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Secret Caves under the Pyramids


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#676    cormac mac airt

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 03:37 AM

View Postcladking, on 22 February 2013 - 03:21 AM, said:

Dr Hawass specifically referred to "other unscientific theories on the net".  This implies he was aware
of the theories on the net.


Until there is publkic pressure to do the science that should have been done 50 yearsa ago
it is unlikely anything will chjange.

I am very sensitive to the difficulties in Egypt and wish the people all the best but this has been
going on (or not going on) for half a century now.  At some point there aren't any more excuses
and action is required.  I'm also aware the new administration there has barely had time to unpack
their bags but this will very soon be their failure as well if they continue not to act.

This only implies that he may have been aware of some of the theories on the internet. There is no specificity as to what exactly those theories were, nor can it be known that your "theory" was among those he was aware of. Claiming yours, specifically, was known to him is more than a bit misleading.

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#677    DingoLingo

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 03:38 AM

View Postcladking, on 22 February 2013 - 03:21 AM, said:

Dr Hawass specifically referred to "other unscientific theories on the net".  This implies he was aware
of the theories on the net.

I think you will find it would come from questions from certin crowds of people that refer to these theories as gospel..

I worked with a guy that did archology at the GP and area.. worked under Hawass.. he actually totally dislikes Hawass as a person.. but holds him in the greatest respect in regards to his love and urge for knowledge of his forfathers..

But as Sesh has said there are a lot of restraints there now.. funding from the egyptian government is not high.. prorities have shifted.. its a very unstable climate there now..

You cannot just go in and do what you want now.. its all permits.. paper work.. restrictions.. and time frames..


#678    TheSearcher

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 09:01 AM

View Postcladking, on 22 February 2013 - 03:21 AM, said:

-SNIP- for irrelevance

I am very sensitive to the difficulties in Egypt and wish the people all the best but this has been
going on (or not going on) for half a century now.  At some point there aren't any more excuses
and action is required.  I'm also aware the new administration there has barely had time to unpack
their bags but this will very soon be their failure as well if they continue not to act.

Honestly Clad, I think the Egyptian government has something better to do right now. Like, trying heal the country from the upheavals, rebuild a sane and working economy, get rid of corruption at the highest and lowest levels. Trying to bring the country into a stable situation, where maybe, just maybe, democracy could be possible, without having to resolve to rioting and street demonstrations. Also trying to stop thieves from making off with all the artefacts, which are being stolen left, right and centre from museums and dig sites all over Egypt

When the important stuff is done, I'm sure they'll get to it. Seriously, sometimes it sounds like you have no idea what happens in the real world or what is happening in a given area.  As much as I adore ancient history, I do see the need for restructuring in certain countries, even if it is detrimental to archaeology. It's called getting your priorities right..

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#679    KrowMax

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 09:33 AM

It is a great mystery how the Egyptian actually build there pyramid..But in History the pyramid was suppose to be a resting place for Pharaoh Khufu cause he believe that he will be Resurrected again as god and live among the gods..But how did they actually build it with such Perfect measurement without leaving any blueprints or evedence,..

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#680    cladking

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 10:05 PM

View PostDingoLingo, on 22 February 2013 - 03:38 AM, said:


You cannot just go in and do what you want now.. its all permits.. paper work.. restrictions.. and time frames..

This is exactly what's unacceptable.  They've had 25 to 50 years to do a lot of this work
and it isn't even started.  Are we going to wait half century to do infrared scanning that could
be done covertly by a tourist in common areas?  Egyptologists are on the job NOW and there's
no reason they can't do some of the work NOW.  Of course they have a good excuse right NOW
but what is the excuse for the billions squandered in the last 50 years?

If I believed they would do the work when things settled down I'd become more patient but, frankly,
there's still no indication anything is ever going to change.  This stuff isn't rocket science.  How hard
is it to get a little sample of that ben ben stone and send it off to be tested?  Is there violence on the
plateau? Is it even safe to travel to Egypt?

I've been waiting 6 1/2 years and all I see is more desicration of graves, destruction of artefacts, trow-
eling for ramps, and counting how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

Men fear the pyramid, time fears man.

#681    TheSearcher

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 10:45 PM

View Postcladking, on 22 February 2013 - 10:05 PM, said:

This is exactly what's unacceptable.  They've had 25 to 50 years to do a lot of this work
and it isn't even started.  Are we going to wait half century to do infrared scanning that could
be done covertly by a tourist in common areas?  Egyptologists are on the job NOW and there's
no reason they can't do some of the work NOW.  Of course they have a good excuse right NOW
but what is the excuse for the billions squandered in the last 50 years?

If I believed they would do the work when things settled down I'd become more patient but, frankly,
there's still no indication anything is ever going to change.  This stuff isn't rocket science.  How hard
is it to get a little sample of that ben ben stone and send it off to be tested?  Is there violence on the
plateau? Is it even safe to travel to Egypt?

I've been waiting 6 1/2 years and all I see is more desicration of graves, destruction of artefacts, trow-
eling for ramps, and counting how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

Methinks you'll be waiting a tad longer clad, the Foreign Office is advising against all but essential travel to Cairo, Alexandria, Luxor and Suez since about two years now (I checked about 3 months ago, so this might have changed).  So we can presume that it's not safe to travel to Egypt just yet.

Not trying to be difficult here, but that's the state of affairs as it is, it can't be helped.

Edited by TheSearcher, 22 February 2013 - 10:48 PM.

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#682    samspade

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 10:47 PM

View Postcladking, on 22 February 2013 - 10:05 PM, said:

  How hard is it to get a little sample of that ben ben stone and send it off to be tested?  Is there violence on the
plateau?

since the evidence is clear about the water table 15 feet below the sphinx, and changes in flow of the water since they built the dam many years ago which stop the usual flow of the inudation,they  have been well aware of the flow and seepage of polluted water ,sewage water, dirty water, etc which has been occuring for many years.

what we are seeing is a smokng gun which ties in one of my old theories when one understands whats at play and the movement of the silt, and lack of movement of silt.

robert temple has now shown something which ties into one of my theories without a doubt.

while that is theory is just a theory and i wont mention the details, because i dont want a long debate, i do love this smoking gun which does supports my theory in a unbelievable way :)

i know  some bash robert temple, but some good comes from him showing certain facts, and this seems to show a smoking gun which points my way.

clearly me being a analyst, i frown on all the egyptolists because  they lack the problem solving skillset to understand at whats at play, even professional researchers i tend to look at as a joke in the same degree which they may look at some facts  or find others good but they just simply  dont have what it takes when it comes to problem solving as  the skillset as i  have, because of  being a professional analyst and problem solver for so long.

there seems to be a great lack of understanding of the ancient egyptian culture based on my view on being a  analyst and seeing whats at play. i know the if egyptologists ever come to understand the ancient egyptians on certain things to my level they will be forced to agree with me on certain conclusions i have maded because it is fact. i know they will eventually reach my the conclusion  if they ever reach it, then  they will more than likely omit  something in their analyst, i just wait and smile at their stupidity.

once again, this stuff is great

Edited by samspade, 22 February 2013 - 11:32 PM.


#683    Erowin

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:32 AM

View PostJGirl, on 21 December 2012 - 07:52 PM, said:

so, uh, what are you trying to say? :unsure2:

View Postcladking, on 21 December 2012 - 08:13 PM, said:

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."

A wise man would not disagree with this statement however a wise man also knows that all
true knowledge is visceral, however, he won't trust his guts to know very much at all.



And you know this, how?

We can't know something for sure without a time traveling machine, but archeology is all about linking together clues we find from the past to figure out a reasonable explanation of what happened. For instance, a small cave with a body inside and some pottery would be said to be a grave, becauce even though there is no ancient sign that says 'GRAVE' this is the most reasonable conclusion.

Same with the pyramids. When we find the graves of hundreds of workers, villages near the pyramids where they lived, records of workers and the amounts they were paid, a ramp on one side of the pyramid and chisel marks (not to mention having a good idea of the technique they used for cutting blocks, and we can do it today easily. also the progression of pyramids as they become more sophisticated).

The most reasonable conclusion from that evidence is that human workers made this monument by sawing stone with a water/sand technique.
There is no evidence (thats scientificaly sound) that shows its aliens, so we may as well say it was the dump a giant took thousands of years ago. When you have 0 evidence of one theory, and a rather impressive body of evidence for another, you tend to go with the second one.

We dont know everything, and there are still details we are hazy on about the construction or that there is no consensus on. We are always learning new things, even about the pyramids, but until we find a warp core in the center, the evidence is not pointing to 'alien'.


#684    shrooma

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 12:28 PM

I would say the evidence for an internal ramp on this page-
.
http://archive.archa...tc/pyramid.html
.
was pretty conclusive.

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#685    cladking

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 04:47 PM

View Postshrooma, on 26 February 2013 - 12:28 PM, said:

I would say the evidence for an internal ramp on this page-
.
http://archive.archa...tc/pyramid.html
.
was pretty conclusive.

...And when it's disproven over the next several years it will have no effect whatsoever on
the general belief they must have used ramps.  People will simply say the ramps must have
taken some other route.

What you see as pretty conclusive evidence is actually virtual proof that the stones were pulled
straight up the side which would be easier and more logical than any sort of ramp.  The evidence
suggests an answer to why there are caves under here.  There's evidence for water everywhere
up here and while water would be a great aid to thirsty ramp workers it might also eliminate the
need for such work altogether and explain why the word "ramp" isn't even attested from this time.

Men fear the pyramid, time fears man.

#686    shrooma

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 05:29 PM

View Postcladking, on 26 February 2013 - 04:47 PM, said:



...And when it's disproven over the next several years it will have no effect whatsoever on
the general belief they must have used ramps.  People will simply say the ramps must have
taken some other route.

What you see as pretty conclusive evidence is actually virtual proof that the stones were pulled
straight up the side which would be easier and more logical than any sort of ramp.  The evidence
suggests an answer to why there are caves under here.
.
are you for real or what?!
why on earth would it be disproven over the next few years?
there is evidence there, actual.
physical.
evidence.
and with further investigation, are you saying that that evidence, that
actual.
physical.
evidence.
will just evaporate??
how did you arrive at 'virtually proved they pulled rocks up the sides' from a microgravemetric photo showing an internal spiral pattern??
'there's evidence of water everywhere up here'
where??
where's your 'evidence'?!
what part of that page proves that there's water, water everywhere, and not a jot of 'think'?
truth is cladking, is that that evidence, that
actual.
physical.
evidence.
makes your theory null & void, so you just start spouting complete drivel.
at first, I had a small amount of respect for your dedication, but now, I just think you're completely delusional. what I saw as persistance is just dead-horse flogging. you constantly barrage this board with a graham hancockian theory based on your erronious interpretation of ancient texts, saying you're right, and hundreds of scholars' lives' work is wrong! that's egoism at its very worst.
you put absolutely no 'evidence' or 'proof' forward to justify your claims, and when someone offers evidence for something that doesn't fit your phallacy, you just ignore it and carry on sicking up your nonsense.
like the moderator you drove mad on the other website you did this to said, 'this ISN'T your personal blog'.
either back up your claims, or stop jumping in on this discussion with your rubbish.
we've all heard what you're saying dozens of times over, so stop repeating yourself and going round in circles.

Edited by shrooma, 26 February 2013 - 05:34 PM.

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if you fail to grasp the sublety, then don't whine on due to your lack of understanding.

#687    third_eye

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 05:39 PM

I discovered that I am psychic .... I once predicted that I would become psychic ... my prediction must be .... true

~

third_eye ' s cavern ~ bring own beer

~


#688    shrooma

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:01 PM

View Postthird_eye, on 26 February 2013 - 05:39 PM, said:

I discovered that I am psychic .... I once predicted that I would become psychic ... my prediction must be .... true
.
a self-fulfilling prophesy eh? I have those all the time!
'i prophesie that the evening shall be filled with beer'
lo and behold.....
:-)

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#689    cladking

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 06:03 PM

View Postshrooma, on 26 February 2013 - 05:29 PM, said:

why on earth would it be disproven over the next few years?
there is evidence there, actual.

you put absolutely no 'evidence' or 'proof' forward to justify your claims, and when someone offers evidence for something that doesn't fit your phallacy, you just ignore it and carry on sicking up your nonsense.

This is really quite simple.  Evidence doesn't make a theory correct.  If it did then every single theory
in the world from "my religion is the one true religion" to "my political party is the only one that can save
the country would be absolutely and demonstrably correct.  This is impossible.  It's impossible that con-
tradictory ideas can be both correct.  Just as it's impossible for two objects to be in the same place at the
same time.  Indeed the causes are even quite similar.  You can get angry that the facts are pointed out but
they remain the facts and the amount of evidence for Houdin's theory is not very great and most of it is the
result of interpretation which I've already shown in this very thread to be poor interpretation.  Rather than
address that at that time when it was actually relevant you have chosen instead to bring it back up when
it isn't.  You do this because of a deep seated belief in ramps based on your understanding and interpre-
tation of evidence.  This is an understanding that doesn't include more than a few facts and none of the
facts already relevant or mentioned in this thread such as the ben ben in the valley temple.  Rather than
trying to adopt or consider new physical evidence or reconsider your interpretation of existing evidence you
have chosen another route.

I give Houdin a great deal of credit on several fronts because his theory is pure genius and has been built
around the evidence rather than beliefs like the other theories out there.  Anytime you build a theory around
facts there is a greater chance it is accurate. But this hardly proves he is correct and I already know there is
a very low probability that he is right.  Certainly he will be proven correct about a few things but not internal
ramps for reasons I've spelled out many times before.  Since the probability of his being right is so low he will
be proven wrong in all probability because this is the nature of the definitions.  When he is proven wrong
everyone will make excuses and say "well, we still know they must have used ramps" because this is the be-
lief and nothing will change it until the answer to the question is actually found and no one has even looked
for this answer in over a quarter century and has NEVER done a systematic enquiry with modern research
tools and methods (our "modern" and not Petrie's).

You say I have no proof for my theory but the fact of the matter is all the evidence pooints the same way.  It
all points to the caves under the pyramids that Egyptology is scared to even look at.  It all points to using wat-
er to build the pyramids.  You can complain that the evidence is too shallow to establish this as fact and even
at this late date I can agree.  But rather thanb cast off all the evidence wouldn't it make more sense to invest-
igate and get more facts than to ignore the relevant ones I post in a thread and instead insist it supports an
idea that is largely founded on a misinterpretation of that evidence and isn't relevant to "secret caves under
the pyramids"?

Everyone gets to believe what he wants and this is the way things are now days.  But this applies to those few
who believe in geysers too.

Men fear the pyramid, time fears man.

#690    shrooma

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 07:05 PM

clad, you're just going round in circles again, and please, don't try baffling me with bulls**t, I aren't stupid, so i'm immune.
'evidence doesn't make a theory correct'
doesn't it?
it does in my eyes.
it does in everyone elses eyes.
it does in the eyes of everyone WITH eyes!
except you of course.
'my religion is the one true religion' eh?
show me ONE shred of evidence of the existence of god.
there is non, which is why it's a matter of 'faith' and not 'science'.
again, you just dismiss 'evidence' as not true, or having a 'very low probability' of being right, saying that 'all the evidence points to geysers', when there is no EVIDENCE to back up your 'theory' whatsoever, and don't say 'look at the caves, LOOK AT THE CAVES!!' because all that would prove is the existence of caves, not some miraculous, physics-defying waterspout.
I have been investigating the facts, how do you think I posted the link, pretended it into reality?
how do you think I found out that your name is all over the 'net like a bad rash whenever this subject comes up?
I don't know why your definition of the word 'conclusive' differs from everyone elses, but after looking at the evidence, the internal ramp hypothesis seems the most plausable, with the best supporting evidence, and that allowed me to reach A CONCLUSION. the clue is in the word.....
houdin's ramp has evidence to back it up, evidence that you dismiss, whereas your theory has no facts, none, just personal interpretation and conjecture, nothing more, which is why I came to the conclusion that like religion, it is just a matter of belief, your belief, and therefore about as likely as god making the earth at 9am on sunday 23rd of october 4004bc.
no disrespect clad, but you really, REALLY need to get out more. go get drunk, have sex or something. you've wasted years of your life on this, years you ain't ever getting back, and who kows, having a bit of fun might give you a better perception of things, a different outlook.
repent, before it's too late so to speak.....

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if you fail to grasp the sublety, then don't whine on due to your lack of understanding.




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