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The United Nations Wants Your Guns America

gun control un united nations arms trade treaty arms treaty

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#211    Myles

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Posted 22 July 2012 - 07:04 PM

View PostFLOMBIE, on 22 July 2012 - 11:30 AM, said:

Guns are given away for free now in the States? I didn't know about that...

You can get other things for protection. You don't really need a gun. Things like pepper spray might actually be much more effective in a lot of scenarios.



That's a dumb thing to say.   A .22 is much cheaper than a dog.   A dog takes much more time and effort as well.   I have a small dog.   I don't want another dog.   A gun is a much more effective tool for keeping raccoons and ground hogs under control.  It's either shoot them in the trap or drop the trap in a barrel full of water.   Shooting them is much more humane.


#212    FLOMBIE

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 11:07 AM

View PostMyles, on 22 July 2012 - 07:04 PM, said:

That's a dumb thing to say.   A .22 is much cheaper than a dog.   A dog takes much more time and effort as well.   I have a small dog.   I don't want another dog.   A gun is a much more effective tool for keeping raccoons and ground hogs under control.  It's either shoot them in the trap or drop the trap in a barrel full of water.   Shooting them is much more humane.
The only "dumb" thing to say was you arguing against a dog with it costing money. Guns do cost money as well, and time. You spend money on the ammo, you need to clean and reassamble it regularly, and if you want to be a good schooter, you need to practice shooting targets in several distances as well. Both take time and effort.

But hey, I never told you to get a dog. And now you just keep it for shooting raccoons? I actually do not see the humanity in shooting anything. But I understand if it has to be done, and you prefer it over smacking the head or drowning them: It's messy and takes longer. But you could use a sling shot, those designed to kill rats. They'd do the work just fine.

You can put it any way you want. Nobody really needs a gun, and if he does, he is able to acquire a permit.


#213    FLOMBIE

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 11:22 AM

View Postpreacherman76, on 22 July 2012 - 02:31 PM, said:

But it is always true. Especialy when it comes to the second amendment. Sure you will have situations where people prove themselfs not responcible enough to handle such freedoms. And for such people those freedoms are removed. But we dont have to look to far back to see how a lack of such freedoms could be far worse. Just take Americans from Japan during WW2 who were hauled off to consentration camps, right here on American soil. Elect the wrong leader, and homosexuals might find them selfs in the same situation. Or Christians, or muslims, ect ect ect. To have a means to protect yourself from a potencialy tyrannical government is the very foundation to a trully free and open society. Especialy today. We have a government who has litteraly created a war on terror. Told us we were all in danger cause of men on the other side of the world in caves that want us all dead cause we are free. Then over the course of 11 years, we watched as it went from men in caves on the other side of the world, to them telling us to watch our neighbors. If we see something say something. We are all now subjected to molestation just to get on a plane. Somehow, suddenly WE became the terrorists. In thier own documents every single person in this country is a potencial terrorist. So much so that our government, directly against the constitution, is somehow allowed to kidnap a American, on American soil, lock them up and throw away the key, with no due process at all.
Was the 2nd ammendment not affective for the Japanese Americans during WWII?

Keeping a gun because you might have to overcome your government really is paranoid, sorry. Do you think you would stand any chance against today's military? They are not using muskets like 250 years ago. They whip their carbines, tanks and choppers out, and a few armed civilians with a .22, a shotgun, and a MAC10 will be dealt with in minutes. It sounds very romantic, yes, but the military is simply too advanced, sorry.

And what makes you so special now anyways? You government always acted like this. Remember the communists, the hippies? Those were rough times, too. Yet nobody thought that would be reason enough to "fight back".
If you are not happy with how it is in the States right now, I advise you to become politically active and try to change something. You live in a democracy, after all. Or do you prefer waiting for a fight that will never happen? Don't be paranoid, if it really bugs you, form a movement and fight will be possible.

Edited by FLOMBIE, 23 July 2012 - 12:07 PM.


#214    Myles

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 11:49 AM

View PostFLOMBIE, on 23 July 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

The only "dumb" thing to say was you arguing against a dog with it costing money. Guns do cost money as well, and time. You spend money on the ammo, you need to clean and reassamble it regularly, and if you want to be a good schooter, you need to practice shooting targets in several distances as well. Both take time and effort.

But hey, I never told you to get a dog. And now you just keep it for shooting raccoons? I actually do not see the humanity in shooting anything. But I understand if it has to be done, and you prefer it over smacking the head or drowning them: It's messy and takes longer. But you could use a sling shot, those designed to kill rats. They'd do the work just fine.

You can put it any way you want. Nobody really needs a gun, and if he does, he is able to acquire a permit.

A slingshot for killing raccoons?    Now you are just being silly.
Also, a gun and ammo is not nearly the cost of the type of dog that would be needed to protect my chickens.

I have no problem with having to get a permit for certain types of guns.


#215    FLOMBIE

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 12:00 PM

View PostMyles, on 23 July 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

A slingshot for killing raccoons? Now you are just being silly.
Posted Image
This will kill any raccoon you want.

View PostMyles, on 23 July 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

Also, a gun and ammo is not nearly the cost of the type of dog that would be needed to protect my chickens.

It really depends on the gun, the dog, where you get the dog from, and how you feed your dog. You could feed it with raccoons. :P

View PostMyles, on 23 July 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

I have no problem with having to get a permit for certain types of guns.

You see, that is what I am talking about (EDIT: But for all guns, actually. Why differentiate? They all make holes). Guns are not forbidden here, they are just harder to get!

Edited by FLOMBIE, 23 July 2012 - 12:02 PM.


#216    ZaraKitty

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 12:34 PM

View PostFLOMBIE, on 23 July 2012 - 12:00 PM, said:

Posted Image
This will kill any raccoon you want.



It really depends on the gun, the dog, where you get the dog from, and how you feed your dog. You could feed it with raccoons. :P



You see, that is what I am talking about (EDIT: But for all guns, actually. Why differentiate? They all make holes). Guns are not forbidden here, they are just harder to get!

Yup, Dad uses them things to kill feral cats around the house. Pretty damn effective.

The internet is a series of tubes, and those tubes are full of cats.

#217    Myles

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 12:42 PM

View PostFLOMBIE, on 23 July 2012 - 12:00 PM, said:

Posted Image
This will kill any raccoon you want.



It really depends on the gun, the dog, where you get the dog from, and how you feed your dog. You could feed it with raccoons. :P



You see, that is what I am talking about (EDIT: But for all guns, actually. Why differentiate? They all make holes). Guns are not forbidden here, they are just harder to get!

That slingshot would take many shots to finally kill a coon.   It would be a very cuel way to kill an animal.    When a coon is in a cage, they do not stay still.   To kill them instantly, you need to shoot them just right.  The first couple I did, I shot them between the eyes.   It then took me 3-5 shots to kill them.   I don't like them to suffer.   I then learned that you have to shoot them right in the back of the head at an upward angle.   That kills them instantly.   You also need to shoot throught the cage "trap".  

That's funny, feeding the raccoons to the dog. :clap:   I like the idea of using it for all you can.
Unfortunately raccoons carry disease.  That's why I cannot just trap them and drop them off in some woods somewhere else.  It's not right to spread the disease around or to just make them someone else's problem.


#218    FLOMBIE

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 12:56 PM

I assume Zara's dad's feral cats stay perfectly still? From one or two meters away they are lethal.

But anyway, A raccoon plague might be reason enough to obtain a small bolt action rifle over here. But if you shoot them, smack their heads hard enough, use poison or a slingshot does not make any difference to me. Farmers are able to deal with predators here, too. And most of them are not armed.


#219    ZaraKitty

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 01:15 PM

Feral cats are bigger and meanier then coons. But dad is a mean man, if they don't die via the slingshot.. well. Awful things happen.

The internet is a series of tubes, and those tubes are full of cats.

#220    ZaraKitty

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 01:16 PM

Where he hunts anyway, biggest feral was the size of a punching bag. took three arrows to the skull to take it down, and even then he had to lop of it's head.

The internet is a series of tubes, and those tubes are full of cats.

#221    FLOMBIE

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 01:37 PM

sound like he gets the job done!


#222    Myles

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 02:14 PM

Much easier to just shoot them.  


#223    FLOMBIE

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 02:17 PM

It is, yes, but are you really claiming a constitutional right to own a gun because you want to shoot raccoons? Come on, that doesn't make any sense.


#224    Michelle

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 02:18 PM

[

View PostZaraKitty, on 23 July 2012 - 01:16 PM, said:

Where he hunts anyway, biggest feral was the size of a punching bag. took three arrows to the skull to take it down, and even then he had to lop of it's head.

How cruel!

Do you mean to tell me that a slingshot can kill a cat when three arrows to the skull wouldn't take one down?


#225    protostar

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Posted 23 July 2012 - 02:20 PM

Myles, I've no experience with racoons, but if you are dispatching vermin at very close range then have you considered an air rifle? I would think that a .22 pellet would do the job up close with no risk of a ricochet from a bullet.I know a few pest control people who use them. Maybe a coons skull is too hard though idk.





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