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Atheism - any contradictions or 'problems'?


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#211    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 05:54 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 03 February 2013 - 05:45 PM, said:

In no particular order, I'm an atheist, a socialist, a non-materialist (regarding things like mind and karma), and a rather bad Buddhist (oh I believe most of Buddhism but I'm nowhere near humble enough and am not seeking Enlightenment).  I also try to follow Kantian ethics and a lot of Plato's political ideas, especially his suspicion of democracy, so in British terms I'm something of a Tory.

A right wing atheist lol

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#212    Mystic Crusader

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 05:56 PM

View PostCrikey, on 03 February 2013 - 05:16 PM, said:

Anybody can cook up a Religious Timeline, but only Christianity is fronted by the Son of God himself, which kinda dilutes the validity of all the rest.. ;)

Did you ever stop to think that maybe Jesus is a narcissist and you are being an obnoxious sycophant?

Edited by HavocWing, 03 February 2013 - 05:56 PM.

Thomas Paine wrote in The Age of Reason that “Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous execution, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be consistent that we called it the word of a demon, than the word of God."
Jewish gematria # 629:
The holy bible
Demonic inspiration

#213    Frank Merton

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:02 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 03 February 2013 - 05:54 PM, said:

A right wing atheist lol
Categorizing myself I see several self-contradictions.


#214    Crikey

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:03 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 03 February 2013 - 05:32 PM, said:

I never trust a guy with long hair and sandals ............

Other women trusted Jesus even if you don't... ;)
(left-click pic to expand it for full dramatic effect)

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Edited by Crikey, 03 February 2013 - 06:04 PM.


#215    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:03 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 03 February 2013 - 06:02 PM, said:

Categorizing myself I see several self-contradictions.

You wouldn't make a good Christian  or a Tory  lol :P

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#216    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:05 PM

View PostCrikey, on 03 February 2013 - 06:03 PM, said:

Other women trusted Jesus even if you don't... ;)

That's because they were into long hair and sandals .  He wasn't even an Irishman  *sigh*.. Anyhoo, got anything more?  Or is that it?

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#217    Frank Merton

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:10 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 03 February 2013 - 06:03 PM, said:

You wouldn't make a good Christian  or a Tory  lol :P
I put the Tory part in there because I like monarchies, and am rather fond of what the limited introduction of market forces into Vietnam has done.

Sticking to the business at hand, I am definitely an atheist (this is common in Buddhism) and pretty strongly an anti-Christian (at least anti-missionaries) from personal experience.


#218    Crikey

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:16 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 03 February 2013 - 05:45 PM, said:

...i'm a rather bad Buddhist..

Okay mate now tell us why you chose Buddha and rejected Jesus, and we'll take it from there.. :)

Edited by Crikey, 03 February 2013 - 06:17 PM.


#219    Crikey

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:22 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 03 February 2013 - 06:05 PM, said:

Jesus.. wasn't even an Irishman  *sigh*.. Anyhoo, got anything more?  Or is that it?

Whoa what's your hurry missus? The fundy mob want to stone the adulteress to death but Jesus rescued her and told them "On yer bikes!".
So who's side are you on, the mobs or Jesus's?


#220    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:22 PM

View PostCrikey, on 03 February 2013 - 06:16 PM, said:

Okay mate now tell us why you chose Buddha and rejected Jesus, and we'll take it from there..

OI  you haven't finished with my analyst report yet..  Tsk tsk

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#221    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 06:25 PM

View PostCrikey, on 03 February 2013 - 06:22 PM, said:

Whoa what's your hurry missus? The fundy mob want to stone the adulteress to death but Jesus rescued her and told them "On yer bikes!".
So who's side are you on, the mobs or Jesus's?

Did the mob have long hair and sandals  too?

Quote

"On yer bikes!".

I knew her wasn't an Irishman.. He sounds more like a Londoner

I am willing to bet he didn't once turn water into whiskey ?

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 03 February 2013 - 06:30 PM.

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#222    White Crane Feather

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 07:00 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 03 February 2013 - 04:57 PM, said:

I dunno.  Indoctrination is obviously the reason most people believe in the particular religion they believe in.  It happens during childhood and is constantly reinforced by the culture, so most Thais are Buddhist, most Egyptians are Muslim, most Indians are Hindu, and so on.

Where wishful thinking enters the picture are perhaps (and I'm just making reasonable guesses here) from various forms of wanting to be important or to get attention.  The phenomenon of "false memories," perhaps brought on by the eager questions of pro-belief "investigators," or just the same thing brought on by repeated retelling, with further detail being steadily added.

One clue is the vehemence one gets when one raises and eyebrow or gently suggests a possible alternative explanation.  If the person is seeking alternative explanations, they don't react with anger and a, "I know what I saw," but instead are willing to explore the event with some humility and possible mistake in mind.

I think it was on this thread, but maybe another, where I noted that in my youth I had some to me terribly convincing experiences.  As I've aged, doubts and other possibilities have entered my mind, and I am less sure.  That is probably why nowadays I react as I do.

im glad you said " a reasonable guess". it is certainly reasonable. but that dosnt make it true....just an option. Where i think wishful thinking comes to play is with cognitive dissidence. This when somone chooses faith over reason because they have so much invested in  a particular choice that they simply cannot handle the fact that they know they are wrong so they choose faith.

indoctrinated individuals do not fall into this catagory until they become educated enough.

People with powerful experiences or people that simply trust those people dont either.  now there is always the possibility of false memories, mental problems, distorted realities etc etc..... but i try to remind people that that because something can happen dosnt mean that it always does. False memories or inturpretive problems  Are a good example. yes they happen. but if you look closely at the experiments, often the inconsistencies are ocuring where the  brain is filling in gaps. I work with   lot of people. i find that in most cases their experiences are reliable. Evolution has spent billions of years  and countless deaths organizing our brain  to give as acurate a picture as possible. i just dont  buy the false memory Hypothesis for certain kind of events. That dosnt  mean the inturpretation must be accurate however.

religious and spiritual beliefs usually follow one of three patterns

1. an undeniable spiritual expereince of an individual. NDEs that change peoples lives are a good example.

2. an expereince of an individual communicated ( real or made up) -------> BELIEF or trust in the individual -----> Story telling or retelling of the original expereince with additions and or omissions accidental or intentional ----------> indoctrination sometimes acompanied by colored experiences ( the christian interpretes the white light and benevolant presence as jesus, while the buhddist something else)

3. story telling to describe mysterious events --------> retelling and changes ----------> indoctrination. ( often this cycle serves very benificial saftey information reguarding nature)

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
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#223    White Crane Feather

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 07:12 PM

View PostCrikey, on 03 February 2013 - 06:16 PM, said:

Okay mate now tell us why you chose Buddha and rejected Jesus, and we'll take it from there.. :)

The buddha never claimed to be god, but that did not stop people from makeing him into one. He actually taught that his own teachings would pass away like everything else. He was probably wrong there.

I suspect that jesus suffered the same fate. I suspect that he did not actually claim to be god either but people latter made him into one. a common occurance actually. it would seem that i have more faith in the MAN of  jesus than his actual followers.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-

#224    Rlyeh

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:13 PM

View PostCrikey, on 03 February 2013 - 05:16 PM, said:

Anybody can cook up a Religious Timeline, but only Christianity is fronted by the Son of God himself, which kinda dilutes the validity of all the rest.. ;)
You've got it ass-backwards, evidence is what gives historical accounts validity, for sons of gods there is zilch.


#225    Setton

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Posted 03 February 2013 - 11:24 PM

View PostRlyeh, on 03 February 2013 - 11:13 PM, said:

You've got it ass-backwards, evidence is what gives historical accounts validity, for sons of gods there is zilch.

Never understood that phrase. Surely if the ass is backwards, everything is as normal. Or do many people have buttocks on the front? :P

'Good' is not the same as 'nice'.
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