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[Merged] Gobekli Tepe


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#286    Abramelin

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 02:45 PM

View PostMacroramphosis, on 07 October 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

It's interesting to wonder whether we jump to conclusions, sometimes. If, for example, we had discovered these pillars in north America, we would be calling them stone totem poles, most likely devoid of religious significance, but instead depicting a vertical pictogram of tribal or cultural history, and most likely used and associated with rituals and ceremonies. And the vultures would probably be interpreted in the same way as eagles atop "real" wooden totem poles are. It also seems the culture in Anatolia at this time were just as keen as carving out all the different animals around them as the Native Indians were.

However, assuming that the site was used for religious purposes, I'm wondering whether the pillars supported a wooden pillar for the laying out of bodies - a pillar that could have been removed (and the wood used for other purposes) when the site was buried ? I'd put money on the reason for the burial, as against destruction of the site, was simple too - the culture was moving on, spiritually and religiously, but out of respect for the "old", they refrained from destruction and interred the site as a form of preservation. I suspect therefore that even after "burial", the site maintained a great deal of significance for many years and continued to be visited by generations of people. I'd very much doubt 100% of the population involved at the time would instantly forget such an important site.

Interesting you bring up native Americans, the Haida and Kwakiutl and their totem poles.

You will often see a giant raven on top of these totem poles. Why? Because they considered Raven to be their Creator God.

Posted Image

Could that not be the case for the Anatolians? That they had a vulture as their creator god? Together with a Mother Godess giving birth to humans?

.

Edited by Abramelin, 07 October 2012 - 02:47 PM.


#287    Ove

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 02:48 PM

View PostMacroramphosis, on 07 October 2012 - 02:39 PM, said:

It's interesting to wonder whether we jump to conclusions, sometimes. If, for example, we had discovered these pillars in north America, we would be calling them stone totem poles, most likely devoid of religious significance, but instead depicting a vertical pictogram of tribal or cultural history, and most likely used and associated with rituals and ceremonies. And the vultures would probably be interpreted in the same way as eagles atop "real" wooden totem poles are. It also seems the culture in Anatolia at this time were just as keen as carving out all the different animals around them as the Native Indians were.

However, assuming that the site was used for religious purposes, I'm wondering whether the pillars supported a wooden pillar for the laying out of bodies - a pillar that could have been removed (and the wood used for other purposes) when the site was buried ? I'd put money on the reason for the burial, as against destruction of the site, was simple too - the culture was moving on, spiritually and religiously, but out of respect for the "old", they refrained from destruction and interred the site as a form of preservation. I suspect therefore that even after "burial", the site maintained a great deal of significance for many years and continued to be visited by generations of people. I'd very much doubt 100% of the population involved at the time would instantly forget such an important site.
Seems that everyone agree that the site has something to do with death and burial. But also the birth or rebirth elment is present in Gobekli Tepe.

http://www.unexplain...howtopic=235334


#288    Macroramphosis

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 02:55 PM

This is crazy. I keep humming a little Norman Greenbaum as I read the thread every time now......... cultural significance indeed.

“You can't stay in your corner of the Forest waiting for others to come to you. You have to go to them sometimes.”

#289    Ove

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 02:57 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 07 October 2012 - 02:45 PM, said:

Interesting you bring up native Americans, the Haida and Kwakiutl and their totem poles.

You will often see a giant raven on top of these totem poles. Why? Because they considered Raven to be their Creator God.

Posted Image

Could that not be the case for the Anatolians? That they had a vulture as their creator god? Together with a Mother Godess giving birth to humans?

.
Its the "bird man" not the Creator God. You can find "feathered men" in all cultures of the world,

Posted Image


#290    Abramelin

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 03:00 PM

View PostOve, on 07 October 2012 - 02:57 PM, said:

Its the "bird man" not the Creator God. You can find "feathered men" in all cultures of the world,

Posted Image

Then you should read about their belief: Raven brought forth the sun and the moon and water and fire.

It's their creator god alright.

++++++

EDIT:

The Raven plays a prominent role in the spiritual and social culture of Alaska's Native population. The Tlingit, Haida, Tsimshian, BellaBella, and Kwakiutl all viewed Raven as the creator of the world and bringer of daylight. The raven is also important in the creation myths of the Eskimo.

http://www.angelfire...song/Raven.html

.

Edited by Abramelin, 07 October 2012 - 03:14 PM.


#291    docyabut2

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 03:03 PM

'Abramelin' qoute-
The World's First Sheela-na-gig at the World's Oldest Temple

by LYDIA RUYLE

The motif of a female is found only in a drawing carved into a stone slab on the floor of the Löwenpfeilergebäude. The naked woman is depicted in a sitting position with straddled legs, obviously representing a sexual scene (Fig. 35) Schmidt sees similarities to figures known as “dejenoun” in the rock art of North Africa.”
--p. 80, Neolithic in Turkey:The Cradle of Civilization: New Discoveries, edited by Mehmet Ozdogan/Nezih Basgelen, 1999.

In 2006, I created a Goddess Icon Banner of the image and named her Göbekli Tepe. She has been flying around the world ever since. My banner description states:

Göbekli Tepe is a Neolithic Sheela-na-gig incised into stone on the floor of a rock cut temple which appeared to have ritual purposes.Two standing pillars with lions sculpted in relief protect one of the earliest known Sheelas. Göbekli Tepe, which means navel mountain, is in eastern Turkey near the source of the Euphrates River. Emmer wheat was domesticated in the area. All life comes from and returns to the mother.
Source: Incised rock. 9600 BCE. Göbekli Tepe. Near present day Urfa, Turkey


http://medusacoils.b...-at-worlds.html

Here she is:



And this is Sheela-na-gig:

https://www.google.n...7D6a_0QXOtICwBw

.
Would like to see the actual pictures to make a judgement, Hauptmann's says a floor relief of a squatting woman--perhaps giving birth--

more then one women and there is the baby on the totam pole


#292    Abramelin

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 03:07 PM

View Postdocyabut2, on 07 October 2012 - 03:03 PM, said:


Would like to see the actual pictures to make a judgement, Hauptmann's says a floor relief of a squatting woman--perhaps giving birth--

more then one women and there is the baby on the totam pole

Then you'll have to buy the book the woman mentions on her blog. With a bit of luck it's online.


#293    Macroramphosis

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 03:22 PM

Ove - careful with corvid arguments. Abramelin will have you for breakfast.... :innocent:  (there's a rumour that he's one of them.....)

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#294    Abramelin

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 03:35 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 07 October 2012 - 03:07 PM, said:

Then you'll have to buy the book the woman mentions on her blog. With a bit of luck it's online.


The motif of a female is found only in a drawing carved into a stone slab on the floor of the Löwenpfeilergebäude. The naked woman is depicted in a sitting position with straddled legs, obviously representing a sexual scene (Fig. 35) Schmidt sees similarities to figures known as “dejenoun” in the rock art of North Africa.”
--p. 80, Neolithic in Turkey:The Cradle of Civilization: New Discoveries, edited by Mehmet Ozdogan/Nezih Basgelen, 1999.




#295    Abramelin

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 03:44 PM

View PostMacroramphosis, on 07 October 2012 - 02:55 PM, said:

This is crazy. I keep humming a little Norman Greenbaum as I read the thread every time now......... cultural significance indeed.

"Spirit in the Sky"....

Read this:
http://www.unexplain...90#entry4491218

.

Edited by Abramelin, 07 October 2012 - 03:49 PM.


#296    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 05:35 AM

View PostEarl.Of.Trumps, on 06 October 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

This is one of my favorrites. it is one-piece construction.
http://www.google.co...r:19,s:36,i:254

this one here - I get the impression it is a pregnant woman with her hands around her belly-bulge. great art.
http://www.google.co...r:15,s:15,i:173
Mother goddess symbol of fertility and reproduction usually depicted with voluptious breast and wide hips and a fat belly,doesn't necessary have to be a pregnant lady.Similar imagery of the birth goddess was wide spread through out central asia and Eastern Europe.
If anything i guess the Imagery indicates cultural continuity.


#297    Harsh86_Patel

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 05:48 AM

http://erik.langkjer...storic_religion

A good comapritive link i found for concepts in prehistoric relegions.


#298    Earl.Of.Trumps

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 06:25 AM

Ove, Harshe Patel, thanks

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#299    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 08:18 PM

With 3 opened Gobekli Tepe thread I dont know where to put this. Maybe someone mention it before.

Balearic slingers become well known in Punic Wars when thy were under  Hannibal. Although far as I know they didnt been crucial in one of my favpurite battles at Cannea. Anyway those precise slingers came from Balearic Islands. They ancestors were Talaiots. Talaiotic culture emerged during Iron age although no one know exactly when. As I understand from 2000-1000 BC. Some  link them with Sardinian nuraghes.  Talaiots built many walls, towers, pyramid like tombs and carved caves to made them look like realy nice place. Anyway, reason why Im telling all this is that on Balearic Island we can find similarites with Gobekli Tepe such as „T“ shape monoliths.

Posted Image

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#300    Clobhair-cean

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Posted 08 October 2012 - 08:28 PM

Just one small thing: the talaiots are the buildings and not the people.





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