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Widen the goal in the search for alien life

charley lineweaver alien

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#1    Still Waters

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 01:28 PM

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We need to cast off our biological blinkers in the search for life beyond Earth and turn to physics, says cosmologist Charley Lineweaver

What's wrong with the definition of "life"?
Almost everything. For a start, we don't really have one. When you ask a biologist, "Are viruses alive?", half of them will say yes, and half will say no. We don't want a terrestrial-life-only definition. We want one that could apply elsewhere in the universe. This is important because NASA is trying to build an instrument to detect life elsewhere.

http://www.newscient...alien-life.html

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#2    nephilim12

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 02:21 PM

The real challenge and scare is in proving or disproving that extra-terrestrial life might just have landed here on our world thousands of years back, as evident from strikingly similar depictions in cave paintings, stone sculptures found all over the world.
The depiction of saucer shaped flying craft and helmeted beings looking just like modern day astronauts are very thought provoking and leaves even the most convinced of skeptics at a loss for words and fumbling for a suitable explanation.
Paintings down the ages also depict saucer shaped flying craft.
Many have mused on either side, 'am i wrong?'
The answer to that is elusive given what most cite as merely circumstantial and dismiss them as hallucinatory products of a collective conscience. Not improbable, considering the wheel appeared almost at the same time across many civilizations.
But looking at these cave paintings, I for one am fearful for what we could be facing.

The wider search for ET life is definitely a feeble official presentation for those who want to hear what they want to hear. That's as far as it gets.

Whereas they already know and are convinced that out of every 100 reported sightings, some are hoaxes by dumb pranksters, some are weather phenomena, some are misrepresentations for some sick reason, but NOT ALL ARE FALSE. That last part is wrapped up tighter than a lead casing of plutonium.

But given the fact that 95% of people think and react alike, imagine the chaos that will follow if the real UFO public sightings are accepted by ANY government.

NO. There has not been any real form of aggression demonstrated so far by these UFOs that will have far reaching consequences on human life and trade and commerce.
So, keep it under wraps, and give 'em what they wanna hear. 'THERE ARE NO SUCH THINGS AS UFOs.'

*snipped duplicate post*

Edited by libstaK, 27 May 2012 - 02:26 PM.
duplicated post.


#3    Ryu

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 03:04 PM

I am not sure it is wise to take cave paintings and carvings literally.

Think about some of the animals explorers had encountered, like the whale. Some of these sailors/explorers seen whales spouting mist and the subsequent drawings made these creatures look like something from a mythology book.

What I am getting at is that IF there were aliens that landed here, is it not possible that those who seen them were so scared their accounts of the sightings became rather...exaggerated?

However I do have to agree that when we try to search for alien life, we are trying to find things that look just like Earth's life forms. Other planets that may have life on them may have different atmospheric compositions and thus life will have evolved in order to adapt to those conditions.
I mean, look at our own planet, we have found undersea life living, quite happily, right around volcanic vents that spew out scalding hot and often acidic water or finding pockets of condensed salt water that is so concentrated, heavy and caustic that it forms its own pools under the ocean surface. On top of that there is a whole community of sea creatures living in it just as readily as fish swimming among the coral reefs would.

I do think that in order for any progress to be made, we need more rationality and level headedness instead of freaking out, so to speak, and making assumptions rather than studying it.

I don't see aliens as these glowing beings that ooze love and light nor do I see them as naked, savage beasts that want to kill everything. Maybe most are similar to us in that they are explorers and such.


#4    Mr Right Wing

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 03:22 PM

View PostRyu, on 27 May 2012 - 03:04 PM, said:

I am not sure it is wise to take cave paintings and carvings literally.

Think about some of the animals explorers had encountered, like the whale. Some of these sailors/explorers seen whales spouting mist and the subsequent drawings made these creatures look like something from a mythology book.

What I am getting at is that IF there were aliens that landed here, is it not possible that those who seen them were so scared their accounts of the sightings became rather...exaggerated?

However I do have to agree that when we try to search for alien life, we are trying to find things that look just like Earth's life forms. Other planets that may have life on them may have different atmospheric compositions and thus life will have evolved in order to adapt to those conditions.
I mean, look at our own planet, we have found undersea life living, quite happily, right around volcanic vents that spew out scalding hot and often acidic water or finding pockets of condensed salt water that is so concentrated, heavy and caustic that it forms its own pools under the ocean surface. On top of that there is a whole community of sea creatures living in it just as readily as fish swimming among the coral reefs would.

I do think that in order for any progress to be made, we need more rationality and level headedness instead of freaking out, so to speak, and making assumptions rather than studying it.

I don't see aliens as these glowing beings that ooze love and light nor do I see them as naked, savage beasts that want to kill everything. Maybe most are similar to us in that they are explorers and such.

Millions of alien civilizations will be aware of our existance.

They will have been able to detect life on our planet for billions of years and will have monitored its development. They will know we are here and what the technological level of our civilization is.

When the time is right they will make contact with us and I suspect that will be Judgement Day.


#5    Ryu

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 03:31 PM

View PostMr Right Wing, on 27 May 2012 - 03:22 PM, said:

When the time is right they will make contact with us and I suspect that will be Judgement Day.

I do not think it will be "judgement day". Why would it? Of all the imagined millions of civilizations out there, I do not see how or why ours is so "special" that it ever deserved any particular attention.


#6    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 04:24 PM

I've jist noticed this chap's name is Charley Lineweaver. I'd like to nominate that for Name of the Week.

:D

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#7    TheMcGuffin

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 04:32 PM

I wouldn't make the assumpton that life in an alien environment would have genes, cells, DNA, mitosis, meoisis or anything else like that.  For all we know, those are just unique to life on earth, but we have no (publicly confirmed) examples of life from anywhere else.

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#8    hooko22

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 04:38 PM

I think they might also already be here yet we might just be unable to detect their presence. They might be here merely to study us and observe our soceity, who knows perhaps they don't see us as advanced enough to varant contacting us. They might see us as mere monkeys to study!

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#9    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 04:38 PM

View PostMr Right Wing, on 27 May 2012 - 03:22 PM, said:

Millions of alien civilizations will be aware of our existance.

They will have been able to detect life on our planet for billions of years and will have monitored its development. They will know we are here and what the technological level of our civilization is.

When the time is right they will make contact with us and I suspect that will be Judgement Day.
This sounds rather like what I was talking about here..

View Post747400, on 25 May 2012 - 08:20 PM, said:

I do find it interesting how the opinions of the views that ETs (whoever they may be) would take of us seem to fall under one of two stools* : either they'd be (a) Ascended Beings who live in Peace and Harmony and all the rest of that rather boring way of life that's attributed to them, wear white robes and have slightly unfashionably long blond hair, and go around being generally beatific, and so would either want to Help Mankind and ask absolutely nothing of us in return, or alternatively would keep miles away from us because we're so irremedeemably primitive and war-like; or
( b ) they themselves would be a horrifically rapacious and completely conscience-free race who would exploit us to serve their Sinister ends, and having used us, they would not hesitate to throw us away like a used fast food wrapper. A subsidiary theory that sort of combines both of these is that they'd pursue the theory of pre-emptive self defense, and would wipe us out with an antimatter bomb before we could spread our warlike and aggressive ways to he rest of the civilised galaxy.
Why would the ETs want to sit in judgement upon us? Why should we assume that we're that important? isn't it rather egotistical to assume that we're such a warlike and aggressive race [which is what people often say] that they'd want to wip us out before we could spread our warlike aggression to the Galaxy - that we're that important?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#10    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 27 May 2012 - 04:38 PM

View PostMr Right Wing, on 27 May 2012 - 03:22 PM, said:

Millions of alien civilizations will be aware of our existance.

They will have been able to detect life on our planet for billions of years and will have monitored its development. They will know we are here and what the technological level of our civilization is.

When the time is right they will make contact with us and I suspect that will be Judgement Day.
This sounds rather like what I was talking about here..

View Post747400, on 25 May 2012 - 08:20 PM, said:

I do find it interesting how the opinions of the views that ETs (whoever they may be) would take of us seem to fall under one of two stools* : either they'd be (a) Ascended Beings who live in Peace and Harmony and all the rest of that rather boring way of life that's attributed to them, wear white robes and have slightly unfashionably long blond hair, and go around being generally beatific, and so would either want to Help Mankind and ask absolutely nothing of us in return, or alternatively would keep miles away from us because we're so irremedeemably primitive and war-like; or
( b ) they themselves would be a horrifically rapacious and completely conscience-free race who would exploit us to serve their Sinister ends, and having used us, they would not hesitate to throw us away like a used fast food wrapper. A subsidiary theory that sort of combines both of these is that they'd pursue the theory of pre-emptive self defense, and would wipe us out with an antimatter bomb before we could spread our warlike and aggressive ways to he rest of the civilised galaxy.
Why would the ETs want to sit in judgement upon us? Why should we assume that we're that important? isn't it rather egotistical to assume that we're such a warlike and aggressive race [which is what people often say] that they'd want to wip us out before we could spread our warlike aggression to the Galaxy - that we're that important?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#11    Bella-Angelique

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Posted 28 May 2012 - 07:46 PM

View PostRyu, on 27 May 2012 - 03:31 PM, said:

I do not think it will be "judgement day". Why would it? Of all the imagined millions of civilizations out there, I do not see how or why ours is so "special" that it ever deserved any particular attention.

Like with nations here on earth today, unless you wish to be totally isolated, travel and trade makes you a part of other nations through sharing culture, disease, animal life, and science knowledge through that which travels. I imagine that in space, as below so above, and the more contacts that are made the more the need for a commonly shared law exists.

Edited by Bella-Angelique, 28 May 2012 - 07:47 PM.

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#12    ThickasaBrick

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Posted 28 May 2012 - 10:25 PM

Looking at the way the universe works it could be very possible that humans are the most advanced species in our galaxy. Took numerous generations of stars to create enough rocky material to form planets, and earth was created soon after. At best, an alien civilization would be a few hundred million years ahead. That is assuming that there were no extinction events. Our solar system is located in the outer reaches of our galaxy, likely the last place that a civilization would look for a habitable world. I am positive that Earth has not been visited for billions of years.


#13    Zaphod222

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 02:49 AM

If aliens have any intelligence, they surely would not want to mingle with us.


#14    cjr3285

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Posted 29 May 2012 - 09:53 PM

I love how Hollywood makes us believe ET will attack us.  If they wanted our resources and our planet they would have done the deed a long time ago?  Also, if they wanted us as slaves why not enslave us before industry and advancements in military technology?  If ET is watching and waiting for First Contact, they are probably waiting for humans as a people to be united worldwide before anything else.  That is a ways away.


#15    DONTEATUS

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Posted 30 May 2012 - 01:30 AM

View Postcjr3285, on 29 May 2012 - 09:53 PM, said:

I love how Hollywood makes us believe ET will attack us.  If they wanted our resources and our planet they would have done the deed a long time ago?  Also, if they wanted us as slaves why not enslave us before industry and advancements in military technology?  If ET is watching and waiting for First Contact, they are probably waiting for humans as a people to be united worldwide before anything else.  That is a ways away.

Welcome cjr3285  ! Good idea there,and mostlikely Were either First on the menu or were too far out to even go for drive thru !
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