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The Ancient Alien Theory Is True


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#2311    zoser

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 04:19 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 19 December 2012 - 04:15 PM, said:

Not magic, acidic.

I can imagine they collected enough plants, and then boiled the collected juice into a more concentrated and potent liquid.

Applying it to a stone would not have been as notable as the process of vitrification must have been.

I don't really understand?  Vitrification still occurred though yes?  And presumably because it wasn't noted by the Spanish they never witnessed it happen?

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#2312    mcrom901

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 04:27 PM

View Postzoser, on 19 December 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

How about AA?

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#2313    Abramelin

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 04:30 PM

View Postzoser, on 19 December 2012 - 04:19 PM, said:

I don't really understand?  Vitrification still occurred though yes?  And presumably because it wasn't noted by the Spanish they never witnessed it happen?

Is what some consider to be the result of heat/vitrification actually been proven to be the result of heat/vitrification?

.

Edited by Abramelin, 19 December 2012 - 04:31 PM.


#2314    Oniomancer

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 05:05 PM

View Postzoser, on 19 December 2012 - 12:50 PM, said:

What polishing powder?  Are you seriously trying to advocate that the ancients polished every bit of precision stonework that they cut?  Even steps, ledges, and stonework not even directly noticeable?  Really?   Polishing to the point of actually wearing down the stone?  That's what you are inferring.  They polished the inside of a tunnel?

Your completely on the wrong track Mr O, and I worry about the others encouraging you in this desperate fantasy idea.  Look at the analysis; it's burning by direct intense heat source or chemical.  Polishing is just bananas.

The experts disagree with you Mr O.

Mr. Bielby postulated that what happens is that the top layer becomes glassy

Here is something much better than postulation:


The microscope photos above of the surface do not show the amorphous state of the layer. This can be shown explicitly by electron microscopic analysis. Further analysis needs to be carried out to confirm the state of the layer. The different chemical composition makes it very unlikely that these surfaces were created by polishing. The layer has the composition, sheen, hardness and glassy texture of a glaze.

The results strongly indicate that heat was used to produce the surface, which raises several questions. Even if a layer of a ceramic paste was applied, how was the whole heated to the requisite temperatures without cracking the limestone? It tends to shatter at these sorts of heats.

http://blog.world-my...stiges-of-peru/

I'm sorry Mr O but this analysis is a lot more scientific than postulation.  I recommend with respect that you read through this link and try and update yourself in the more recent findings and analysis rather than stubbornly sticking to old ideas that are just no longer valid.  

Do a search and look for vitrified rock samples in Peru and Bolivia and satisfy yourself that the phenomena is not just local to a wall or two, but it's everywhere that precision relics are to be found; i.e very widespread.

It would be really good to talk again when you have done this.

I'll wait until there's a proper investigation sampling more than just one spot that actually looks like it's burned, thank you.

And exactly what shaping method is being suggested as this being a result of, given that the only meltage is only a fraction of a millimeter?

I notice they're citing Watkins' thermal disaggragation theory, by which the rocks would've been heated until they fractured, much as in the the process of flaming granite.

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#2315    Oniomancer

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 05:11 PM

View Postzoser, on 18 December 2012 - 08:41 PM, said:

How come it's not on the cruder (Inca) walls?   I saw a comparison clip earlier and the cruder walls don't have it.

Check out 4:00 here:

http://www.youtube.c...&v=x81-5SWVtUQ#!

They may be cruder but they're also twice as rough as a result.

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#2316    zoser

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 05:31 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 19 December 2012 - 04:30 PM, said:

Is what some consider to be the result of heat/vitrification actually been proven to be the result of heat/vitrification?

.

I thought that was a given; proven by microscopic analysis?

The results strongly indicate that heat was used to produce the surface, which raises several questions. Even if a layer of a ceramic paste was applied, how was the whole heated to the requisite temperatures without cracking the limestone? It tends to shatter at these sorts of heats.

How else is that effect achieved across such a large scale of artefacts?  It's either the result of intense burning, or melting by some unknown chemical.  In both cases an esoteric explanation is needed.

Edited by zoser, 19 December 2012 - 05:38 PM.

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#2317    zoser

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 06:51 PM

More intriguing information:  Suggesting that the blocks were soft at the time of construction.  See what you think:


2. Metal Clamps and T-grooves.
The use of Metal Clamps in T-Grooves happened in Tiahuanaco, Ollantaytambo, Koricancha and the site of Yuroc Rumi, Vilcabamba. Also in Egypt the use of clamps was found.  The grooves appear to be limited to the most monumental structures, as the size of the blocks in which they were used is huge.  At the site of Pumapunku, Tiahuanaco, a number of grooves still can be observed. Some say the metal of these clamps is from a very special alley, others say it is of a composition that is perfectly normal for the bronze technology of the Tiahuanaco culture.

The interpretation of the use:
Why would the builders use or need a small metal clamp to hold large stone blocks in place?  This is the reason that some consider that the clamps were for ceremonial use, as the effect for construction use would be very limitted, namely the size of the blocks is too big compared with the size of the T-grooves and clamps. See:http://www.adventure...rg/tgroove.html


But Alfredo Gamarra said that the perfect fitting blocks do so because they were moldable on the moment of construction.  If Alfredo was right, one can imagine that especially bigger blocks were more difficult to treat, as the weight of the clay-like block would have given problems to keep them in place, and the clay could have had the tendency to deform.  The clamps would have served for keeping the blocks together, so they would harden out in the right position.  The observation that the groove has been polished is important here.  The same can be observed on the borders of the stones of the perfect fitting walls.  Some technology with heat was applied to give form and strength to the construction.  This means the shine is not because of polishing, but would be vitrification.  The same counts for the T-Grooves.  From the picture of the stoneblock with the T-groove in Ollantaytambo, it can be observed that also a bigger part of the stone is vitrified, not only the part of the groove.

And from the book 'The lost tomb of Viracocha', by Maurice Cotterell:
"Many scholars believe the straps were melted locally, and then poured into the grooves in the stones, because microscopic marks embedded in the straps can be seen to imitate corollary marks found in the stone.  But as figures 39 and 40 explain, if the straps had been poured in situ, then the surface of each strap would be expected to be slightly convex, due to influence of surface tension experienced in the casting process.  Secondly, the straps themselves would have adopted a cast line caused by the crack between the stone blocks, but the stones do not feature such a mark. A closer look at one of the blocks shows a discoulored outer layer of stone.  It is as though the surface of the stone has been somehow 'softened' and later hardened, permitting the introduction of the ready-formed copper strip.  This would explain away the flat-topped nature of the straps and the absence of the inter-block cast line."

So what does this mean? The clamps would have been put into the stones being these in a soft state, and the clamps would have been hard already!  There is vitrification near the clamps to be seen, see this picture of Ollantaytambo: Clamp Ollantaytambo


http://alteredge.myf...o_t__t_166.html

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#2318    zoser

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 07:41 PM

Another enigma that needs following up that may give a clue as to what happened to these stones:

Others have shown that many of these stones are magnetic, so something special happened with these rocks.

A vague statement that I wish the author had followed with a reference instead of me having to find one!

That's for tomorrow.

This quote came from the same source as above.  Could it be that heating caused a re-alignment of the internal magnetic material causing it to become altered in some way?  If rock is heated it also needs to be exposed to a strong field in order to retain these properties.

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#2319    seeder

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:04 PM

" " One of the strangest mysteries of ancient Egypt is that of the great glass sheets that were only discovered in 1932. In December of that year, Patrick Clayton, a surveyor for the Egyptian Geological Survey, was driving among the dunes of the Great Sand Sea near the Saad Plateau in the virtually uninhabited area just north of the south-western corner of Egypt, when he heard his tyres crunch on something that wasn't sand. It turned out to be large pieces of marvelously clear, yellow-green glass.

In fact, this wasn't just any ordinary glass, but ultra-pure glass that was an astonishing 98 per cent silica. Clayton wasn't the first person to come across this field of glass, as various 'prehistoric' hunters and nomads had obviously also found the now-famous Libyan Desert Glass (LDG). The glass had been used in the past to make knives and sharp-edged tools as well as other objects. A carved scarab of LDG was even found in Tutankhamen's tomb, indicating that the glass was sometimes used for jewellery.

An article by Giles Wright in the British science magazine New  Scientist (July 10, 1999), entitled "The Riddle of the Sands", says that LDG is the purest natural silica glass ever found. Over a thousand tonnes of it are strewn across hundreds of kilometres of bleak desert. Some of the chunks weigh 26 kilograms, but most LDG exists in smaller, angular pieces--looking like shards left when a giant green bottle was smashed by colossal forces.

According to the article, LDG, pure as it is, does contain tiny bubbles, white wisps and inky black swirls. The whitish inclusions consist of refractory minerals such as cristobalite. The ink-like swirls, though, are rich in iridium, which is diagnostic of an extraterrestrial impact such as a meteorite or comet, according to conventional wisdom. The general theory is that the glass was created by the searing, sand-melting impact of a cosmic projectile"


I guess the ancients may have decided to polish the desert too, or use their high tec weapons to do it, like they did with the buildings?

Could be evidence of ancient impacts or nuclear war!!!!  The indians wrote about that!

EDIT, sorry didnt post source: http://www.ancient-w...k/vitrified.htm

Edited by seeder, 19 December 2012 - 08:56 PM.

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#2320    nopeda

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:19 PM

Quote

Abramelin, on 17 December 2012 - 07:15 PM, said:
I have seen crows set a shrub on fire to chase out a young pigeon.
How do you want people to think they did that, do you have any idea?


#2321    nopeda

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:20 PM

View PostQuaentum, on 18 December 2012 - 06:31 PM, said:

Quote

nopeda, on 18 December 2012 - 12:47 PM, said:
The evidence is what people discuss most here. Whether xts exist anywhere in the universe or not, evidence that they have been here is certainly one of the things people discuss in this forum. The fact that you can't acknowledge any means you can't make any distinction between what is and what is not evidence :no:, but that does nothing to eliminate any of the evidence that people discuss here and in lots of other places all over the planet.
I know well what is and is not evidence
Maybe...maybe not. Let's find out. What do you think is evidence that xts have been here?


#2322    nopeda

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:22 PM

View Postseeder, on 18 December 2012 - 06:32 PM, said:

maybe language isnt a requirement to animals/fish/insects,  but its also well known that dolphins and wales have many many different vocalisations, elephants too - on the subsonic level,  so is having language the only requirement you need to believe in what you believe?
Having spoken language sets humans apart from all other animals, and having written language does so even more.


#2323    Sweetpumper

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:24 PM

View Postnopeda, on 19 December 2012 - 08:19 PM, said:

How do you want people to think they did that, do you have any idea?

Bic lighters?

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#2324    nopeda

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:26 PM

View Postseeder, on 18 December 2012 - 06:16 PM, said:

quote: "The hill is indeed roughly pyramid-shaped, at least the half that faces the town. The other half is a bit lumpy. In fact, if you look at it with Google Earth, it doesn't look like a pyramid at all. Geologists say it's a natural formation and that there are several like it in the region; Osmanagic says many of those hills are pyramids too"
http://www.gadling.c...a-probably-not/
Tried Google Earth?
No. I'm going by pics that came up in a Google Image search.


#2325    nopeda

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 08:27 PM

View Post747400, on 18 December 2012 - 07:37 PM, said:

Well, yes, but I'm not sure if the ones whose brief lives almost inevitably end in providing a meal for something else would necessarily see things in the same way ...
The vast majority of wild animals never reach maturity. Even the majority of higher animals like elephants and lions. Thinking it's all a garden of Eden for wildlife is naive at "best".