Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


- - - - -

About nothing

nothing nothingness

  • Please log in to reply
45 replies to this topic

#1    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 10:06 AM

There is no such thing as nothing.  It is a contradiction in terms.


#2    Norbert Dentressangle

Norbert Dentressangle

    A bit dull

  • Member
  • 26,429 posts
  • Joined:09 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Tanybwlch

  • Vampires are people too.

Posted 24 March 2013 - 10:28 AM

Well, nothing is no thing, isn't it; it isn't something in itself, it's an absence of anything else. So no, there is no such thing as nothing, but I think it is true to itself in that it says what it isn't.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#3    spud the mackem

spud the mackem

    Spud the Mackem

  • Member
  • 3,883 posts
  • Joined:28 Oct 2011
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Yeo Valley,Darkest Somerset.

  • man who ask for nothing shall never be disappointed

Posted 24 March 2013 - 10:44 AM

I alaways thought nothing was Zero ?

(1) try your best, ............if that dont work.
(2) try your second best, ........if that dont work
(3) give up you aint gonna win

#4    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:06 AM

Zero is the infinitesimal (infinitely small) point on the number line between the positive and the negative numbers.  Is it really something -- we give it a name?


#5    GreenmansGod

GreenmansGod

    Bio-Electric sentient being.

  • Member
  • 10,451 posts
  • Joined:23 Jun 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Hurricane State

  • May the laughter ye give today return to thee 3 fold.

Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:06 AM

Comes in kind of handy in math. Thank you, India for 0.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#6    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 11:13 AM

Actually what I am after is something less abstract than zero, although zero is worth a good long conversation.

If time is quantized, what is "between" each Plank moment?  If time is not quantized, how does it ever get anywhere?

Where is an electron when it "jumps" between shells?

What was before the beginning of time?  If "nothing," (which I think is the correct answer), what does that mean?

Can you make sense out of my asserting that nothing cannot exist and still saying that there was nothing before the beginning of time?  How about, "nothing is not something.?


#7    lightly

lightly

    metaphysical therapist

  • Member
  • 6,312 posts
  • Joined:01 Apr 2009
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Michigan U.S.A.

  • "The future ain't what it used to be"
    Yogi Berra

Posted 24 March 2013 - 12:23 PM

Nothing , and nothingness,  are words we use to describe the complete absence of matter&energy.   ( I think nothingness is an odd word.. it seems to give "nothing"  a quality or a state )

I don't believe in nothing   (lol)  ...  something cannot come from nothing.

We also use the word nothing in these ways :

nothing |ˈnəTHiNG|pronoun   not anything; no single thing: I said nothing | there's nothing you can do | they found nothing wrong.• something of no importance or concern: “What are you laughing at?” “Oh, nothing, sir.” | they are nothing to him | [ as noun ] : no longer could we be treated as nothings.• (in calculations) no amount; zero.
adjective [ attrib. ] informalhaving no prospect of progress; of no value: he had a series of nothing jobs.
adverb not at all: she cares nothing for others | he looks nothing like the others.• [ postpositive ] informal used to contradict something emphatically: “This is a surprise.” “Surprise nothing.”

   •


Edited by lightly, 24 March 2013 - 12:31 PM.

Important:  The above may contain errors, inaccuracies, omissions, and other limitations.

#8    Norbert Dentressangle

Norbert Dentressangle

    A bit dull

  • Member
  • 26,429 posts
  • Joined:09 May 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Tanybwlch

  • Vampires are people too.

Posted 24 March 2013 - 12:46 PM

is not "nothing" essentially similar to the concept of Nirvana? Don't they basically mean the absence of anything, so they're both essentially "meaningless" terms, in that they mean, literally, nothing?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#9    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 01:05 PM

 Lord Vetinari, on 24 March 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

is not "nothing" essentially similar to the concept of Nirvana? Don't they basically mean the absence of anything, so they're both essentially "meaningless" terms, in that they mean, literally, nothing?
I don't think of Nirvana as nothing.  It would be called that if that is what it were.  Still, some of the more extreme notions about it suggest such a thing.


#10    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 01:10 PM

 lightly, on 24 March 2013 - 12:23 PM, said:

Nothing , and nothingness,  are words we use to describe the complete absence of matter&energy.   ( I think nothingness is an odd word.. it seems to give "nothing"  a quality or a state )

/>
Well, absence of matter and energy describes empty space, which to me is something.


#11    ReaperS_ParadoX

ReaperS_ParadoX

    “What’s wrong with accepting madness?

  • Member
  • 2,521 posts
  • Joined:29 Jun 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:A really cold region devoid of stars

  • The boundaries which divide Life from Death are at best shadowy and vague. Who shall say where the one ends, and where the other begins?

Posted 24 March 2013 - 04:06 PM

*snip*

Edited by Saru, 24 March 2013 - 08:10 PM.
Video removed for copyright reasons

COME WITH ME. OVERWHELMING POWER AND MADNESS AWAIT

THAT IS NOT DEAD WHICH CAN ETERNAL LIE AND WITH STRANGE AEONS EVEN DEATH MAY DIE

#12    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 05:27 PM

Unbelievable that they tackle this on a popular level, pseudo-dramatics and all.  At first all the flashiness turned me off, but I decided to be patient and see it through.  Although the film necessarily simplifies things to the point of seeming arbitrary, if one is willing to accept what they say unquestioningly, one gets an idea of it all.

The point is that space/time is a thing.  It is not "nothing."  Among other things it is responsible for inertia and, of course, gravity.  At the quantum level space/time is a seething ocean, and who knows what it becomes at the far smaller scales of Plank and company.

This is physics.  I am more interested in philosophy.  What is "nothing" and can it exist.  Well of course if there is nothing, then nothing exists, so it exists and it doesn't exist.  (The White Knight asks Alice to look down the road and tell him what she sees.  She replies, "nothing."  "Wow, what great eyesight, to be able to see nothing at at such a distance."

Of course that is wordplay.  If there was a beginning of time, then there was no "before."  We don't say, "nothing" was before in the sense that this thing -- nothing -- was there.  We say "nothing" was before because there was no thing.  No time, no space, no energy, no forces, no thought, no mind.

It is much like the "nothing" that exists between the "moments" of Plank time.  There is no interval there from its perspectiuve, although from the outside we measure one.  From all eternity to the beginning of time is nothing -- no "from" to be worried about -- a big zero of units of time.


#13    ReaperS_ParadoX

ReaperS_ParadoX

    “What’s wrong with accepting madness?

  • Member
  • 2,521 posts
  • Joined:29 Jun 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:A really cold region devoid of stars

  • The boundaries which divide Life from Death are at best shadowy and vague. Who shall say where the one ends, and where the other begins?

Posted 24 March 2013 - 05:39 PM

I understand but then there wouldnt be darkness because that would be something, I think its hard for people to visualize nothing, atleast it is for me. I mean like it was said before nothing is the absence of everything. My fault I didnt know you were trying to go the philisophical way :blush:

Edited by R4z3rsPar4d0x, 24 March 2013 - 05:42 PM.

COME WITH ME. OVERWHELMING POWER AND MADNESS AWAIT

THAT IS NOT DEAD WHICH CAN ETERNAL LIE AND WITH STRANGE AEONS EVEN DEATH MAY DIE

#14    Frank Merton

Frank Merton

    Blue fish

  • Member
  • 14,829 posts
  • Joined:22 Jan 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam

  • fmerton.blogspot.com

Posted 24 March 2013 - 05:55 PM

One interesting concept I got out of the film was that information cannot be destroyed; if you are smart enough you can reconstruct stuff, and that stuff is reducible to bits (ones and zeros) describing it.

That sounds like a conservation principle, except they didn't say nothing can create information, but I wonder if that wouldn't necessarily follow.  In that case all the information of the present universe existed in that "nothing" that was not before the Big Bang.

I think I had better go to bed.


#15    StarMountainKid

StarMountainKid

    Cheese

  • Member
  • 4,632 posts
  • Joined:17 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Star Mountain, Corporate States of America

  • We have problems because we stray from what is innocent and pure.

Posted 24 March 2013 - 07:53 PM

In one sense nothing is the unknown. If I haven't learned calculus, calculus is nothing for me, for my mind. Maybe the ultimate nothing is like this, the unknowable. A non-conceptional non-concept that we try to define and conceptualize anyway using words. An impossible task in  my opinion.

The best way I can comprehend nothing is trying to see what is behind my head. I can't see behind my head, so visually that is an example of nothing for me.

The acceptance of authority does not lead to intelligence.
A mind untouched by thought...the end of knowledge.
To see reality loose your opinions.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users