348 replies to this topic

[Aus Der Box Skeptisch]

Wearer of Hats, on 21 July 2012 - 04:45 AM, said:

having a gun in that situation would have resulted in a single thing ... you dead.

At least I would have died trying to save others including women and children. I would have died proud of myself.

[QuiteContrary]

Wearer of Hats, on 21 July 2012 - 04:45 AM, said:

having a gun in that situation would have resulted in a single thing ... you dead.

While the thought of a mostly armed citizenry at the bank and grocery and picking up their kids at school is frightening to me. I do not agree with your blanket statement.

Edited by QuiteContrary, 21 July 2012 - 05:35 AM.

[Kafkaesque]

Spid3rCyd3, on 20 July 2012 - 11:04 PM, said:

The timing of this event, especially after the failure of Fast and Furious seems extreemely coincidental to me. Not to mention the UN small arms treaty signing at the end of the month. The timing is almost too perfect.

My thoughts exactly - my first thoughts, actually..

But I do not know for sure - but I was still willing to ask the questions..

And now, as I expected, debates about guns are amassed! The media certainly is doing what I thought it would do..

Granted, after an incident like this it's hard to not talk about the topic.

In the upcoming election it will be a topic..

I semi-respect Obama for sidestepping his political event to speak about the whole tragedy...

[Mr Right Wing]

Purifier, on 21 July 2012 - 04:02 AM, said:

Is there any way to put restrictions on the materials for making homemade bombs, like pipe bombs, sticky bombs, that can kill far more people than automatic weapons? Won't make a damn if you put more restrictions on automatic weapons when the ability to make those kind of bombs are a lot easier for psychopaths, terrorists and criminals to blow people up with; especially in a theatre.

I'm all for gun control but we need to do something about the bombs and the ability to make those bombs first. It's too easy to make those damn things these days, versus getting automatic weapons.

In the UK all this stuff is banned. While it makes getting hold of a gun or making a bomb harder it doesnt remove the desire to kill. What you find is they get knives, samurai swords, axes and other weapons instead. Last year the US had more crazed gunmen than the rest of the world put together several times over. When its at those levels it can no longer be brushed off as crazed lunatics because it indicates a problem with US society.

In countries like Russia they censor magazines, television programs and pop music which singles out sections of the population for mistreatment. How many times do people turn on an American television program to discover bright kids being portrayed as unpopular geeks? In the US there is a blatent disregard for how this impacts the lives of their brightest or anybody else that stands out from the crowd.

If their lives get ruined as a result of the mistreatment then they snap and become crazed gunmen.

[Clyde the Glyde]

Mr Right Wing, on 20 July 2012 - 10:11 PM, said:

Last month it happened nearly every day.

Maybe our Sky News reports more than CNN

The last one here would have been the Virginia Tech shooting. And the one before that was way back in 1999. ( Columbine )

Mass shootings are very very rare here.

[Cradle of Fish]

Aus Der Box Skeptisch, on 21 July 2012 - 04:54 AM, said:

At least I would have died trying to save others including women and children. I would have died proud of myself.

Don't need a gun to do that.

[Mr Right Wing]

Clyde the Glyde, on 21 July 2012 - 11:17 AM, said:

The last one here would have been the Virginia Tech shooting. And the one before that was way back in 1999. ( Columbine )

Mass shootings are very very rare here.

Batman shooting, Oikas University shooting, Chardon High School shooting are three prominant ones I remember from this year alone. A few months back Sky News was reporting nearly 1 every day.

Maybe you only know about the ones that get put on the front of US papers?

Edited by Mr Right Wing, 21 July 2012 - 11:43 AM.

[ThePhantomFlanFlinger]

Mr Right Wing, on 21 July 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

In the UK all this stuff is banned. While it makes getting hold of a gun or making a bomb harder it doesnt remove the desire to kill. What you find is they get knives, samurai swords, axes and other weapons instead. Last year the US had more crazed gunmen than the rest of the world put together several times over. When its at those levels it can no longer be brushed off as crazed lunatics because it indicates a problem with US society.

In countries like Russia they censor magazines, television programs and pop music which singles out sections of the population for mistreatment. How many times do people turn on an American television program to discover bright kids being portrayed as unpopular geeks? In the US there is a blatent disregard for how this impacts the lives of their brightest or anybody else that stands out from the crowd.

If their lives get ruined as a result of the mistreatment then they snap and become crazed gunmen.

You should really stop preaching how different the UK is to the US...its becoming daft now.

[ThePhantomFlanFlinger]

Mr Right Wing, on 21 July 2012 - 11:41 AM, said:

Batman shooting, Oikas University shooting, Chardon High School shooting are three prominant ones I remember from this year alone. A few months back Sky News was reporting nearly 1 every day.

Maybe you only know about the ones that get put on the front of US papers?

Have you seen the size difference between the UK and the US..?..levy it out and no doubt the figures will be similar.

[Babe Ruth]

Good questions posed Drayno!

Yes, it seems highly likely that some sort of "gun control" laws will now be introduced.  They will be as futile as the other gun control laws on the books, because the law cannot predict how crazy humans will act.

At the heart of the matter is whether or not the government can protect us from crazy humans.  I say it cannot.

If one operates on the assumption that the government CAN protect us from crazies, we are in for a rude awakening.

[Socio]

Wearer of Hats, on 21 July 2012 - 04:45 AM, said:

having a gun in that situation would have resulted in a single thing ... you dead.

Just the opposite;

http://theacru.org/a...nterproductive/

Quote

The study, which just appeared in Volume 30, Number 2 of the Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy (pp. 649-694), set out to answer the question in its title: "Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide? A Review of International and Some Domestic Evidence." Contrary to conventional wisdom, and the sniffs of our more sophisticated and generally anti-gun counterparts across the pond, the answer is "no." And not just no, as in there is no correlation between gun ownership and violent crime, but an emphatic no, showing a negative correlation: as gun ownership increases, murder and suicide decreases.

The scumbags that go on shooting sprees are by every definition cowards, they pick targets based on their vulnerability and that are the least risk to them.

If the audience was armed, then he wouldn't have bothered to even enter the theater.

Edited by Socio, 21 July 2012 - 04:00 PM.

[skookum]

You don't have to ban guns out right, I have no idea why the Americans think it is the only option which is unpopular at best.

You stop people from having them that do not a a genuine sporting reason.  Make people prove they do by making sure they are members of gun clubs etc.  Don't let people buy them who have violent criminal records.  Then gradually and it would take decades remove the non-sporting weapons off the street.

I have owned firearms in the UK, when I gave up shooting as a sport I gave up my guns.

I don't need a firearm for protection as the chances of me being attacked either inside or outside my home by a gun is very slim.  You will never stop every type of these crimes, however you can reduce the chance.

[Toadie]

Walking around with a gun does not mean you will survive an awful situation

[skookum]

Toadie, on 21 July 2012 - 04:26 PM, said:

Walking around with a gun does not mean you will survive an awful situation

Quite often makes the situation worse.

[Toadie]

Seriously who wants to walk around with a gun 24/7 with the intention of being able to shoot anyone who may or may not threaten your survival. That sounds healthy