forum Divinity

  • Member
  • 10,711 posts
  • Joined:23 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious. ~ Einstein

Posted 21 April 2013 - 01:47 AM

View PostNO-ID-EA, on 21 April 2013 - 12:23 AM, said:

www.oeralindaboek.nl/boek/index.html

one good turn deserves another , could you tell me the link for the fris dictionary you mentioned the other day please puz.
No worries.

http://www.koeblerge...rieswbhinw.html

"The agony and the irony, they're killing me"
Flagpole Sitta - Harvey Danger

#3652    Jan Ott

Jan Ott

    Astral Projection

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 672 posts
  • Joined:07 Mar 2013
  • Location:Westfriesland

Posted 21 April 2013 - 07:06 AM

View PostAbramelin, on 20 April 2013 - 04:52 PM, said:

... the Word was God.

WR.ALDA (the very oldest) = GOD (good or perfect) + ÉVG (eternal or forever)

God = WR.ALDA = T.ANFANG (the origin or beginning) = T.BIJIN = the utter start

Posted Image "Saved from the Flood" ~ Oera-Linda studies ~ http://fryskednis.blogspot.com

#3653    Jan Ott

Jan Ott

    Astral Projection

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 672 posts
  • Joined:07 Mar 2013
  • Location:Westfriesland

Posted 21 April 2013 - 07:12 AM

View PostNO-ID-EA, on 20 April 2013 - 07:56 PM, said:

... under the letters in this line there is some colour , it looks like blue and orange ... the letters also seem slightly smaller in this line.....weird

Looks like a scanning (digital) error to me.

edit
In Jensma's book that has other photocopies, the line looks perfectly normal.

Edited by gestur, 21 April 2013 - 07:14 AM.

Posted Image "Saved from the Flood" ~ Oera-Linda studies ~ http://fryskednis.blogspot.com

#3654    Abramelin

Abramelin

    -

  • Member
  • 18,115 posts
  • Joined:07 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:"Here the tide is ruled, by the wind, the moon and us."

  • God created the world, but the Dutch created the Netherlands

Posted 21 April 2013 - 11:10 AM

View Postgestur, on 21 April 2013 - 07:06 AM, said:

WR.ALDA (the very oldest) = GOD (good or perfect) + ÉVG (eternal or forever)

God = WR.ALDA = T.ANFANG (the origin or beginning) = T.BIJIN = the utter start

View Postgestur, on 20 April 2013 - 04:32 PM, said:

"Im Anfang war das Wort" - Luther, Joh.1:1

(at the anfang was the word)

What word?

ANFANG

It was the first Wralda made, according to the creation myth.
For a Fryasborn, it would therefore be a sacred word, more than BIJIN.

View PostAbramelin, on 20 April 2013 - 04:52 PM, said:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

What word? Not beginning nor 'anfang'. '


View Postgestur, on 20 April 2013 - 04:32 PM, said:

"Im Anfang war das Wort" - Luther, Joh.1:1

(at the anfang was the word)

What word?

ANFANG

It was the first Wralda made, according to the creation myth.
For a Fryasborn, it would therefore be a sacred word, more than BIJIN.

View PostAbramelin, on 20 April 2013 - 04:52 PM, said:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

What word? Not beginning nor 'anfang'. '

Anfang a sacred word? But it is used elsewhere in the OLB for common things.


"God = WR.ALDA = T.ANFANG (the origin or beginning) = T.BIJIN = the utter start"

Why add 'utter'? If you want to stay as close as possible to the text, you should leave out 'utter'.

T BIJIN means nothing else but the Beginning. And that word, like the Dutch Begin is closest to the original.

EDIT:

For some unknown reason some quotes show up 2 times...

.

Edited by Abramelin, 21 April 2013 - 11:13 AM.


#3655    Abramelin

Abramelin

    -

  • Member
  • 18,115 posts
  • Joined:07 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:"Here the tide is ruled, by the wind, the moon and us."

  • God created the world, but the Dutch created the Netherlands

Posted 21 April 2013 - 11:27 AM

View Postgestur, on 21 April 2013 - 07:12 AM, said:

Looks like a scanning (digital) error to me.

edit
In Jensma's book that has other photocopies, the line looks perfectly normal.

Could you please upload a copy of that page? It doesn't look like some digital artefact.

Posted Image
Posted Image

.

Edited by Abramelin, 21 April 2013 - 11:28 AM.


#3656    NO-ID-EA

NO-ID-EA

    Apparition

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 343 posts
  • Joined:14 Oct 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:wherever im at

Posted 21 April 2013 - 12:43 PM

on page 2 ......and hiara ajne toghatera thruch that wle farbild fon-a wei brocht

   and our own daughters , through that V Vle(ov vile or evil ?)tradition , from (them) to we brought................so if brocht is brought.........then on page 1



thet thrittich jer aftere dei that thiv folksmoder umbrocht was thruch there vreste magy etc

the thirtieth year after the day the folsmoder was taken was through the first magy etc.

if brocht is brought , then um(un)brocht is likely to be not brought , and so taken ,.....why is it necessarily murdered ??

Edited by NO-ID-EA, 21 April 2013 - 12:44 PM.


#3657    Abramelin

Abramelin

    -

  • Member
  • 18,115 posts
  • Joined:07 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:"Here the tide is ruled, by the wind, the moon and us."

  • God created the world, but the Dutch created the Netherlands

Posted 21 April 2013 - 12:48 PM

View PostNO-ID-EA, on 21 April 2013 - 12:43 PM, said:

on page 2 ......and hiara ajne toghatera thruch that wle farbild fon-a wei brocht

   and our own daughters , through that V Vle(ov vile or evil ?)tradition , from (them) to we brought................so if brocht is brought.........then on page 1



thet thrittich jer aftere dei that thiv folksmoder umbrocht was thruch there vreste magy etc

the thirtieth year after the day the folsmoder was taken was through the first magy etc.

if brocht is brought , then um(un)brocht is likely to be not brought , and so taken ,.....why is it necessarily murdered ??

Because that is what it means : Frisian: ombrocht, Dutch: om(ge)bracht,...killed, murdered.

+++

EDIT:

VVLE = vuile = dirty

.

Edited by Abramelin, 21 April 2013 - 12:51 PM.


#3658    NO-ID-EA

NO-ID-EA

    Apparition

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 343 posts
  • Joined:14 Oct 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:wherever im at

Posted 21 April 2013 - 01:00 PM

Thats a pretty good answer then...............i was just thinking that she then talks about the people over the wr-sara making people their slaves , and so that is why wr-alda has let them be made slaves ,and thought it might mean she was taken as a slave .


so was it the Magiara that were being used as slaves , and they rebelled against the people on the other side of the river because of it . ???thats what it sounds like to me .

Edited by NO-ID-EA, 21 April 2013 - 01:02 PM.


#3659    The Puzzler

The Puzzler

    Forum Divinity

  • Member
  • 10,711 posts
  • Joined:23 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious. ~ Einstein

Posted 21 April 2013 - 01:22 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 21 April 2013 - 11:10 AM, said:

Anfang a sacred word? But it is used elsewhere in the OLB for common things.


"God = WR.ALDA = T.ANFANG (the origin or beginning) = T.BIJIN = the utter start"

Why add 'utter'? If you want to stay as close as possible to the text, you should leave out 'utter'.

T BIJIN means nothing else but the Beginning. And that word, like the Dutch Begin is closest to the original.

EDIT:

For some unknown reason some quotes show up 2 times...

.

"Wralda is the origin or beginning."

Seems so simple.

"The agony and the irony, they're killing me"
Flagpole Sitta - Harvey Danger

#3660    The Puzzler

The Puzzler

    Forum Divinity

  • Member
  • 10,711 posts
  • Joined:23 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Australia

  • I have no special talent. I am only passionately curious. ~ Einstein

Posted 21 April 2013 - 01:26 PM

As I said a few posts back I now don't think Atland has to be in India in the heart of Findasland.

This is why many people don't have it there.

The heart of Findasland is the Himalayas.
The Finns come from Aldland.
No where can I find anything that Aldland is in the heart of Findasland.

"The agony and the irony, they're killing me"
Flagpole Sitta - Harvey Danger




3 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 3 guests, 0 anonymous users