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Tantalising Testimony


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#4666    synchronomy

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 06:09 AM

View PostWearer of Hats, on 04 December 2012 - 05:20 AM, said:

Or, as one member here suggests, the aliens like left-handed people - is there a higher population of lefties in the US?
There's quite a few lefties in the US apparently...cause Obama just got re-elected!
Actually, he's left-handed too.

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This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan

#4667    Norbert Dentressangle

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:06 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 03 December 2012 - 09:49 PM, said:

So do I, at least for most of them. It's just a question of relying on so many people his only evidence is based on accounts given under hypnosis. We know that UFOs are real, but why there was a sudden explosion in "abduction" accounts in the 1980s and 1990s is a different story. I think that most of that was media-driven.
I've often thought that the form that UFOs take at any period is probably driven by cultural expectations and what's in vogue at the time- tall human-like Aliens in shiny suits in the 1950s, small and sinsiter goblinj-like creatures ithe the 1980s and 90s - like as the descriptions of UFOs also change- in the 1950s they were Buck Rogers style saucers with antennae and portholes, and now they tend to be more like super-advanced versions of Terrestrial aircraft. So I suspect that what people report is based on what their expectations are at any given time. I think it all comes down to how people's minds interpret something that's completely outside their normal experience. What they're seeing is real, but how their mind interprets it depends upon what they'd expect what they're seeing to look like.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#4668    Norbert Dentressangle

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:07 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 04 December 2012 - 06:09 AM, said:

There's quite a few lefties in the US apparently...cause Obama just got re-elected!
Actually, he's left-handed too.
Well, he is an ET. As well as being a Marxist Islamic Atheist.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#4669    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 08:11 AM

View Post747400, on 04 December 2012 - 08:06 AM, said:

I've often thought that the form that UFOs take at any period is probably driven by cultural expectations and what's in vogue at the time- tall human-like Aliens in shiny suits in the 1950s, small and sinsiter goblinj-like creatures ithe the 1980s and 90s - like as the descriptions of UFOs also change- in the 1950s they were Buck Rogers style saucers with antennae and portholes, and now they tend to be more like super-advanced versions of Terrestrial aircraft. So I suspect that what people report is based on what their expectations are at any given time. I think it all comes down to how people's minds interpret something that's completely outside their normal experience. What they're seeing is real, but how their mind interprets it depends upon what they'd expect what they're seeing to look like.


There's a lot of truth to that, since if you look at the UFO/alien reports from ancient and medieval times, those were always interpreted according to the culture and religion of the time.


#4670    psyche101

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 01:48 PM

View Post747400, on 03 December 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

Again, as happens all the time, this is assessing things by our technology. Given how rapidly technolology is developing here, I really don't think it need be utterly incredible that some race which surely you'd agree must be technologically much more advacned would have attained a much more advanced level of AI than we have so far? And that's assuming that they must be robotic devices; what if they're some kind of hybrid biological/technological device? A device with a biological Brain?

Not really. The Alien Planet extrapolation assumed advanced technology to what we have now. As I mentioned, computers cannot even subtract, why do you think this is possible? As far as I know quantum computing will be the ultimate, simultaneous responses, it is Sci Fi coming to life, but still not capapble of "Intelligence".


Now again, assuming your scenario, and the biological brain might be something more workable in this scenario I grant - if not with a truckload of poetic license ;) , if that is indeed possible, why would it avoid us? And do you suspect this has been happening for a long time, or do you think  maybe a "Wave" every now and then as probes cross this path? And do you think the reports we have indicate one species, or many?

I believe these aspects all are important in the big picture. And considering we are indeed speculating, heavens forbid ;) then any question is valid is it not?

View Post747400, on 03 December 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

This is putting a remarkable amount of faith in eyewitness reports;

I was not thinking of people, but what is documented. Is this not the aspect that kept some of the Blue Book cases in that unexplained category? Whilst I agree exaggerated in nature and in number, they are heavily promoted as a "mysterious component" However for the sake of debate, I am willing to exclude such accounts featuring "Aliens" as flights of fantasy if you feel that is a fair evaluation?

View Post747400, on 03 December 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

I hope Zoser would be pleased. :P

Ohh, wash your mouth out with soap!!!

View Post747400, on 03 December 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

Doesn't such a wide range suggest that it's more likely that it's virtually impossible to estimate the size of something with any accuracy, if you have no idea of how it might be away, for example?

Quite possible, but in some cases such as Portage County the proximity is much too close for the estimate to be drastically incorrect. But again, it is this intriguing smattering, most of which seems quite removed from itself that catches interest in the first place. Would you propose that claims of a certain nature are singled out?

View Post747400, on 03 December 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

At Roswell, they were not added in until much later;  There was no mention of any such thing in the initial reports, was there; bandwagon jumping again.

Not really, you did say notable and or familiar cases, of which Roswell is both. But if going into Roswell in any depth, again, by no accounts was any tech recovered. If it was a ship it was made out  of unbreakable bendy metal that broke and was made out of stuff that looks just like stuff we make  balloon trains out of.
I am sure far more sound examples exist ;) Even for the point of speculation.

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#4671    zoser

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 07:22 PM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 03 December 2012 - 09:35 PM, said:

These were the aliens that didn't talk at all, even though he tried to communicate with them.  According to Travis, there was another one wearing some kind of spacesuit who led him out of the "landing bay" of them ship and down some corridors where he met these two.  This was after he had just been wandering around on his own.  They did not seem particularly hostile or friendly, but just seemed more interested in calming him down.  Whatever they did to him, he went unconscious again and they left him by the side of the road.


Now if I wanted to put on my "skeptical" hat for a minute, I would point out the old UFO television series from 1970 also had human-looking aliens who needed to steal human bodies and body parts to stay alive.  These aliens could not speak either.  They looked like us but they could not talk.

So a supporter of the psych-social hypothesis would probably say that Travis was influenced by this old TV show.  


I respect what your saying MacG but for me I would separate accuracy from the actual happening.

It's possible that as far as detail is concerned it did not quite happen the way that it did.  There is no direct evidence, but I'm open to the possibility.  That something mysterious happened that night cannot be open to doubt, since we have multiple testimony and a police investigation.  

Just to add that in.  It's tempting to throw out the baby with the bath water which in the case of the Travis Walton Case is very difficult to do.

The Peter Khoury case is also difficult to dismiss because of the trace evidence.

Edited by zoser, 04 December 2012 - 07:22 PM.

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#4672    psyche101

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:11 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 03 December 2012 - 10:59 AM, said:

Now here's a weird one, a case from a group of amateur astronomers. (Who says they don't see UFOs?)  It was so strange that even seasoned UFO investigators didn't know what to make of it--UFOs circling the Moon and Saturn--or appearing to do so, I should say.  

They seemed to be putting on a show for them, just another of those "here we are" things.  Did they know they were being observed?  I often think that must be the case.

Michael Swords called these "alignment cases", when the UFOs seem aware of being observed and put on a display.


http://docs.google.c...KMZFGtO7XSNWFlw


http://www.cufos.org/swords2.pdf


Very interesting, thank you for the link. I am not sure what they saw, but the second trip around that passed by the moon sounds like it could possibly be a body on a very wide orbit that has managed to hit just the right angle to get tangled in the orbits briefly. But these guys are good! They state



Quote

It seemed similar to an airplane in a size (it did grow larger in the 7×50 binoculars used, though not greatly so), and the amateur astronomers judged it to be probably around normal aircraft altitude

7x50 binoculars?

Mate, that's quite a feat. I suspect Saturn would be more like a yellowish ball, maybe Titan would be spotted with some luck, but an aircraft? That's hard to believe. How they made out the craft and the rings is truly nothing short of amazing with that equipment. 7x50's are excellent beginners equipment, and a good idea to keep around, as their best use would be looking at the moon. Saturn is quite an ask from 7x50's. I reckon you at least want 100's.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#4673    psyche101

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:16 AM

View PostMatt Vinyl, on 03 December 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

Thanks Psyche!

No worries Matt

Credit where credit is due mate.

View PostMatt Vinyl, on 03 December 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

Looking back at it sober, I was dreading what I had written - but no, it's exactly how I recall that day, way back at school. :)

And it's a great analogy. Our life experiences often give us lasting impressions and help shape us.

View PostMatt Vinyl, on 03 December 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

PS: I don't get drunk all the time, but when I do - I should refrain from connecting to the internet. ;)

I dont know, you did OK I reckon :D

Nothing wrong with a tipple. I am rather partial to a Canadian Club myself. ;)

View PostMatt Vinyl, on 03 December 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

That's a very interesting outlook - one which you could say is playing itself out infront of us. (Reminds me a bit of the science vs bible 'answers' debate - but that's for another thread (in the 'Religion' forum.)) ;)

I find it both comforting and fascinating. It's a very good definition of the Universe I think.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#4674    psyche101

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:17 AM

View Postzoser, on 03 December 2012 - 08:25 PM, said:

LOL :blush:

I have wondered if all ET's have gender.  The type that met Travis Walton did.  The female obviously had no need for a sports bra:

Posted Image



Good reason to drop the sports bra.

Lets face it. Sex sells.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#4675    psyche101

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:24 AM

View Post747400, on 03 December 2012 - 07:01 PM, said:

Oh yes, but they'd have to have the fuses set before they dropped them, and that would only be done at the very last minute. Just flying round with one in the bomb bay, it wouldn't be set, so the most that would happen (in theory) would be that the Detonator would go off. Which did happen, as I recall, on at least one occasion, and made a pretty big hole itself.

Indeed, in 1950 a plane crashed with 34 nuclear devices and detonators abord. All detonators and devices were recovered successfully. The detonator was removed from little boy as a precaution, and then re-installed en route.

A sensible safety precaution that has indeed paid of.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#4676    psyche101

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:30 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 03 December 2012 - 08:54 PM, said:

I always found abduction cases, well, questionable.
This one is bizarre to say the least!

Ever seen the TV special ?My Mum Talks To Aliens"?

I have left a link here a few times, let me know if you want it. It's a very interesting show on a lady who follows abductee cases and tries to say they are genuine. Aussie show. (hence the spelling)

Dead set, one of the "featured" abductees appears and it seems little doubt that he is a wet dreamer. It's a bit stomach turning to hear him describe his fantasy encounter.

She also felt confident to take on a University lecturer. The man tore her argument to pieces. She looked pretty bad at the debate. Her son follows her and is a skeptic, but supports dear old Mum best he can. I thought he was a champ. Top fella standing by Mum like that when it is rather obvious that he constantly has to wear kid gloves around her.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#4677    psyche101

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 04:34 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 04 December 2012 - 06:09 AM, said:

There's quite a few lefties in the US apparently...cause Obama just got re-elected!
Actually, he's left-handed too.

Posted Image

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#4678    zoser

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 06:35 PM

Interesting object; no information other than the youtube title.  Fresno CA Nov 2012:



Posted Image


#4679    zoser

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 07:02 PM

Here is a clip that interests me.  Taken in California this year.  The witness below claims to have seen it a day earlier than this footage was taken:



  • Cypressparkboxing 8 months ago

    Thats the problem in fact this uploader did not take this picture, I did see this though with my own eyes but it was on March 11th not on the 14th. it was east of Los angeles started as 2 orbs then multiplied to about a dozen, multiplied again to about 2 dozen by the time it was finished you had about four dozen orbs then it went into formation it was the trippiest **** I have ever witnessed

    Reply·Posted ImagePosted Imagein reply to Back2Facts(Show the comment)

  • Cypressparkboxing 8 months ago

    I saw this in the sky on March 11th on a Sunday, in Los Angeles


Edited by zoser, 06 December 2012 - 07:03 PM.

Posted Image


#4680    zoser

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 07:41 PM

Here's another intriguing clip.  Taken over Missouri.  The best part begins at 1:15 - 1:38.



Posted Image





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