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Mosque issues fatwa on Christmas


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#16    Lion6969

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:18 AM

View Postsocrates.junior, on 25 December 2012 - 12:19 AM, said:

Aaaand just like that, the point was lost in a cloud of pseudo-intellectualism. Yes, Jesus was not born on December 25th. Congratulations on being the only person in the world to give a care.

Well it's a glaring fact that Xmas is a pagan festival dressed up as a Christian festival when neither the persons birthday they celebrate wasn't born then nor did he preach or practise such pagan ideologies or festivals. Facts are facts! If Christians wish to celebrate christs birthday on this day then that's fine, but don't present it as factual.

Muslims who don't wish merry Xmas or celebrate it don't do it out of hatred it's a matter of choice based on their own religious convictions and facts surrounding the practise of Xmas and Easter.


#17    Hasina

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:23 AM

Is it possible to issue fatwas against fatwas?

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#18    socrates.junior

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:33 AM

View PostLion6969, on 25 December 2012 - 01:18 AM, said:

Well it's a glaring fact that Xmas is a pagan festival dressed up as a Christian festival when neither the persons birthday they celebrate wasn't born then nor did he preach or practise such pagan ideologies or festivals. Facts are facts! If Christians wish to celebrate christs birthday on this day then that's fine, but don't present it as factual.

Muslims who don't wish merry Xmas or celebrate it don't do it out of hatred it's a matter of choice based on their own religious convictions and facts surrounding the practise of Xmas and Easter.

I'm impressed by your understanding of every single Muslim that doesn't celebrate Christmas or wish it to others. It's like you're saying something that you couldn't possibly know. Maybe because you are.

As I said before: a glaring fact that means nothing. You mean Jesus didn't tell people to celebrate his birth at the festival of the sun god? Really? Wow, I never noticed that before. Thanks so much for being enlightened enough to point out such a little-known piece of knowledge.

I love argument, I love debate. I don't expect anyone to just sit there and agree with me, that's not their job. -Margaret Thatcher

#19    Jinxdom

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 02:46 AM

I'm just glad people are taking a stand against stupidity. Gives me a little more faith in people regardless of their religion.


#20    Cradle of Fish

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 05:05 AM

Yes, just what this country needs is for somebody to generate more animosity towards Islam. I'm glad his fellow Muslims called him out on it. Christmas hasn't been a Christian holiday for a long time.

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#21    Paracelse

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 07:18 AM

When I see all this crap going on over religion, I'm so glad I don't have one.... and don't share what I believe in, which makes it easier to avoid any fights.

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#22    Admiral Rhubarb

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 07:49 AM

View Postsocrates.junior, on 25 December 2012 - 12:19 AM, said:

Aaaand just like that, the point was lost in a cloud of pseudo-intellectualism. Yes, Jesus was not born on December 25th. Congratulations on being the only person in the world to give a care.
:tu:

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

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#23    DKO

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 10:57 AM

I love Christmas. Awesome time of the year. But I don't celebrate it as a Christian celebration, just as a fun, silly time of year.

In my mind, wishing someone 'Merry Christmas', has nothing to do with religion.

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#24    GreenmansGod

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 02:16 PM

I think it all comes down to being polite.  If we all just be polite all will workout in the end.

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#25    Jessica Christ

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 03:48 PM

NPR did a piece on Christmas in India, Christians make 2% of the population but 2% of a billion is a lot. Now even Hindus (religion) are getting Christmas trees.

The Christmas tree itself became popular in England when a German prince married into the family, it was originally a German custom. That was in the mid-1800s.

Now since then it has spread as do other customs, which is normal, has been going on for centuries, people share ideas, customs, etc...

In Japan one can go to a Buddhist temple, have a Shinto shrine at home, and then get married with a white wedding ceremony (Christian pastor and all).

They don't freak out.

So people should understand this, the way you see religion is not universal, others see it different, borrowing is not some big crime, there is no real right or wrongs.

And to be honest the holiday itself has morphed into a consumerist holiday, consumerism is the national religion, and for others they just like to act happy or be nice to others.

Edited by I believe you, 26 December 2012 - 03:51 PM.


#26    odas

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 04:24 PM

A huge number of muslim palestinians join the Christmas celebrations with christian palestinians. Nothing wrong wit that.
In Bosnia it is usual to decorate a christmas tree but it is mostly intended for the new year so we call it the new years tree but it remenisc the christmas tree plus a lot of santa claus outfits. That is regarding the muslims while catholics do as everywhere else.
Only those without enough faith in their own religion see a threat from other religions and customs.
I was happy to read in the op text that so many muslims denounced the posts of this so called imam.




#27    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 11:51 PM

I haven't had a chance to come on and post lately but I hope you all had a lovely Christmas holiday..  


Hope you all have an excellent new year

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#28    Lion6969

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 12:47 AM

View Postsocrates.junior, on 25 December 2012 - 01:33 AM, said:



I'm impressed by your understanding of every single Muslim that doesn't celebrate Christmas or wish it to others. It's like you're saying something that you couldn't possibly know. Maybe because you are.

What do you mean exactly? I know why most practising muslims don't participate in Xmas, simply based on their own religious convictions just a Christian does not celebrate eid or Ramadan or hajj based on their own convictions, Muslims are not offended by it, so why would Christians be? And I believe their not, they understand if Muslims don't participate. Again it's a matter of freedom if choice based on ones own convictions and nothing to do with hatred what so ever, that's just BS!

Quote

As I said before: a glaring fact that means nothing. You mean Jesus didn't tell people to celebrate his birth at the festival of the sun god? Really? Wow, I never noticed that before. Thanks so much for being enlightened enough to point out such a little-known piece of knowledge.

To you glaring facts like Jesus was not born on the 25th, or that Xmas is pagan festival as is Easter and most celebrations in their calendar, mean nothing, to you truths have no value or implication. That's fine. It's same for the Christians, their happy with pagan rituals, doctrines and false dates, since there is nothing really solid and factual there in it's entirety I suppose their used to it. However we differ, Muslims only worship one god, no partners, no intermediaries, no sons, no Demi gods, etc. So we do take exception to following falsehoods from dates to doctrines!




#29    socrates.junior

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 01:17 AM

View PostLion6969, on 27 December 2012 - 12:47 AM, said:

To you glaring facts like Jesus was not born on the 25th, or that Xmas is pagan festival as is Easter and most celebrations in their calendar, mean nothing, to you truths have no value or implication. That's fine. It's same for the Christians, their happy with pagan rituals, doctrines and false dates, since there is nothing really solid and factual there in it's entirety I suppose their used to it. However we differ, Muslims only worship one god, no partners, no intermediaries, no sons, no Demi gods, etc. So we do take exception to following falsehoods from dates to doctrines!

Oh, so Islam has no holdovers from the paganism that preceded it? No black stone in the Kaaba? It wasn't a cornerstone of idol worship before that? Oh, okay.

And besides, you're saying things that mean nothing. Yes, the dates USED to be pagan festivals. But, they're not anymore. Repeat after me. They aren't anymore. They aren't anymore. And good on you, being monotheistic. Guess what, so is Catholicism...and Christianity for that matter. There's no falsehood involved.

I love argument, I love debate. I don't expect anyone to just sit there and agree with me, that's not their job. -Margaret Thatcher

#30    Lion6969

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 01:28 AM

View Postsocrates.junior, on 27 December 2012 - 01:17 AM, said:



Oh, so Islam has no holdovers from the paganism that preceded it? No black stone in the Kaaba? It wasn't a cornerstone of idol worship before that? Oh, okay.

Paganism did precede Islam but Arabia was purified of such falsehoods, as for the black stone, it has no deitic values at all, nor do Muslims worship a stone or the Kaaba, we stand on top of the Kaaba to call to pray etc, name me a pagan who will disrespect his idol god by standing on it? Try a Hindu to stand on a idol of Krishna. So don't talk tripe!

Quote

And besides, you're saying things that mean nothing. Yes, the dates USED to be pagan festivals. But, they're not anymore. Repeat after me. They aren't anymore. They aren't anymore. And good on you, being monotheistic. Guess what, so is Catholicism...and Christianity for that matter. There's no falsehood involved.

Even if they don't have a pagan relevance today it's origin does, today it has transformed in to the festival for materialists, materialism is the new pagan faith, whereby material objects become the object of worship. It's a commercial corporate holiday, so practising Muslims stay away from such things and festivals that have pagan origins, rituals etc. Even today there is plenty of pagan rituals in Xmas and other festivals. Why do you feel we are obliged to celebrate it with you?

As for monotheistic tenants of the christianity or Catholicism, those are it's claims alone, but in practise it's diametrically opposite.





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