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Teachers union strike


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#31    rashore

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 04:51 PM

As far as I can tell, a lot of MI folks aren't too fond of EFMs.. It's something they avoid if they can.
EFM's also suspend/overrule duly elected officials, can make land grabs and sell for the sake of the city, which the EFM did in Benton Harbor. He suspended all the officials, and proceeded with handing land over to golf course development, including a chunk of public parkland.
If I'm recalling correctly, they can also dissolve borders and plats of more personal nature. As in if my home is in an area with an EFM, they can declare my plat null and void, rendering my deed no longer valid, and then seize the property for the sake of the fiscal well being of the town, then sell it off to whomever.
They can dissolve contracts, which can mean teachers, but also can mean LEO, EMT, and fire services. Some townships have reduced those services to bone bare and some have been joining up with other townships in the hopes that if they cut their emergency services enough, that might help avoid the EFM knocking on that town's door. Just recently Gaines township board disbanded their police department to save money and now relies on the state police for LEO calls. Other towns like Bay City have decided to combine LEO and fire, laying off a bunch of firefighters and cross training the cops so they can cut back total staff and still try to provide good coverage- other towns have done this too. In Pontiac, the EFM completely disbanded the police- that is now county sheriff turf, and completely disbanded the fire department, taking a contract with nearby Waterford instead. EFM also sold off the Silverdome there.

Other problems with EFM is it's full of nepotism and cronyism- Like in Benton Harbor, that's been a scandal between the golf course, Whirlpool, and politicians. And extra bummer- whoever get's assigned an EFM has to pay that EFM's wages, and even if the town or school system can't afford to pay everyone else, they still have to pay the EFM.

The notion of an EFM does sound kind of nice on the surface, someone to help when crap hits the fan.. And in some places it seems to be helpful. But it isn't quite as nice as it sounds.

Your ad hominem connotes your sciolism. Now that is some funny commentary.

#32    ninjadude

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 08:29 PM

View Post-Mr_Fess-, on 10 March 2013 - 03:33 AM, said:

When they re-realize it they want more.

your comments are just ignorant about teachers and unions. In many cases, they don't want "more", they just want what they had before republicans trying to slash and burn.

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#33    F3SS

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 09:42 PM

Spare me. I won't defend republicans except to say that every comment you make about them is ignorant. I'm not a party boy by any means unlike yourself. If any of what you say is true I'll reiterate for you. You meant to say someone who understands fiscal responsibility found a way to fix the damages done by insanely expensive union demands and the problems caused by spend like there's no tomorrow democrats.

Rashore, thanks for the info. I understood it's a last ditch effort. I was actually thinking about it before I saw your post that I probably wouldn't like it too much having some unelected dictator coming to town but at the same time someone needs to knock some sense into leaders who can't lead. Guess it's kind of a catch-22 and the corruption and cronyism is another thing too. Seems that no matter what those things are as abundant as air and water.


#34    Myles

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 01:16 PM

View PostSakari, on 09 March 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

I am on a new job, it is Union. I have to pay $60.00 a month, and pay $285.00 a month also for me and the wife through work. Being new, I can not push anything, but I have asked what does this union do for anyone, and where does the money go?...Honestly, I see nothing good with it. ( at least where I am )

And again, sorry about that reply, no insulting was intended.
I'm happy that Indiana has the right-to-work legislation now.    I think it will be interesting to see how it evolves.   I've had too many bad experiences with unions.    They cause more harm than good in my eyes.  Mostly because they choose to be too stubborn just to show their power.   My thoughts are just based off of my own experiences.   I know that unions also do good and others may have experienced them differently.
A few years ago, a struggling company wanted to cut wages from $18 per hour to $16 per hour.  They said that if they didn't, they would have to move to Mexico.   The union voted agaist the decrease.   The company moved to Mexico.  I'd rather be making $16 an hour than nothing.
I'm not union, but the hourly workforce where I work is.  We are all subject to random drug tests.   If my name comes up and I fail, I'm fired.   A union worker, however, has to fail a random test 3 times (average time for 3 random tests would be 18 years) before they would be suspended.   I understand that the union fights for it's members rights, but now they are just being stubborn to be difficult.


#35    aztek

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 04:58 PM

now a days uninons don't even fight for rights of workers, recent school bus union, and city workers union in nyc is a great example.
school bus companies almost lost contract with city, cuz union wanted all priviliges that city workes have, while not being city workers,  and city workers face huge cuts, and their union, sends representetives to city offices, that basicly say, start looking for another job, you are on your own.
time for unions have passed, they are the ones that make $1000 job cost $5000, and quality of jobs, is all time low.
it was UAW that almost killed gm\ford\chrysler.

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#36    aztek

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 04:59 PM

.....

Edited by aztek, 11 March 2013 - 05:32 PM.

RESIDENT TROLL.

#37    Bama13

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 07:04 PM

I don't know how this area is doing but many governments (federal, state, and local) are hurting for money right now. Seems like a bad time to ask for a raise. When your employer is going through finanical difficulties it is not the time to ask for more money.

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#38    Myles

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 11:59 PM

The major problem facing teachers is the parents.   There is a large portion of the kids who have parents that expect the schools to teach their kids discipline, how to treat others and common courtesy.   This does a few things to the teachers:
Tries their patience.
Doesn't allow them to teach the good kids as well as they can.
Disrupts the classes.

The schools do not have the funds to put the crappy kids into designated classes.   They also needs to teach the kids with the crappy parents.
It's the parents who have created the bad public school system more than anything.   My wife had subbed for a few years before getting a full time teaching job.   When you see 2nd graders with mohawks wearing dirty torn up clothes, it's not surprising when they constantly act up.   This is in a small community.    Just allot of crappy parents.


#39    F3SS

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 12:34 AM

You're right. Screw it. Give them more pay. I wouldn't put up with a bunch of brats.


#40    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 02:14 AM

I honestly love my job.
And I'm more then happy to work the $40 an hour job because of the small class sizes and an admin team that supports you over the $60 an hour job because of the large class sizes and sod all support from admin.

Maybe that's what needs to be done in the US.
Smaller classes. As in less then 20 kids in a class small classes.

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#41    F3SS

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:31 AM

Yea but isn't there only like 20 million people on your entire continent? I bet we have at least that many students alone. I doubt that's possible where most of the school problems occur in the city.

Edited by -Mr_Fess-, 12 March 2013 - 03:32 AM.


#42    ninjadude

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:38 AM

The media and those with an agenda tend to overreact about this. However, if you did a bit about this PARTICULAR strike

Quote


My name is Christina Potter and I have taught in the Strongsville City Schools in Strongsville, Ohio for the last eight years.
When I was hired in Strongsville, a great community with excellent schools, many other teachers said I was lucky, and they were jealous of my new job, and during the first two years, they were right; things were great with all sides working together,and we earned Ohio’s highest ranking, Excellent with Distinction.
As time went on a division started to occur between the administration and the teachers. During our 2010 contract negotiations the school stated that times were difficult and they needed the teachers to make concessions. In good faith, and promise of a levy, we agreed to an additional two year pay freeze on top of the three years we had already taken. We also increased our medical expenses, took on an additional duty period, and agreed to work two days unpaid. Times were tough, but everyone was striving to make Strongsville great.
Then, everything went haywire. With the ink still drying on our contract, the Board tried to take the levy off the ballot but failed, so instead, they informed the community to vote the levy down. Then we learned that while the district cried broke in 2010, it spent $500,000 to hire an attorney who publicizes himself as a union breaker. Every school district in this area that has hired him has either gone on strike or threatened to. Needless to say, the teachers, who negotiated in good faith, were outraged.
When our contract ended in June 2012, the district asked for extra time before negotiating to get its finances in order, so on July 19th, the first negotiation session took place. Upon walking in, their attorney put a contract down on the table and told us it was a take it or leave it offer and refused to negotiate one item at a time. After months of failing to negotiate a contract, our Education Association declared an impasse, and a Federal Mediator came in to oversee negotiations.
http://dianeravitch....o-are-striking/

As I've been saying. The teachers are not the bad guys here. The unions are not the bad guys here. They did take cuts and concessions. Teachers are not stupid. The problem is the rampant attempts at union busting.

Edited by ninjadude, 12 March 2013 - 03:40 AM.

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#43    F3SS

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:55 AM

I think public unions do well for the employees. What they do for economics is not so well. Maybe the school district knows what they're doing, financially. Maybe they can't afford everything the teachers want but all least they all still have a job. Maybe that expensive lawyer is worth it for the money they're trying to save in the long run. Is there any stories of corruption and huge salaries on the district board? If not, maybe they're trying to do the community at large a service. If they can't afford the demands either taxes need raised and/or layoffs and school closings will ensue. But if that's what it takes to make the teachers feel worth while at the expense of the community than taxes and closings are the answer. I dunno, just a thought. The union probably spends $500k of dues and more on all kinds of stuff like lawyers and headquarters and likely lobbying.


#44    ninjadude

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 03:57 AM

View Post-Mr_Fess-, on 12 March 2013 - 03:55 AM, said:

I think public unions do well for the employees. What they do for economics is not so well. Maybe the school district knows what they're doing, financially. Maybe they can't afford everything the teachers want but all least they all still have a job. Maybe that expensive lawyer is worth it for the money they're trying to save in the long run. Is there any stories of corruption and huge salaries on the district board? If not, maybe they're trying to do the community at large a service. If they can't afford the demands either taxes need raised and/or layoffs and school closings will ensue. But if that's what it takes to make the teachers feel worth while at the expense of the community than taxes and closings are the answer. I dunno, just a thought. The union probably spends $500k of dues and more on all kinds of stuff like lawyers and headquarters and likely lobbying.

What you're completely missing in your very tortured logic is that the teachers DIDN'T MAKE ANY DEMANDS.

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#45    F3SS

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 04:05 AM

Demands, desires, upandcomins,  whatever... More than they get now. Regardless if its enough or not, in the world of finances more pay requires more revenue or less jobs. Perhaps you should audit that town and school board and see where the money's going.





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