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Govt eyes crippling climate-control measures


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#1    Karlis

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 03:38 PM

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is ready to unleash its first wave of carbon-dioxide regulations.

Some members of Congress want to tax hydrocarbon use and carbon-dioxide emissions. Moreover, United Nations climate alarmists are trying to devise a new treaty to regulate energy use at the international level. Even one of these government actions would send shock waves through the economy. If all three are imposed (or worse, imposed in conjunction with Obamacare and other tax increases on job and wealth creators) the impacts will be devastating.


These actions are intended to increase the cost of the hydrocarbon energy that powers our economy. Yet raising the cost of transportation fuels, electricity, lighting, heating and air conditioning will raise the price of food, materials and equipment. This will severely impact the bottom line for factories, utilities, offices, farms, shops, airlines, shippers, hospitals, schools, churches, charities and government offices. The poorest families may get rebates for their increased energy costs, but institutions will not. They will be forced to reduce wages, hours and benefits, hire fewer full-time employees, lay off people, outsource operations to countries where energy costs are lower or even close their doors.


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#2    Colonel Rhubarb

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 03:54 PM

No, really, Some members of Congress want to tax hydrocarbon use and carbon-dioxide emissions?  So let me see if I've got this straight: do people really and honestly not think that these are things that we ought to be thinking about cutting down on, even if one doesn't believe in Climate change, simply because they won't last for ever and a lot of it has to be imported from countries that do not necessarily share the U.S. view of freedom & Democracy? is it just that people are too lazy to give any effort to thinking about alternatives to Fossil fuel, or is this the vested interests from the mega-Oil companies we see at work here?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#3    F3SS

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 05:57 PM

View Post747400, on 11 December 2012 - 03:54 PM, said:

No, really, Some members of Congress want to tax hydrocarbon use and carbon-dioxide emissions?  So let me see if I've got this straight: do people really and honestly not think that these are things that we ought to be thinking about cutting down on, even if one doesn't believe in Climate change, simply because they won't last for ever and a lot of it has to be imported from countries that do not necessarily share the U.S. view of freedom & Democracy? is it just that people are too lazy to give any effort to thinking about alternatives to Fossil fuel, or is this the vested interests from the mega-Oil companies we see at work here?
About the headline: Gee, what else would the government be thinking about? Economic growth? HAHAHAH!!!!!!!!

747400: You ever think that maybe, as it stands today and for the near future so far as we can see that fossil fuels are the absolute standard necessity for todays needs in all areas of production and commerce? Taxing them more and more is only going to make the cost of EVERYTHING go up for EVERYBODY. I understand you may think that's great because it will usher in a new era of green energy but you should come to the understanding that I have. That is right now we should keep using what we know how to use and use it as cheaply as possible. When the time and technology is right green energy will usurp fossil fuels and the market will naturally dictate when that happens and then the Earth will heal. Green energy may be available today but it is inefficient and expensive and not nearly capable of the potential that the worlds needs it to have. Just look at all the failed green energy companies. They can't even make something work with $500M tax payer dollars, which that in itself is another argument but lets not sidetrack. One day we will be there but it's not today and shouldn't be forced. Great things come with time and patience. Bad things happen when you hurry and have little patience. Maybe rocket technology was around in the 40's and 50's but aren't you glad they waited until the 60's to test rockets with people inside them? Just relax about it. In the mean time if we are hurting the Earth it'll be ok. There is nothing man can do to do any permanent damage to the Earth, even nuclear war.

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#4    F3SS

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 06:02 PM

Oh, and if you hate mega-oil companies just wait until green energy is the standard. Do you not think there will be greedy capitalistic CEO's controlling those companies? Do you think that Shell and Exxon will just be replaced. I think they'll be the first big names in green energy once it becomes profitable.

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#5    Rafterman

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 06:34 PM

View Post-Mr_Fess-, on 11 December 2012 - 06:02 PM, said:

Oh, and if you hate mega-oil companies just wait until green energy is the standard. Do you not think there will be greedy capitalistic CEO's controlling those companies? Do you think that Shell and Exxon will just be replaced. I think they'll be the first big names in green energy once it becomes profitable.

I sure as hell hope so because I'll be making a lot of money.


#6    F3SS

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 07:30 PM

View PostRafterman, on 11 December 2012 - 06:34 PM, said:



I sure as hell hope so because I'll be making a lot of money.
You working for a green company?

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#7    OverSword

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 07:47 PM

He's a big-wig at BP.


#8    F3SS

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 07:55 PM

Oh, well TBH I do buy a lot of coffee and donuts from BP, a lot of gas too. BTW, my truck is well over $100 fill up so hook me up when you get rich. I've been helping you for years!

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#9    regeneratia

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:09 PM

I think it is silly to think that man can control the warming the solar system is experiencing. I don't think the solar system really has much regard for US Congressional legislation. While I agree with many remedies of the so-callerd man-made or anthropogenic global warming for reasons other than global warming, I certainly think that the "viral memetic infection" that man is causing it is just inane and sick. The entire solar system is warming up.

My recommendation for global warming:
Adapt.
Research is indicating that adaption can influence evolution in one generation.

There is free energy out there (plasma, cosmic radiation, etc. ). Let's just reach out and grab it. And repress fossil fuel usage. No one should make money on energy.

PS, I hate oil companies.

Edited by regeneratia, 11 December 2012 - 08:16 PM.

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#10    ninjadude

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:15 PM

View PostKarlis, on 11 December 2012 - 03:38 PM, said:

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is ready to unleash its first wave of carbon-dioxide regulations.
Some members of Congress want to tax hydrocarbon use and carbon-dioxide emissions.

Finally someone with some balls.

"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin it now!""
- Friedrich Nietzsche

#11    preacherman76

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:23 PM

View Postninjadude, on 11 December 2012 - 08:15 PM, said:

Finally someone with some balls.

So you are ok with this finnishing off our economy?

Some things are true, even if you dont believe them.

#12    Colonel Rhubarb

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:24 PM

View Postregeneratia, on 11 December 2012 - 08:09 PM, said:

I think it is silly to think that man can control the warming the solar system is experiencing. I don't think the solar system really has much regard for US Congressional legislation. While I agree with many remedies of the so-callerd man-made or anthropogenic global warming for reasons other than global warming, I certainly think that the "viral memetic infection" that man is causing it is just inane and sick. The entire solar system is warming up.

My recommendation for global warming:
Adapt.
Research is indicating that adaption can influence evolution in one generation.

There is free energy out there (plasma, cosmic radiation, etc. ). Let's just reach out and grab it. And repress fossil fuel usage. No one should make money on energy.

PS, I hate oil companies.
Well, exactly. Rather than just saying

Quote

so far as we can see that fossil fuels are the absolute standard necessity for todays needs in all areas of production and commerce
, surely we need to be looking beyond what's so far as we can see (which, particularly for big Business, is not really very far) and planning for the time when there just isn't enough fossil fuel (enough oil, at any rate) to be the absolute standard necessity any longer? That's the whole point of what I'm saying; rather than making a big panic about it, accept that it's going to happen some time and plan for it. For now, fossil fuels are the absolute standard necessity for todays needs in all areas of production and commerce, but just to say that we shouldn't try to develop ways to reduce the dependence on it and emissions from it seems incredibly head in the sand.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#13    regeneratia

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:27 PM

View Post747400, on 11 December 2012 - 08:24 PM, said:

Well, exactly. Rather than just saying
, surely we need to be looking beyond what's so far as we can see (which, particularly for big Business, is not really very far) and planning for the time when there just isn't enough fossil fuel (enough oil, at any rate) to be the absolute standard necessity any longer? That's the whole point of what I'm saying; rather than making a big panic about it, accept that it's going to happen some time and plan for it. For now, fossil fuels are the absolute standard necessity for todays needs in all areas of production and commerce, but just to say that we shouldn't try to develop ways to reduce the dependence on it and emissions from it seems incredibly head in the sand.

I think we should just eliminate big business and go local for all consumer needs.
I am not into support of corporate antics in this world. I try hard to reduce their influence in my life. For example of this: I shut the cable TV down during the last presidential election, now that corporations can donate to the candidates. So how did those candidates get their message to me? That is their problem, not mine.

We, as consumers, have a choice to control the world we live in. We are indeed empowerd to do that, including being environmentally conscious. What happns tho' is that social systems try hard to disempower us with false statements and thought forms and trends. We need to take the personal power back and say, "N OT ME. I will put my money where I find it is most needed for the world I want to see." We don't need Congressional legistation for the environmental issues. We merely need to be reminded of the great power we do have to imagine better for this world, and to put money where you imagine it should go.

Edited by regeneratia, 11 December 2012 - 08:33 PM.

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Robert Heinlein: SECRECY IS THE HALLMARK OF TYRANNY!

#14    Colonel Rhubarb

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:28 PM

View Postpreacherman76, on 11 December 2012 - 08:23 PM, said:

So you are ok with this finnishing off our economy?
what? I thought the economy was already finished? So it's ok to effectively say "uncle Sam does not want to have to pay any more, so stuff everyone else, just as long as we can keep pouring cheap Oil into our cars and using these cars to drive 100 yards round the corner to the fast Food restaurant"? Again, I feel that a head is in the sand here.

Edited by 747400, 11 December 2012 - 08:31 PM.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


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#15    Br Cornelius

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:53 PM

Just to correct the misrepresentation - there is no solar system warming. Any premise that is based upon the concept that the solar system is warming is false.

Only the earth is experiencing unseasonal warming.

Br Cornelius

I believe nothing, but I have my suspicions.

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