46 replies to this topic

[jugoso]

a charter school in Michigan hired Clark Arnold, a retired weapons instructor, as an armed security guard, calling him "a tremendous asset to the safety of our students." And he was - he was - until a couple of days later when he left his handgun unattended in the students' bathroom.

http://www.rawstory....udent-bathroom/

And they are considering arming janitors after a two-day course! WTF!!
On a positive note....it was unloaded

Edited by jugoso, 19 January 2013 - 06:50 PM.

[questionmark]

jugoso, on 19 January 2013 - 06:48 PM, said:

a charter school in Michigan hired Clark Arnold, a retired weapons instructor, as an armed security guard, calling him "a tremendous asset to the safety of our students." And he was - he was - until a couple of days later when he left his handgun unattended in the students' bathroom.

http://www.commondre...er/2013/01/18-0

And they are considering arming janitors after a two-day course! WTF!!

Ah yes, all these gunslinger are really going to make us safer!

[freetoroam]

But on a positive note, the gun was not loaded...........................hold on.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maybe this should not be told, the last thing they want is for the wannabe nutters to think the guns aren`t even loaded? The future: janitors with only 2 days training and the guns aren`t even loaded.

[Beckys_Mom]

He accidentally left an unloaded weapon for a few moments .. Sounds to me he just forgot it..  They could have been his keys  or his phone.. We all leave things and can be forgetful..  I do not know WHY this made news?  

IF he had of left it loaded, and someone stole it or got hurt? I would see how something like that can make some news, but an unloaded gun for a few moments   likely because he forgot it, is news?   Really?

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 19 January 2013 - 07:30 PM.

[AsteroidX]

It made news because of the current state of debate in America Becky. It shows the dangers of allowing guns into our schools regardless of how innocent this incident was.

Luckily the gun wasnt loaded.

[questionmark]

Beckys_Mom, on 19 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

He accidentally  left an unloaded weapon for a few moments .. Sounds to me he just forgot it..  They could have been his keys  or his phone.. We all leave things and can be forgetful..  I do not know WHY this made news?  

IF he had of left it loaded, and someone stole it or got hurt? I would see how something like that can make some news, but an unloaded gun for a few moments   likely because he forgot it, is news?   Really?

Well, If he forgets a unloaded gun, how are you to suppose he would not forget a loaded one... in an area where kids have access to. And we are talking about a former INSTRUCTOR!

And here we are again at the point I am constantly stressing: The majority of gun owners are incapable of keeping their guns under control.

[Beckys_Mom]

AsteroidX, on 19 January 2013 - 07:31 PM, said:

It made news because of the current state of debate in America Becky. It shows the dangers of allowing guns into our schools regardless of how innocent this incident was.

Luckily the gun wasnt loaded.

I feel sorry for the poor guy... And I do not agree with that making news .. If it were loaded and something happened then yes, but for forgetting a gun that was not loaded for  a few moments?

[Beckys_Mom]

questionmark, on 19 January 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

Well, If he forgets a unloaded gun, how are you to suppose he would not forget a loaded one... in an area where kids have access to. And we are talking about a former INSTRUCTOR!

And here we are again at the point I am constantly stressing: The majority of gun owners are incapable of keeping their guns under control.

He made a mistake that was for a few moments..It should have been dealt with as a private matter .. Not broadcasted over the media for the world to read and  judge him..   Things like this can happen to the best of us..

I have seen me leaving the odd sharp object around and forgetting it.. Then later seeing my mistake and correcting it..It made me more vigilant and I was glad my kids didn't notice..   Maybe this was meant to happen as a warning, next time, be extra careful  

He was most likely careful with guns all his life and this was his first mistake...It happens , only his was a weapon that was not loaded and for only a few moments ..I think this was his wake up call..

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 19 January 2013 - 07:42 PM.

[F3SS]

questionmark, on 19 January 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

The majority of gun owners are incapable of keeping their guns under control.

That's just not a fair and factual statement. You can't prove that or even convince people that it's true. Only the bad stories make headlines. There are nearly 300,000,000 privately owned legal guns in this country and even if there are 1,000 bad stories a year you know yourself that is a minuscule percentage compared to what's out there.

[questionmark]

-Mr_Fess-, on 19 January 2013 - 08:25 PM, said:

That's just not a fair and factual statement. You can't prove that or even convince people that it's true. Only the bad stories make headlines. There are nearly 300,000,000 privately owned legal guns in this country and even if there are 1,000 bad stories a year you know yourself that is a minuscule percentage compared to what's out there.

As soon as you show me that there are at least 1,000,000 gun safes for those 300,000,000 guns I will believe you.

[jugoso]

Beckys_Mom, on 19 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

He accidentally left an unloaded weapon for a few moments .

It´s actually unclear from the article how long his gun was sitting in the school bathroom. The school said "a few moments" but that could be any where from a minute to 20+ minutes. It´s pretty vague which makes me suspicious as to the actual length of time.

Beckys_Mom, on 19 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

. Sounds to me he just forgot it..  They could have been his keys  or his phone.. We all leave things and can be forgetful..

I´m sure he left it there accidently but I´m surprised that you are equating forgetting your gun with forgetting your keys or phone. Particularly if you are a firearms instructor and teaching gun safety is a part of your job. Sorry, the key-gun analogy just doesn´t work for me

Beckys_Mom, on 19 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

. .  I do not know WHY this made news?
  

Given the current debate as to whether to have armed individuals (teachers/janitors/security officers etc.) in schools, I think this is certainly newsworthy and relevent to the debate. If a trained professional is capable of something like this, what about the janitors??

Beckys_Mom, on 19 January 2013 - 07:41 PM, said:

He was most likely careful with guns all his life and this was his first mistake.

Pure speculation on your part.and he´s only been on the job a short time. What do you suggest? The three strike rule.....forget your gun three times and I´m sorry but we´ll need to let you go. Should be his first and last IMO

Beckys_Mom, on 19 January 2013 - 07:41 PM, said:

..It happens .

What happens? Trained gun professionals forget their guns in public places that young people have access to?

I agree that the situation could have been a lot worse and I feel sorry for the dude too but I really feel you are forgetting that the whole idea of having guns in schools is to make them safer and this is a clear example of the opposite. He´s damned lucky some kid didn´t find it first!

[Babe Ruth]

Funny story, because it had a good ending.

But all it shows is that some people never learn respect for the weapon, and it is crucial.  But I guess it cannot be learned.

[F3SS]

questionmark, on 19 January 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

As soon as you show me that there are at least 1,000,000 gun safes for those 300,000,000 guns I will believe you.

I tried to look it up. Seems that there is no information available on the quick and I gotta roll soon so feel free to make up your own stats for now. I did see some individual manufacturers may list how many they sell a year but I don't have time for market research ATM. Go ahead though, it's your argument and now your job to back it up.

[Beckys_Mom]

jugoso, on 19 January 2013 - 08:56 PM, said:

It´s actually unclear from the article how long his gun was sitting in the school bathroom. The school said "a few moments" but that could be any where from a minute to 20+ minutes.

If the article reads it, I make do with the comments it reads.. A few moments..  And 20 mins + are you kidding?   20 Mins + implies almost half an hour, and you call that a few moments?  Example - When a commercial break in the USA is about to start, the presenter will say - Back in a few moments.. That can be a few mins.( and it usually is ) . Not almost half hour.. ( 20 mins + )

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  It´s pretty vague which makes me suspicious as to the actual length of time.   

Dun dun dunnn

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Sorry, the key-gun analogy just doesn´t work for me

So...and ?    It could be anything..Even other items that could be dangerous if in the wrong hands.. Anything ..

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I think this is certainly newsworthy and relevent to the debate.

Hence why you posted it.. and ?

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  what about the janitors??   

What about them?  Does this mean .. Oh no, they will leave their guns and then some behind for a few moments too?  OR 20 + mins ?   Does it really? We could really go nuts and say - The janitors will do a lot worse, and shoot the school down.. YUP  inject more paranoia  than there already is..  

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The three strike rule.....forget your gun three times and I´m sorry but we´ll need to let you go.   

Maybe those in charge have given him a second chance. .  It doesn't matter what you or I suggest, the fact is you do not know the full story and what has went on...  Whatever happens to him is up to those in charge..

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  What happens? Trained gun professionals forget their guns in public places that young people have access to?

Yes because people like that never make mistakes that wind up causing no harm...  

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and I feel sorry for the dude too

Oh of COURSE you do...

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  but I really feel you are forgetting that the whole idea of having guns in schools is to make them safer and this is a clear example of the opposite.   

How did I forget that?   Because I pointed out he made a  mistake? So that means I plumb forgot the idea of having guns in schools ?

Let me ask you something.. Have you ever in your life, left something that is considered dangerous laying around  that you forgot about?  I have, granted nothing came of it, but it reminded me to be extra careful next time... It happens .. It can happen to you..Never say never.. and I am not just talking about a gun, I mean anything that could be considered dangerous..

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 19 January 2013 - 10:25 PM.

[aztek]

-Mr_Fess-, on 19 January 2013 - 10:20 PM, said:

I tried to look it up. Seems that there is no information available on the quick and I gotta roll soon so feel free to make up your own stats for now. I did see some individual manufacturers may list how many they sell a year but I don't have time for market research ATM. Go ahead though, it's your argument and now your job to back it up.

of course there isn't, no one collects data on safes, it  isn't like you need to register it. , no one buys a new garage every time they buy a new car. dumb logic.

not to mention the whole story stinks.

Edited by aztek, 20 January 2013 - 01:10 AM.