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Clark McClelland // Space UFOs // 2012


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#16    synchronomy

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 10:15 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 13 November 2012 - 02:47 AM, said:

You have to wonder though, "what is his inspiration"? The man had a career that most of us would be envious of, got to meet the most amazing people and was at the forefront of technology. His wackiness seems to precede the Challenger accident, so perhaps that is not something that affected him mentally, so one tends to wonder, what gives?
And surely this claim is to be considered when other "whistleblowers" tend to emerge?
Money is a motivating factor for many.
McClelland had his career cut short at NASA, which no doubt lowered his pension due to years of service reduction.
Take a look at what he is selling on his website.  Scroll down the list to see the astronomical prices for NASA paraphenalia.
http://www.stargate-...nicles.com/web/

At the heart of science is an essential balance between two seemingly contradictory attitudes--an openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counterintuitive they may be, and the most ruthless skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.
This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan

#17    bee

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:58 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 13 November 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Money is a motivating factor for many.
McClelland had his career cut short at NASA, which no doubt lowered his pension due to years of service reduction.
Take a look at what he is selling on his website.  Scroll down the list to see the astronomical prices for NASA paraphenalia.
http://www.stargate-...nicles.com/web/



http://en.wikicollec...-11-memorabilia


:whistle:


#18    Hazzard

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 12:47 PM

View Postbee, on 13 November 2012 - 11:58 AM, said:





Posted Image




:rolleyes:

Edited by Hazzard, 13 November 2012 - 12:48 PM.

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#19    JimOberg

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 03:43 PM

View Postsynchronomy, on 13 November 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Money is a motivating factor for many.
McClelland had his career cut short at NASA, which no doubt lowered his pension due to years of service reduction.

It's not at all clear what 'career at NASA' he had.

He worked for a string of contractors, both NASA and DoD for decades, but as far as can be told, never directly as a NASA employee.

Each contractor handled its own pension plan.

Just because McClelland said he deserved a 'NASA pension' is no evidence, in my book, that he ever had one.


#20    JimOberg

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 04:02 PM

View Postsynchronomy, on 13 November 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Take a look at what he is selling on his website.  Scroll down the list to see the astronomical prices for NASA paraphenalia.
http://www.stargate-...nicles.com/web/

This is sad -- those look like autopen-signed standard NASA-issue posters and lithographs.

Two specifics:

NASA Poster Gemini 4 EVA

This is not a NASA MFA poster. It is still RARE. It shows the Titan Gemini 4 first historic NASA EVA Space Walk of Astronaut Edward White on June 3, 1965. White would die in the Apollo 1 fire with Astronaut Gus Grissom and Roger Chaffee on 27 January 1967. It is 17 by 22 inches in size and in good condition. $1,000.00 Price:

This actually is a poster of an Air Force built 'Manned Maneuvering Unit' backpack test in space, most definitely NOT the gemini-4 EVA [where White only had a hand-held jet-gun to move around].

NASA Hard Hat KSC "Onizuka"

This is the Kennedy Space Center launch pad hard hat ( NOT shuttle flight hardware) of historic value. NASA Astronaut, Ellison Onizuka used it to inspect the Challenger on various occasions during his visits to KSC. Onizuka was my friend and gave this and another hat to me. I cannot explain why. He knew that I had the highest respect for all astronauts and was also a friend of Astronaut Judy Resnik. Both were members of the Challenger STS-51L crew. On January 28, 1986. I was involved in the Challenger launch. As the Challenger lifted off from pad 39, I watched it gaining speed as I heard the order “Go for throttle up !”. Soon after the Challenger exploded and I witnessed my seven friends die before my eyes. I have cherished this hat from my friend, but, I am getting older and want it to be in the hands of someone that will recognize its value as an important piece of our space program history. $2,500.00

This is stolen NASA property. There is no evidence Onizuka ever wore it. It's sucker bait.

And the phrase McClelland says was an 'order', was actually a status call from Mission Control Houston, 'Go at throttle up', telling the crew that as the shuttle engines had automatically throttled back to full power, all systems looked good.  If McClelland really thought it was an 'order' TO the crew that THEY should manually throttle up the engines, he's more clueless than even I had imagined.


#21    JimOberg

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 05:22 PM

View Postsynchronomy, on 13 November 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Take a look at what he is selling on his website.  Scroll down the list to see the astronomical prices for NASA paraphenalia.

I sent the link to Robert Pearlman, who runs the
collectspace.com website on spaceflight memorabilia,
and is a world-recognized expert on evaluating this
kind of stuff, and he just sent me this note:

---------
McClelland e-mails me about once a year trying to peddle this stuff. I think I replied to him once and then decided it wasn't worth my time.

The prices are way out of line, the claims of provenance are almost certainly as false as his other UFO and space claims, and some of the pieces (if authentic) may be ill-gotten (e.g. the water and hard hat might have been pilfered by McClelland from his workplace rather than going through the normal deaccession process).

Some of the pieces are misrepresented. The Skylab "signed" photo he has is the product of the autopen. The Apollo 11 plaque is not autographed; it's a replica. And oddly all his "autographed" Armstrong items cannot be enlarged (or at least won't load here).

Sad really, because some of the pieces may be authentic but given the way they are priced and described, they will never sell — or if they do, it will be the case of McClelland misleading the buyer.



--------


#22    JimOberg

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 06:08 PM

View Postbmk1245, on 12 November 2012 - 11:20 PM, said:

Actually you started it, but without McG's pms it will vansish.

The earliest citation I can find is McGuffin's at message 214 here

#214 Oct 31

http://www.unexplain...c=208143&st=210


Had I  brought his name up earlier? I couldn't find it.




#23    zoser

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:13 PM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 13 November 2012 - 04:47 AM, said:

No need to mention me, since I'm no longer going to take part in any more discussions like these.

The whole idea of the thread was to draw you in.  Someone's obviously a little sore at what happened on the last NASA thread.  Keep well away MacG.

Let them play with themselves.  If on the other hand anyone's up for more photo's, footage and space crew testimonies, I won't be found wanting :gun:

Posted Image


#24    trish1997

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:27 PM

View PostMatt Vinyl, on 12 November 2012 - 09:42 PM, said:

Funnily, I was lazily watching an 'Ancient Aliens' episode (yes, please slap me hard, but I was bored at the time!) about links between Hitler and 'UFOs'. Also, how a lot of the German scientists were 'pulled over' to the USA after the end of the war (Operation Paper Clip, I believe?) And, as such, most of the technology about today is just a carry-on from that started / pursued by the 3rd Reich.

Glad I wasn't supping a beverage the moment I read that; Dell would be selling another laptop! ;)


I am so ashamed to admit .. I watch it too....haahaa . That orange guy George ,makes sure nothing is believed


#25    JimOberg

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 09:27 PM

View Postzoser, on 13 November 2012 - 08:13 PM, said:

The whole idea of the thread was to draw you in.  Someone's obviously a little sore at what happened on the last NASA thread.  Keep well away MacG.

Let them play with themselves.  If on the other hand anyone's up for more photo's, footage and space crew testimonies, I won't be found wanting :gun:

Zoser, you've already been found wanting. Get back to us when you're willing to consider any evidence that doesn't already confirm what you've been telling your friends and family.


#26    psyche101

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 10:52 PM

View Postsynchronomy, on 13 November 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Money is a motivating factor for many.
McClelland had his career cut short at NASA, which no doubt lowered his pension due to years of service reduction.
Take a look at what he is selling on his website.  Scroll down the list to see the astronomical prices for NASA paraphenalia.
http://www.stargate-...nicles.com/web/

But why the alien stories to go along with it? Surely the purported memorabilia would not require the silly stories to go along with them, and in fact make it easier to sell them. The nonsense he spouts just puts him in a dubious light altogether. How could a person smart enough to even step on NASA ground sink to this level?
I guess I wonder, why the fascination with aliens. Could it be because they work in the space industry? Why do so many people come out with stories that are obviously fake? Almost like some sort of debilitating disease, why do people gravitate to this option? As the pioneers in these areas enter their twilight years, it seems to be "the thing to do". Thinking of people like Bee's favoured claimants like Bushman, Haut, Marcel etc. Why do they favour this path in their later years? I do not buy the deathbed confessions stuff for a moment, as I have not seen one claim ever lead to anything more than further questions and mystery.

ETA Not kidding about the prices are ya! Crikey Moses! One would want to be a keen enthusiast.

Edited by psyche101, 13 November 2012 - 10:55 PM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#27    psyche101

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 10:56 PM

View Postzoser, on 13 November 2012 - 08:13 PM, said:

The whole idea of the thread was to draw you in.  Someone's obviously a little sore at what happened on the last NASA thread.  Keep well away MacG.

Let them play with themselves.  If on the other hand anyone's up for more photo's, footage and space crew testimonies, I won't be found wanting :gun:

Yeah good contribution to the thread Zoser

Certainly up to the standard I am used to.

Edited by psyche101, 13 November 2012 - 10:57 PM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#28    synchronomy

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:16 PM

View Postpsyche101, on 13 November 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:

But why the alien stories to go along with it? Surely the purported memorabilia would not require the silly stories to go along with them, and in fact make it easier to sell them. The nonsense he spouts just puts him in a dubious light altogether. How could a person smart enough to even step on NASA ground sink to this level?

Delusions of grandeur.
Megalomania.

At the heart of science is an essential balance between two seemingly contradictory attitudes--an openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counterintuitive they may be, and the most ruthless skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.
This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan

#29    psyche101

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 12:28 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 13 November 2012 - 11:16 PM, said:

Delusions of grandeur.
Megalomania.

Do you think it might be that simple? Would you regard Walter Haut in this regard, or for that matter Jesse Marcel or Edgar Mitchell? I think that might apply to Boyd Bushman perhaps but it seems a bit of a broad brush?

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#30    synchronomy

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Posted 14 November 2012 - 01:12 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 14 November 2012 - 12:28 AM, said:

Do you think it might be that simple? Would you regard Walter Haut in this regard, or for that matter Jesse Marcel or Edgar Mitchell? I think that might apply to Boyd Bushman perhaps but it seems a bit of a broad brush?
Boyd Bushman, gives me the feeling he's just having a bit of fun.  He seems to find it amusing that people are so intrigued by his claims.  Jesse Marcel and Walter Haut, I honestly don't know enough about their personality.  Edgar Mitchell gives me the feeling he is embellishing somewhat, but I think he's completely sane, and same with Bushman.
This video really sums up MacClelland for me:
On youtube:
Disclosure Series 1 Clark McClelland - About Clark and about 8 to 9 foot tall entity

At the heart of science is an essential balance between two seemingly contradictory attitudes--an openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counterintuitive they may be, and the most ruthless skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.
This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan




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