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Can something come from 'nothing'


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#31    Paranoid Android

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 06:44 AM

View PostSpiritWriter, on 10 February 2013 - 03:26 AM, said:

How about a melody... it comes from a mouth or instrument, but it doesn't have to be thought about... just let it out freestyle form..
It's still based on a construction of a musical scale.  And every culture we have has a different interpretation of music - consider the one we are most familiar with - Do, Re, Mi, Fa, So, La, Ti, then back to Do.  That's a plain run of the mill Major scale.  However, a Pentatonic scale will sound very different and to our ears familiar with Western music, may actually find it to be quite difficult to find melodically beautiful.  However, in the East, the pentatonic scale is much more common and therefore someone freestyling a scale in Asia is going to sing something very different than someone freestyling in Australia, because of the cultural construct in which they have grown up.

This is just one example, there are many types of music out there that different cultures find beautiful but to other societies the music may be quite an affront to the senses.

Just a few thoughts to take into consideration,

~ PA

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#32    SpiritWriter

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 06:57 AM

View PostParanoid Android, on 10 February 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

It's still based on a construction of a musical scale.  And every culture we have has a different interpretation of music - consider the one we are most familiar with - Do, Re, Mi, Fa, So, La, Ti, then back to Do.  That's a plain run of the mill Major scale.  However, a Pentatonic scale will sound very different and to our ears familiar with Western music, may actually find it to be quite difficult to find melodically beautiful.  However, in the East, the pentatonic scale is much more common and therefore someone freestyling a scale in Asia is going to sing something very different than someone freestyling in Australia, because of the cultural construct in which they have grown up.

This is just one example, there are many types of music out there that different cultures find beautiful but to other societies the music may be quite an affront to the senses.

Just a few thoughts to take into consideration,

~ PA

Well what if you never studied music...

Or what about the first noise a baby makes...

The letter kills but The Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:6

Non-ambiguity and non-contradiction are one sided and thus unsuited to express the incomprehensible. -Jung

#33    SpiritWriter

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 06:58 AM

I guess that could also afront the senses...

The letter kills but The Spirit gives life. 2 Corinthians 3:6

Non-ambiguity and non-contradiction are one sided and thus unsuited to express the incomprehensible. -Jung

#34    Paranoid Android

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 07:12 AM

View PostSpiritWriter, on 10 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

Well what if you never studied music...

Or what about the first noise a baby makes...
You don't have to study music to be influenced by the culture you live in.  If you grow up and live in an Arabic speaking country, you would be used to listening to Arabic music with its distinct style.  Likewise if you live in Tennessee you may just be used to Country and Western Music more often than other types (I'm stereotyping here, I've never been to the States to know more about Nashville than it's got a massive Country music scene).  If you grew up in the Alps, you may just be used to yodelling.  Whatever your cultural upbringing, you will be exposed to the music of your own culture, and therefore when singing your own freestyle music you will be unavoidably drawing on your own cultural references.

And the first sound a baby makes is to cry and wail.  Some would argue this to be music (John Cage springs to mind) but it also is simply part of life, the sounds we hear all the time, again nothing brand new, even if it is improvised in totality.

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#35    Frank Merton

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 08:10 AM

People I'm sorry to break it to you, but stuff does come from nothing all the time.  Because you can't see how this is possible and that it doesn't occur in your world only proves you are very limited in both what you can see and what world you are in.


#36    Realm

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 09:21 AM

Posted 27 February 2012 - 03:39 AM

I can understand the big void we call space. It makes perfect sense. If not a living thing existed anywhere in the universe, that big void would be there, always.
I'm not talking about matter within the void, simply the void itself. It had no beginning, it has no end, and no matter which direction you go, or for how long,
you will never find the end of it. It is simply space.

I believe that the matter within this void was created not as a result of energy, but from energy itself. The stars are giant nuclear fusion machines, capable of
creating different elements.

E=MC2. If those are equal then they are interchangeable. Energy capable of creating matter.

As for where the energy came from, I have thoughts, but it is too late and I'm tired. But I will say, I don't think it's "residual" energy. If so, "residual" from
what?


I posted this almost 1 year ago, sort of what he is saying, in a sense..

Those that mistake my meekness for weakness, suddenly find themselves destroyed.

#37    Frank Merton

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 09:31 AM

The principles of conservation do not say you can't create stuff, only that the stuff you create has to total zero.  At the present time we know of four things that are conserved: mass/energy, electric charge, momentum and angular momentum.  The last three of these naturally cancel all the time, but with mass/energy the cancellation is more difficult to perceive, because we don't have a large enough perspective.  There is reason to think that, if you take the positive energy and mass and set it against the negative energy of the universe's expansion, the universe nets to zero.  Existence is just a free lunch.


#38    White Crane Feather

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 10:41 AM

View PostFrank Merton, on 10 February 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

People I'm sorry to break it to you, but stuff does come from nothing all the time.  Because you can't see how this is possible and that it doesn't occur in your world only proves you are very limited in both what you can see and what world you are in.
"nothing" is merely a way of saying " I dont know". How coluld anyone possibly know if something actually came from 'nothing' with any degree of certainty what so ever? If it can come from nothing, then it's just as likely or more so to have come from something.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-




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