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The Serer (West Africa) and Ancient Egyptians


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#1    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:30 AM

Serer is the name of the second largest ethnic group located in Senegal and the Gambia in West Africa. The word Serer, in ancient Egyptian, means "he who traces the temples." Thus, although Serer are mainly found today in Senegal, they have a long history across Africa.

(...)

There are many linkages to other parts of Africa, specifically ancient Kemet, in the religion of Serer. It seems possible that the Serer found the sacred city of Kaon upon their arrival in Sine – Saloum as a replica of the Egyptian city of the same name. In addition, the name of the deity Roog suggests Ra. Indeed, Roog was often complemented by the national epithet, Sen. Kemetologists have seen in the Serer name Sar, a widely used Serer name, the idea of nobility, because in ancient Kemet (Egypt), the term Sa Ra meant Son of God. A linguistic variant of this is San, from the nobility of Sudan, as in the expres­sion San-Kore, the area where the nobility and intellectuals lived in Timbuktu.

Clearly, the Serer represent an African people with an extensive religious history and fascinating regard for human community as expressed in their language. From their famous burial mounds, tumuli, or pyramids to their intense philosophical reflections on the nature of space and time, human relationships, and the meaning of life, the Serer are in the tradition of Africans who have confronted their environment with numerous questions and answers.


http://patachu.com/serer/



This is a list of states headed by the Serer Lamanes. The Lamanes (or Lamans) have a historical, economic and religious significance in Serer countries. Linked to the Pangool (Serer saints and ancestral spirits in Serer religion). Henry Gravrand believes that their existence can be approximately placed at the time of the Neolithic Era about 10,000 years ago, when he believes that the people he describes as the proto-Serers of the Senegambia Region, Mauritania and the Western Sahara, etc., depicted rupestral engravings of the Pangool on the Tassili n'Ajjer. He sees this era as marking the development of Serer religion and culture.

http://en.wikipedia....t_Serer_Lamanes

The Tassili area was once a green country with many rivers, lakes and animals. When desertifation set in, its inhabitants went on the move. To Egypt.... and West Africa?

Posted Image


Their religion: http://en.wikipedia..../Serer_religion

The dead, especially those from the upper echelons of society were mummified in order to prepare them for the afterlife (Jaaniiw). They were accompanied by grave goods including gold, silver, metal, their armour and other personal objects. Mummification is less common now especially post independent Senegal.

The dead were buried in a pyramid shaped tomb


----

One of the most important cosmological stars of the Serer people is called Yoonir. The "Star of Yoonir" is part of the Serer cosmos. It is very important and sacred and just one of many religious symbols in Serer religion and cosmology. It is the brightest star of the universe and commonly known as the Star of Sirius. With an ancient heritage of farming, "Yoonir" is very important and sacred in Serer religion, because it announces the beginning of flooding and enables Serer farmers to start planting seeds.

http://en.wikipedia...._Upright_Stones

Posted Image

Jaaniiw (the sacred abode of souls) in Serer symbolism

Serer cosmogony : representation of the universe (look at the shape)
http://upload.wikime...he_universe.jpg


Sirius is depicted as a pentagram in Serer cosmology:

The Serer account regarding origins of the stars in found in Serer cosmology especially the Star of "Yoonir" (in Serer and Cangin) more commonly known as the Star of Sirius, Serer-numbers and symbolism. Yoonir (Sirius), is the Serer representation of the Universe and the transcendence. Its five branches symbolize humans on Earth, standing up with their heads held high, their hands raised, which symbolizes work and prayer. The Star is spread across the heavens and on Earth figuratively, symbolizing the sign of the supreme deity (Roog or Koox) and the image of man.

Posted Image

http://en.wikipedia....r_creation_myth


In Egyptian mythology, Sopdet was the deification of Sothis, a star considered by almost all Egyptologists to be Sirius. The name Sopdet means (she who is) sharp in Egyptian, a reference to the brightness of Sirius, which is the brightest star in the night sky. In art she is depicted as a woman with a five-pointed star upon her head.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sopdet

Posted ImagePosted Image
The hieroglyph representing Sirius contains three elements: a “phallic” obelisk (representing Osiris), a “womb-like” dome (representing Isis) and a star (representing Horus).





Maad/Ma'at

Maad Saloum (variations : Mad Saloum, Maat Saloum, Bour Saloum, Bur Saloum, etc.) means king of Saloum,[1][2] in the Serer language. The ancient Kingdom of Saloum now part of present-day Senegal was a pre-colonial Serer kingdom. Their kings bore the title Maad or Mad (also Maat though rarely used). The royal title was sometimes used interchangeably with that of their ancient kings and landed gentry - the lamanes.

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Maad_Saloum


Ancient Egypt:

(1) In The Old Kingdom.
Ma'at is merged with the will of the king who assumes the service of men. It is not the career, since it is spontaneous and bound to ambition. Career in the service of the sovereign and Ma'at are therefore distinctly separated, but form an indispensable complement.

(2) In the First Intermediate Period
After the fall of the monarchy of the Old Kingdom, there is no longer a career in the king's service. A virtuous life compliant to Ma'at can alone lead to immortality.
However, the very word of Ma'at, which remains identified by the Egyptians with the king, with the State, disappears from the inscriptions.

(3) In the Middle Kingdom.
Thanks to literature known as "propaganda" (an unsuitable term, but close enough), the monarchy reintroduces the traditional notion of Ma'at - service to the king, as a necessity of survival.
It is added to the necessities of virtue and the tomb. The tomb and Ma'at become inseparable
.

http://www.osirisnet...maat/e_maat.htm



========



The symbols used by the Serer (and related peoples):

http://phoenicia.org...Senegambia.html

It is said (Strabo) that the Phoenicians did not invent their own script, but adopted them from another people. Could they have been the Serer? It could also have been the other way round, of course.

A table with on the left Phoenician, on the right "Raampa":
Attached File  SERER - Raampa - Phoenician.gif   22.38K   12 downloads


.

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 08:46 AM.


#2    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 09:36 AM

Guloxaar is a psalm devoted to the Sun-god as the ancestors of the Serer people used to worship the Sun - many still do (see also Serer ancient history). The word Guloxaar in simple Serer means the Sun. In a religious sense, it means "one who is bound to come". The Sun itself being a star, it is attached to the Serer creation myth. The oldest and most secret prayer is devoted to the Sun.

http://en.wikipedia...._.28Gulooxar.29


Ra or Re is the ancient Egyptian sun god. By the Fifth Dynasty he had become a major deity in ancient Egyptian religion, identified primarily with the midday sun. The meaning of the name is uncertain, but it is thought that if not a word for 'sun' it may be a variant of or linked to words meaning 'creative power' and 'creator'


Ra and the sun

To the Egyptians, the sun represented light, warmth, and growth. This made the sun deity very important as the sun was seen as the ruler of all that he created. The sun disk was either seen as the body or eye of Ra
.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ra

And as quoted in my former post, the Supreme Being of the Serer was "Roog", and according to one source this being was the same as the Egyptian Ra.

I even had to think of the Hebrew "Ruah" or God's spirit, but I think that is a bit too farfetched.

.

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 09:38 AM.


#3    The Puzzler

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 01:03 PM

Great to see you start this thread Abe, I didn't get around to it, I just kept reading stuff and got lost in it all...


Pangool (in Serer and Cangin) singular : Fangool (var : Pangol and Fangol[2]), are the ancient saints and ancestral spirits of the Serer people of Senegal, the Gambia and Mauritania. The Pangool play a crucial role in Serer religion and history. In a religious sense, they act as interceders between the living world and the supreme being Roog or Koox.[3] In a historical sense, the ancient Serer village and town founders called Lamanes were believed to be accompanied by a group of Pangool as they travelled in search of land to exploit. These Lamanes became guardians of Serer religion and created shrines in honour of the Pangool, thus becoming the custodians of the Pangool cult.[1]
There are several Pangool in Serer religion and each one is associated with a specific attribute, have their own sacred place of worship, means of worship, etc. The symbol of the Pangool is the serpent, represented by two coiled snakes


It has a picture that says Rod of Asclepius, the healer.

Posted Image

But that has one snake. Two snakes is the caduceus of Hermes.

The caduceus (☤; Posted Image /kəˈdjsəs/ or /kəˈdjʃəs/; from Greek κηρύκειον kērukeion "herald's staff"[2] ) is the staff carried by Hermes in Greek mythology. The same staff was also borne by heralds in general, for example by Iris, the messenger of Hera. It is a short staff entwined by two serpents, sometimes surmounted by wings. In Roman iconography it was often depicted being carried in the left hand of Mercury, the messenger of the gods, guide of the dead and protector of merchants, shepherds, gamblers, liars, and thieves.[3]
As a symbolic object it represents Hermes (or the Roman Mercury), and by extension trades, occupations or undertakings associated with the god. In later Antiquity the caduceus provided the basis for the astrological symbol representing the planet Mercury. Thus, through its use in astrology and alchemy, it has come to denote the elemental metal of the same name.
By extension of its association with Mercury and Hermes, the caduceus is also a recognized symbol of commerce and negotiation, two realms in which balanced exchange and reciprocity are recognized as ideals.[4][5] This association is ancient, and consistent from the Classical period to modern times.[6] The caduceus is also used as a symbol representing printing, again by extension of the attributes of Mercury (in this case associated with writing and eloquence).
The caduceus is sometimes mistakenly used as a symbol of medicine and/or medical practice, especially in North America, because of historical and widespread confusion with the traditional medical symbol, the rod of Asclepius, which has only a single snake and no wings.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caduceus

Ancient Near East
William Hayes Ward (1910) discovered that symbols similar to the classical caduceus sometimes appeared on Mesopotamian cylinder seals. He suggested the symbol originated some time between 3000 and 4000 BCE, and that it might have been the source of the Greek caduceus.[10] A.L. Frothingham incorporated Dr. Ward's research into his own work, published in 1916, in which he suggested that the prototype of Hermes was an "Oriental deity of Babylonian extraction" represented in his earliest form as a snake god. From this perspective, the caduceus was originally representative of Hermes himself, in his early form as the Underworld god Ningishzida, "messenger" of the "Earth Mother".[11] The caduceus is mentioned in passing by Walter Burkert[12] as "really the image of copulating snakes taken over from Ancient Near Eastern tradition".


An Underworld God, from the West, where Amenti was?, a messenger of the Earth Mother... it may have made it to Mesopotamia even, by then.

The Pangool spirits may be responsible for these staffs with entwined snakes, so commonly seen as a symbol of interaction with spirits.
The folk etymology places the origin (Greek: hermeneutike) with Hermes, the mythological Greek deity whose role is that of messenger of the Gods.[3] Besides being mediator between the gods themselves, and between the gods and humanity, he leads souls to the underworld upon death.
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Hermeneutics

Hermes was a Pangool imo. It also said (which reminded me of the settling of Apollo in Greece, always connected with Hermes, TRAVELLED in search of land to exploit...) : In a historical sense, the ancient Serer village and town founders called Lamanes were believed to be accompanied by a group of Pangool as they travelled in search of land to exploit. These Lamanes became guardians of Serer religion and created shrines in honour of the Pangool, thus becoming the custodians of the Pangool cult.


It sure seems to me though, they share some kind of ancestry or history with Egyptians, even before 10,000 years ago. I also liked the picture of what the pyramid stood for, the Universe.

Edited by The Puzzler, 01 September 2012 - 01:10 PM.

In an mmm bop it's gone...

#4    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 01:20 PM

Lol, I assumed you lost interest because eventually they had no connection with Atlantis, and that they probably descended from Egyptians and were not the originators of Egyptian civilization.

Well, about who came first, the ancestors of the Serer or the ancient Egyptians, that case is not closed yet.

===

OK, the serpents.

This is what you quoted from Wiki:

"The symbol of the Pangool is the serpent, represented by two coiled snakes".

The one who created that Wiki just added Asclepius rod, and didn't mind to search just a bit further.

This is the actual symbol:

Posted Image

This image derives from the Serer Raampa pictography. An ancient style of writing that the high priests and priestesses of the Serer people of Senegal, Gambia and Mauritania used to use to communicate with each other. It was mainly religious. It was used by the Serer-Saafi and the Serer-Sine people among other branches of the Serer ethnic group.The name of this symbol is "jaw", (the serpent in Serer religion). The serpent is the symbol of the "Pangool" (Serer saints and ancestral spirits in Serer religion).

http://en.wikipedia....ki/File:Jaw.jpg

.

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 01:52 PM.


#5    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 01:31 PM

From the same site I linked to at the end of my first post:


Posted Image

Uses in Magic

"Men or women can be sorcerers and transform themselves magically into the serpent called jaw (in Saafi-Saafi). The apparition of this serpent is conveyed by written message, and all the old men who are knowledgeable leaders become aware of it. When any of them receives a raampa message concerning the appearance of the jaw, they call an assembly of the village notables, who gather at the public place. The news spreads rapidly especially among the old men. There they announce the appearance of this serpent. Such an apparition of the mystical jaw always causes worry in the village. A carved stone tablet called ½al is placed at the center of the village to show the urgency of the men’s secret society to meet (in order to take magical counter-measures to repulse the danger of the jaw)." –account given by Saaliyu Juuf from the village of Bir¥iraan, 89 years old in 1992, and recorded by Aliou Dione.


http://phoenicia.org...Senegambia.html


You should read it all, it's quite interesting.


#6    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 02:07 PM

So, this "jaw" or serpent/Pangool in Serer religion was used in magic.

This is about the (possible) relation between ancient Egypt and the modern Serer.


In Ancient Egypt, where the earliest written cultural records exist, the serpent appears from the beginning to the end of their mythology. Ra and Atum ("he who completes or perfects") became the same god, Atum, the "counter-Ra," was associated with earth animals, including the serpent: Nehebkau ("he who harnesses the souls") was the two headed serpent deity who guarded the entrance to the underworld. He is often seen as the son of the snake goddess Renenutet. She often was confused with (and later was absorbed by) their primal snake goddess Wadjet, the Egyptian cobra, who from the earliest of records was the patron and protector of the country, all other deities, and the pharaohs. Hers is the first known oracle. She was depicted as the crown of Egypt, entwined around the staff of papyrus and the pole that indicated the status of all other deities, as well as having the all-seeing eye of wisdom and vengeance. She never lost her position in the Egyptian pantheon.

http://en.wikipedia....ent_(symbolism)


In Egyptian mythology, Nehebkau (also spelt Nehebu-Kau, and Neheb Ka) was originally the explanation of the cause of binding of Ka and Ba after death. Thus his name, which means (one who) brings together Ka. Since these aspects of the soul were said to bind after death, Nehebkau was said to have guarded the entrance to Duat, the underworld.

[IMAGE} was one of the more important glyphs in his name, and although it was technically a variation on the glyph for two arms raised in prayer, it also resembles a two-headed snake, and so Nehebkau became depicted in art as a snake with two heads (occasionally with only one). As a two-headed snake, he was viewed as fierce, being able to attack from two directions, and not having to fear as much confrontations.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nehebkau


Nehebkau, the God who Joined the Ka to the Body, God of Protection and Magic
by Caroline Seawright

Nehebkau (Nehebu-Kau, Nehebkhau), 'He Who Unites the Kas', was a benevolent snake god who the Egyptians believed was one of the original primeval gods. He was linked to the sun god, swimming around in the primeval waters before creation, then bound to the sun god when time began. He was a god of protection who protected the pharaoh and all Egyptians, both in life and in the afterlife.

He was depicted in the form of a snake with arms and legs, occasionally with wings. He is sometimes shown holding containers of food in his hands, in offering to the deceased. Less often, he is shown as a two headed snake, with a head at each end of the reptilian body.

His name comes from the ancient Egyptian word for 'yoke together' or 'unite', nhb nhh b [plus cross, a determinative], with the word for the plural of a part of the spirit, the ka [kaw]. His name means that he is the one that brings together the ka - the double of a person, an animal, a plant, a body of water or even a stone - and unites the double with the physical body that the ka would reside in, be it an animate or inanimate object.


In life, Nehebkau was invoked by the people to protect them from and cure them of venomous bites. The Egyptians believed that he swallowed seven (a magical number) cobras, using them for his magical power. It was thought that he was one of the gods who announced the new pharaoh to the gods, at the beginning of his rule. He was at one point a rather fierce and aggressive deity, and the god Atem had to press his nail into Nehebkau's spine, so he could control the snake god. He could not be overcome with magic, fire or water.

Nehebkau did not have a priesthood, but many people invoked him in magical spells to gain his protection and cures against snakebites. He was a snake god of protection, who was called on when the people needed him. He was, they believed, one of the original gods of Egypt, only turned from chaos by the sun god. He was a benevolent god, a god of magic who bound the ka with the physical form, and who judged them in the afterlife. Although he did not have a cult following of his own, he was a god who they invoked in magical spells, both in life and in the land of the dead


http://www.touregypt...es/nehebkau.htm

OK, so this Egyptian Neheb-Kau binds life and death, body and soul, Ba and Ka

Neheb-Kau/ Neheb-Kaw , the original form of the Serer word "Jaw"?


Now look again to this depiction of the Serer cosmogeny; it's in French, but you see the 4 Pangool on the 4 corners of the double pyramidal shape, on the border between life and death:

Posted Image

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 02:28 PM.


#7    The Puzzler

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 02:35 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 01 September 2012 - 01:31 PM, said:

From the same site I linked to at the end of my first post:


Posted Image

Uses in Magic

"Men or women can be sorcerers and transform themselves magically into the serpent called jaw (in Saafi-Saafi). The apparition of this serpent is conveyed by written message, and all the old men who are knowledgeable leaders become aware of it. When any of them receives a raampa message concerning the appearance of the jaw, they call an assembly of the village notables, who gather at the public place. The news spreads rapidly especially among the old men. There they announce the appearance of this serpent. Such an apparition of the mystical jaw always causes worry in the village. A carved stone tablet called ½al is placed at the center of the village to show the urgency of the men’s secret society to meet (in order to take magical counter-measures to repulse the danger of the jaw)." –account given by Saaliyu Juuf from the village of Bir¥iraan, 89 years old in 1992, and recorded by Aliou Dione.


http://phoenicia.org...Senegambia.html


You should read it all, it's quite interesting.

To say the least. Can't help but notice that Star of David styled star as meaning "o xeet de, “the Serer-Sine people” (093sn)" and also the same star is a healing symbol.
Posted Imageo xeet de, “the Serer-Sine people” (093sn)



It means:
"Posted Image represents a full life worthy of burial in a pyramid, also death."
"Posted Image represents the ancestors who with the living form the Serer-Sine.”
[Note a different interpretation, below under Uses in Healing.]



and this one:
Posted Imagekooh (100sf)
Pictograph for the supreme God; the sky.


The sky is the supreme God. Looks like a bow, like a rainbow. This is a common motif for God, Horagalles of the Sami has a bow and so does God in the Bible, after the Flood, he sets his bow in the sky.


Read more: The discovery of the <span class="italic">raampa</span> pictographic writing in the Senegambia, West Africa http://phoenicia.org...l#ixzz25EEoAvpK

The pyramid is a sign for dead which might go through to D, a shortened form of a pictograph, if it was taken into Phoenician for example. Which is, coincidently a triangle, in both Phoenician and Greek.  That was just the first example I tried and it worked out, I reckon you could almost find the same pattern all through, if you looked hard at the interpretations.

Edited by The Puzzler, 01 September 2012 - 02:37 PM.

In an mmm bop it's gone...

#8    The Puzzler

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 02:48 PM

I think Jaw (jah, ja) may be the original, then kau/kaw/ka.

In an mmm bop it's gone...

#9    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 02:53 PM

The Star of David, heh. And then me saying that the Serer Supreme Being, "Roog" (I also read "Rooh") sounded like Hebrew "Ruah" or God's spirit. Hmmm.

OK, so you found it an interesting site too. But it has a persistent and very annoying pop-up window, lol. Can't get rid of it. Idiots, that's a perfect way to chase people away from your site.


====

Found something else:


Ancient Egypt (1914)
British School of Archaeology in Egypt; Egyptian Research Account; Petrie, W. M. Flinders (William Matthew Flinders), Sir.



Generally speaking, when the corpse lies on its side, it faces east ; this is
the case with
the Mosi, the Mandingo, the Wolof, the Serer and the Bambara
in the west, and with the Dakakari, the Hona, the Kerikeri, the Nupe and other
tribes of Nigeria ; as exceptions, the Kilba and Marghi bury their dead facing
west.

Where we have to infer from the wording of the report that the corpse is
on its back, there is more variation ; the Gbandi bury with head to the west,
so do the Mumbake of Nigeria. The Dukawa and Mumuye of Nigeria bury the
body with head to the east, the Kamberi with head to the south. While the
Miriam turn men's heads to the north, women's to the south, the Kaje turn men
to the west, women to the east, and the Kisi on the borders of Sierra Leone reverse
the positions.

If it is true that the orientation of a corpse is in the direction from which
the tribe originally came (or possibly in the direction from which the custom
practised by the tribe originally came)
, it is of much importance that, in the
comparatively small collection of scattered notices, complete agreement is
found among the western tribes, and that the tribes of Nigeria should for the
most part follow the same custom. As to the signification of the direction in
which the head is laid, it is possible to speculate at length without arriving at
results of much value. First and foremost we need to know the native view on
the matter. If the statement as to the direction of the dead was made sua
sponte by an informant, it is one thing ; it is quite another if the answer was
elicited by a leading question.


http://archive.org/d...920to23brituoft
http://archive.org/s...ituoft_djvu.txt


#10    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 02:59 PM

View PostThe Puzzler, on 01 September 2012 - 02:48 PM, said:

I think Jaw (jah, ja) may be the original, then kau/kaw/ka.

I don't think so if you take into account that Serer "Jaw" means snake or serpent, and the Egyptian "Neheb Kaw" means "unites the Ka" (or Kaw as it should be pronounced...?), and was only represented by a snake..

EG Ka(w) = soul
SE Jaw = serpent

OK, not sure of anything here, but to me it looks like 'Jaw' is short for 'Neheb-Kaw'.

Or the 2 words have no connection at all...

.

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 03:07 PM.


#11    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 03:43 PM

Puzz, you mentioned "Amenti" as a possible name for the land of the ancient Serer?

I remember Kmt_sesh wasn't too happy with the word-juggling aroundthis word months ago, lol, so I hope he shows up soon.


Anyway, I think this is about right:

Khenti-Amentiu, also Khentiamentiu, Khenti-Amenti, Kenti-Amentiu and many other spellings, is a divine name or title from Ancient Egyptian mythology. It means 'Foremost of the Westerners' or 'Chief or the Westerners', where 'Westerners' refers to the dead.

Khenti-Amentiu was the name of a jackal-headed deity, most likely associated with Anubis, at Abydos in Upper Egypt, who stood guard over the city of the dead. This god is attested early at Abydos, perhaps even earlier than the unification of Egypt at the start of the Old Kingdom period. The name appears on the necropolis seals for the first dynasty pharaohs Den and Qa'a, and a temple dating back to pre-dynastic times was founded in Abydos for this god


http://en.wikipedia..../Khenti-Amentiu
http://www.reshafim....htm#khentamenti


And now this:


There are two main varying versions regarding the creation of the first animals (non-humans). In both versions, the jackal is believed to be the first animal on Earth, and in accordance with the prevailing Serer view.. Though there are differences in the interpretation, they converge on certain points in the wider understanding of the jackal's significance in Serer mythology. In one aspect, the jackal can be viewed as an Earth-diver sent to Earth by Roog, in another, as a fallen prophet for disobeying the laws of the divine.

"The [jackal], was the first on Earth.
And it will be the last.
Roog sent his messenger to Earth.
To which it will bring all mankind.
The messenger went around the Earth.
It came back saying" :
"Nothing is there.
Only the [jackal] remains."


The jackal was the first intelligent creature on earth, before the arrival of humans. It is believed that will still remain on earth after human beings have returned to the divine. The Serers believe that, not only does it know in advance who will die, but it traces the tracks in advance of those who will go to funerals. The movements of the jackal are carefully observed, because the animal is viewed as a seer.

http://en.wikipedia....r_creation_myth


It could be nothing but different people noticing jackals are smart and eat carrion (the dead)....


#12    The Puzzler

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 04:07 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 01 September 2012 - 03:43 PM, said:

Puzz, you mentioned "Amenti" as a possible name for the land of the ancient Serer?

I remember Kmt_sesh wasn't too happy with the word-juggling aroundthis word months ago, lol, so I hope he shows up soon.


Anyway, I think this is about right:

Khenti-Amentiu, also Khentiamentiu, Khenti-Amenti, Kenti-Amentiu and many other spellings, is a divine name or title from Ancient Egyptian mythology. It means 'Foremost of the Westerners' or 'Chief or the Westerners', where 'Westerners' refers to the dead.

Khenti-Amentiu was the name of a jackal-headed deity, most likely associated with Anubis, at Abydos in Upper Egypt, who stood guard over the city of the dead. This god is attested early at Abydos, perhaps even earlier than the unification of Egypt at the start of the Old Kingdom period. The name appears on the necropolis seals for the first dynasty pharaohs Den and Qa'a, and a temple dating back to pre-dynastic times was founded in Abydos for this god


http://en.wikipedia..../Khenti-Amentiu
http://www.reshafim....htm#khentamenti


And now this:


There are two main varying versions regarding the creation of the first animals (non-humans). In both versions, the jackal is believed to be the first animal on Earth, and in accordance with the prevailing Serer view.. Though there are differences in the interpretation, they converge on certain points in the wider understanding of the jackal's significance in Serer mythology. In one aspect, the jackal can be viewed as an Earth-diver sent to Earth by Roog, in another, as a fallen prophet for disobeying the laws of the divine.

"The [jackal], was the first on Earth.
And it will be the last.
Roog sent his messenger to Earth.
To which it will bring all mankind.
The messenger went around the Earth.
It came back saying" :
"Nothing is there.
Only the [jackal] remains."


The jackal was the first intelligent creature on earth, before the arrival of humans. It is believed that will still remain on earth after human beings have returned to the divine. The Serers believe that, not only does it know in advance who will die, but it traces the tracks in advance of those who will go to funerals. The movements of the jackal are carefully observed, because the animal is viewed as a seer.

http://en.wikipedia....r_creation_myth


It could be nothing but different people noticing jackals are smart and eat carrion (the dead)....

The other common hieroglyph used to represent Seth is a seated, jackal-headed god, Gardiner no. C7, Posted Image
.

The linguistic use in the Egyptian language is as the determinative, for words portraying items with chaos, example words related to suffering, violence, perturbation. Also for the 'violent storms' of the atmosphere, a tempest.[1]
Often referred to as a jackal

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Seth_animal

The animal is viewed as a seer.

I wonder if Khenti Amenti is another form of Set really and Anubis, all desert jackals of the West or Underworld area, the West.

Bit tired now but will add more tomorrow, although....

Trees are very important to them, they have the Tree of Life. A snake (Fangool) in a tree is very symbolic. Even the word fang (snakes teeth) imo could be short form from Fangool, that is, serpent, they do have large fangs, the jaw is really just fangs.

A snake hiding in a tree has two main symbolic meanings. It can either mean that a person has died and his soul has reincarnated or a person may die.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serer_creation_myth

In an mmm bop it's gone...

#13    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:09 PM

I don't think Seth's animal was a jackal: in ancient Egypt a jackal (Anubis, or Anapa in the oldest inscriptions) was always depicted as a canine with its tail hanging down. So I think Seth's animal was a domesticated dog or a feral dog because it's being depicted with its tail straight up or in an angle. No wolf, or jackal or fox wears its tail like that.

So, according to my opinion,  Seth is not the same as Anubis/Anapa or Khenti Amenti ("Khenti" means 'leader').

And it was a jackal that was considered to be a 'seer' according to the Serer.

==

The etymology of fangool comes from the Serer phrase Fang Qool which means the sacred serpent[7] the plural of which is pangool. Fangool means serpent.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pangool

Now we must find out what part of that name means 'snake' or 'serpent', Fang or Qool.

I have not yet found a Serer vocabulary.


==


LOL, please don't do  'Van Gorp' on me; this is not about the Oera Linda Book.

Quote

Even the word fang (snakes teeth) imo could be short form from Fangool, that is, serpent, they do have large fangs, the jaw is really just fangs.

And "Jaw" is most certainly NOT pronounced like the English 'jaw', or 'mandible'.


+++

EDIT:

This a better find of yours:

"A snake hiding in a tree has two main symbolic meanings. It can either mean that a person has died and his soul has reincarnated or a person may die."

That would connect the Egyptian Neheb Kaw with the Serer Jaw.

The Egyptian Ka(w) is the human spirit
.
And I wonder what Neheb could mean besides 'unite'. Kmt_sesh, where are you??

Not sure - just ramblng on - but maybe the -h- in Neheb is pronounced like the -ch- in Bach or Loch Ness?

In that case we have the Hebew 'Nachash', or snake. And what does "Negev" mean? You know, the area between Egypt and Israel?


...sigh...


++++++

EDIT2

Wiki:

The origin of the word negev is from the Hebrew root denoting 'dry'. In the Bible the word Negev is also used for the direction 'south'. In Arabic, the Negev is known as al-Naqab.

So we can skip safely skip that one.


.

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 06:33 PM.


#14    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 07:02 PM

This is what I quoted earlier:

This is a list of states headed by the Serer Lamanes. The Lamanes (or Lamans) have a historical, economic and religious significance in Serer countries. Linked to the Pangool (Serer saints and ancestral spirits in Serer religion). Henry Gravrand believes that their existence can be approximately placed at the time of the Neolithic Era about 10,000 years ago, when he believes that the people he describes as the proto-Serers of the Senegambia Region, Mauritania and the Western Sahara, etc., depicted rupestral engravings of the Pangool on the Tassili n'Ajjer. He sees this era as marking the development of Serer religion and culture.

http://en.wikipedia....t_Serer_Lamanes



OK, something else from Henry Gravrand:


"Rupestral engravings of the Sahara before it turned into a desert are well the proof of a double presence of Blacks and Berbers in the Sahara. During a visit of the geologists on the pre-historic site of Thiemassas (in Senegal), not far from Mbour, the geological analysis of the site, its oral tradition and the origin of the Sereer were successively evoked. I was brought to present the Sereer origins from the Nilotic point of view, going back to ten millennia to the present, of their ancestors from the Nile valley. During the debate held on the geological site in question, the possibilities of the crossing of the Sahara were recognised reasonable before the fifth millennium. [BC? BP? I think he means BP] According to the present geologists and pre-historians, there was a Saharan optimum with the seventh, the sixth and even at the fifth millennia. On the assumption of a Sereer presence in the valley of the Nile, between the tenth and the fifth millennia, or of a Lebou presence in the west of Egypt at varying times, a series of migrations relating to restricted groups is about the possible one."

Henry Gravrand.[12]

12.^ Henry Gravrand. La Civilisation Sereer - Pangool. Published by Les Nouvelles Editions Africaines du Senegal. 1990. ISBN 2-7236-1055-1. p 77



http://en.wikipedia....ancient_history


The Lebou (Lébou) are an ethnic group of Senegal, West Africa, living on the peninsula of Cap-Vert. The Lebou are primarily a fishing community, but they have a substantial business in construction supplies.

http://en.wikipedia....ki/Lebou_people



I think I found a connection with the Phoenicians:


Lebanon
The name is recorded in Ancient Egyptian as Rmnn, where R stood for Canaanite L .


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanon

"Rmnn", or "Lmnn"....

Again:

This is a list of states headed by the SererLamanes. The Lamanes (or Lamans) have a historical, economic and religious significance in Serer countries. Linked to the Pangool (Serer saints and ancestral spirits in Serer religion). Henry Gravrand believes that their existence can be approximately placed at the time of the Neolithic Era about 10,000 years ago, when he believes that the people he describes as the proto-Serers of the Senegambia Region, Mauritania and the Western Sahara, etc., depicted rupestral engravings of the Pangool on the Tassili n'Ajjer. He sees this era as marking the development of Serer religion and culture.

http://en.wikipedia....t_Serer_Lamanes


The Phoenicians were the first to establish trading posts in Libya, when the merchants of Tyre (in present-day Lebanon) developed commercial relations with the Berber tribes and made treaties with them to ensure their cooperation in the exploitation of raw materials. By the 5th century BC, the greatest of the Phoenician colonies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libya


The Libu (, R'bw, Ribou, Labu ) were an ancient Libyan tribe, from which the name Libya derives. They were closely related to Ancient Egyptians & Berbers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libu

Are those LIBU the same folk as the West African "Lebou" (that is French, and it is pronounced like 'Layboo' or 'Leeboo', same as LIBU)?


The Egyptians called "Lebanon" LMNN... the homeland of the Phoenician sailors.

And then we have the West African, Serer LAMANES.......fishermen.



+++++++++++

Last EDIT:

Lamane or laman (also laam or lam) means "master of the land" in the Serer language. As well as referring to control of the land, the name was also sometimes the title of chiefs or kings of the Serer people of the Senegambia region which includes modern day Senegal and the Gambia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamane
.

Fishermen, masters of the land??


Or is 'fishermen' a Serer synonym for sailing merchants, like the Phoenicians were?


.

Edited by Abramelin, 01 September 2012 - 07:57 PM.


#15    Abramelin

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 10:33 PM

There are times I wonder if people are actually able to recognize a mystery even when they stumble over it.

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened."

~ Winston Churchill.





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