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Red Indians


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#31    White Crane Feather

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 06:31 PM

View PostChasingtherabbit, on 26 October 2012 - 05:36 PM, said:

Please stop massacring history. They did it to enemies they respected to gain their power according to their belief system. Stronger tribes who wanted Tonkawan land used their hatred of ritualistic cannibalism as a pretext to make war and take their land.
Look because one group did something dosnt reflect on a race as a whole. It's the same sort of generalization garbage propaganda used to wipe out NA in the first place.

Some warrior clans ate the heart of their enemies, so now NA cultures are cannibal heathens. Please!

**** happens people are people. Most NA cultures are were peacful. A lot less violent than european cultures actually who were nearly constantly at war.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
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#32    Jessica Christ

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 06:54 PM

But you are the only one saying those things.


#33    seeking8

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 08:16 PM

View Postmonk 56, on 26 October 2012 - 04:09 AM, said:

Hi seeking8,

I see you come from London, which is where i live as well, welcome to the forum.

As far as Cherokee beliefs i would contact the Cherokee Phoenix newspaper first established in 1828, links below:-

http://www.cherokeephoenix.org/

History of paper below:-



Thanks so much :)
http://en.wikipedia....herokee_Phoenix



#34    seeking8

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 08:44 PM

Thank you guys for the information so far I have looked up the books you guys have mentioned and am getting them as gifts for Christmas :) there is so much to learn and am sorry if I came across draft asking this question it's just we didnt get a choice of subjects to study at school :( Which is a shame cause I think the education we had sucks! Lol but now as a adult I'm free to learn what I please. I hope in a few months time or a year I can be helpful on this subject. :)



#35    Beany

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 04:03 AM

I think you'll find common beliefs shared among many, if not most, of the spiritual traditions of indigenous people. Ancestor reverence (not worship), and holding the land as sacred are two that come to mind immediately. Europeans did not understand the concept of the land and its topography being sacred, as their churches were portable, and the spiritual crises that occurred by separating native people from their landscape. Vine de Loria has written a couple of excellent books about the cultural and spiritual differences between Europeans & the aboriginals of North America. Back in the 70's one of the AIM goals was to send their kids to college, so that they could get the kind of credentials the white man had, and begin retelling the stories from the aboriginal point of view. De Loria does a great job of this.


#36    lightly

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 12:15 PM

I think the main difference between most aboriginal belief systems  .. and the Abrahamic religions..  is,   that in the former all things are considered sacred.  The latter are exclusive clubs  to which only some beings are worthy of belonging.

Important:  The above may contain errors, inaccuracies, omissions, and other limitations.

#37    the eternal me

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 07:23 AM

View Postlightly, on 27 October 2012 - 12:15 PM, said:

I think the main difference between most aboriginal belief systems  .. and the Abrahamic religions..  is,   that in the former all things are considered sacred.  The latter are exclusive clubs  to which only some beings are worthy of belonging.

good point...

but there is a fundamental colouring that goes with modern interpretation of all things being sacred....

for the most part in "western culture" it is really hard to get away from a Christian way of seeing things...

in books and studies i have seen, read and discussed...
there is a fundamental belief that the NA natives worshipped many gods...
this has started to fall away....
but the principle way of looking at these things is still coloured in the same manner...

just as the concept of owning land that has been there before and will continue to be there after you....
there is life within all living things (duh) .....
a spirit that guides them and thus they propagate...

not to say that any concept of a spirit is the right one....
but the concept of that living thing having the ability to be a friend to anyone...
be it an animal that walks ....
or a plant that just is.....

different forms of conscious minds that live amongst the many....

even thought the concept of a tree being ones friend seems foreign.....
it is not outside of the grasp of most people to understand this...

a person with a "green thumb" can be said to be a person that makes friends with plants....

accepts the plant as a living being capable of love....
a simpler form then what we usually understand love to be....
but love non the less....

that plant relies upon us to live.....
and we rely upon that plant to live.....

without the plants we cannot breath....

and in the same manner....
gratitude towards all living things is granted....

in far grander scales that we are disconnected from in this day and age....
the plants and animals depend on us...
as we depend on them....

take away a life cycle from around us....
and we are affected....
not on a grand scale....
but in a small way....
we are affected....

for the most part we are very disconnected.....

let me bring this concept in....

what if the humble blueberry were to go extinct?

future generations would have no knowledge of this life cycle....
and would not miss it...
but they would miss out on all the wonderful things that can be made from it...
and in this way.....
we lose a little part of ourselves in the process of loosing a species....

so... to protect the species.... (all of them) ...
and to acknowledge each living thing as being a part of a greater whole....
is to honour all that is sacred....
granted by whatever force you see that brought us to this point...
we have had all that we need, placed before us....
and we have let a few control what we need to live....

what was here for all of us to share....

its the tribal mind that has been threatened with extinction....

the thinking of "I have nothing..... but WE have everything" ....
this is what is the fundamental difference between what was ... and what is....


now the ancestors had knowledge that the actions they took affected all things....
and in this manner ... regarded their actions accordingly to all living things...

there were tribes that were at war for a long time...
i am cree..... and cree were at war with blackfoot for a thousand years or more...

there were many things that happened in this war of nations....
but that did, and does not define what the peoples were ....

i am a descendant of the spark of peace that started a long time ago....
a peace that was started by a meeting of hearts on a battlefield....

that’s another story in and of itself...

so the concept of worshipping many gods is as false as the interpretation can get....

when the reality of it was that the lives of all living things was grated respect....
and gratitude...

this is only the tip of the iceberg in so many ways....

but i hope it helps...


#38    the eternal me

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 09:35 PM

i have spoken of the tribal mind before....

i believe that it is a return to this way of thinking in our everyday lives that can change many things...
if not everything....

there is a concept of rights within this mindset...
water being 1 and food being the other....
shelter is  a matter of ingenuity....

but the first 2 rights....

water falls from the sky... and runs in rivers and streams...
it flows and is there for all to share....
and therefore, is for all of us to protect and keep clean...

the food that grows around us....
knowledge of what is food and what is not has been lost to most people...

you can take almost anyone out of a city and drop them in the middle of the wilderness....
and they would starve to death surrounded by food...

a sad truth... but a truth non the less...

even in our yards....
food has been taught to us is bad....
weeds....
a lot of weeds and plants that "invade" a lawn have medicinal properties and are edible...

but the knowledge of this has gone by the wayside in favour of having a yard that matches the neighbourhood....

trees are planted that are ornamental....
could be swapped out with trees that grow food...

if all the trees that you see in the cities were food bearing...
what would that do for the hunger situation? ....

not only that... but to have food bearing plants around instead of plants that just look pretty...
would that not help for families and people that have a hard time making enough money for the rent and bills?...

the humble dandelion....
a food...
and a medicine...
grows like crazy....
and is hated...

why?

it was brought over to be a food...
and now its viewed as a weed, and there are plenty o things on the market to kill them off...


pine trees....
most people have no idea that if you boil the leaves and bark.... it can keep you alive...
then inside the cones are the seeds....
pine nuts... also food....

many areas have all kinds of native plants that are edible in this manner...
but the knowledge of them has been getting scarce to find...
let alone people that know what is what....

to see a stand of trees... and want to cut them down for putting in a parking lot or park...
whichever... building more houses...

we cut down our own food supply....
slowly the mentality of "profit" ... is putting a choke hold on all of us...

i just mentioned a couple of things that most people have no idea about...
just to illustrate what i am talking about...

the tribe not only takes care of each other...
they take care of what we all need to live....

but i am on a little bit of a rant...
i just felt i had to do some writing on the topic today...


#39    White Crane Feather

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 06:58 PM

View Postthe eternal me, on 31 October 2012 - 09:35 PM, said:

i have spoken of the tribal mind before....

but i am on a little bit of a rant...
i just felt i had to do some writing on the topic today...
More people should know this things. It's true we are aliens on our own planet. Incapable of surviving in our own natural environment. Such a shame.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-

#40    herenow

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:13 PM

View Postredhen, on 25 October 2012 - 03:16 PM, said:

What interests you specifically in Native spirituality? There are many aspects, some of which are no longer practiced (because they are illegal).

Native believed you could gain power by consuming pieces of human organs and flesh (the heart especially). You could also gain power just by obtaining a piece of your enemy (scalps). And of course it was customary to inflect cruel tortures on their helpless prisoners.

Is this the kind of info you wanted?

That's a pretty broad brush and does not apply to a very high percentage of Native Americans.


#41    herenow

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:19 PM

View PostSeeker79, on 26 October 2012 - 04:15 PM, said:

It's not that hard to understand. While there is as much lore between groups as there are other religions. The common theme is that there is a spirit that exists in all things. We are related to everything and everyone, and the great spirit ( Wakan Tanka or the great mystery for the sioux  ) resides in everything. There are spirits that are aspects of Wakan Tanka and a spirit world that underlys the physical.

And the Indians of my area (Massachusetts) called Wakan Tanka, 'Manitou'





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