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Secretary Kerry presses Israel & Palestine


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#1    sear

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Posted 07 April 2013 - 10:18 PM

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   Kerry presses Israel and Palestinians for concessions to pave way for peace talks

RAMALLAH, West Bank — Beginning a tentative round of Middle East shuttle diplomacy, Secretary of State John F. Kerry is asking for small concessions from both Israel and the Palestinians to pave the way for new talks, U.S. and other officials said Sunday.
Kerry first visited Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, who has resisted new talks for most of the past four years. His government had sought to file a complaint with the International Criminal Court against Israel over homebuilding in Jerusalem, but put the plan on hold shortly before Kerry arrived.




Kerry presses Israel and Palestinians for concessions


During Middle East trip, Kerry also says Israel, Turkey must stick to agreement to end their estrangement.http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/kerry-presses-israel-turkey-to-mend-ties/2013/04/07/493be3a4-9f7e-11e2-9c03-6952ff305f35_story.html  
Is this the biggest blunder of Secretary Kerry's brief tenure?

When Israeli citizens were being massacred by the dozens, on buses and at cafe's, by homicide bombers; there was an emergency to respond to.

But in April 2013, things are fairly calm.
Is it not painfully obvious that peace talks are a higher priority to Kerry than to either Israel, or Palestine?

Is this more about middle east peace; or Kerry's portfolio?


#2    and then

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 02:07 AM

Imo Kerry is just carrying Obama's water (of course) and the end game is forcing a deal on Israel while doing the minimum to discomfit the Palestinians.  Perhaps I'm wrong.  But I do not think Obama's record on Israel is as pristine as he says.  I admit I have a bias toward Israel and due to my faith I cannot see a real peace occurring in the M.E. that has been negotiated by man.  But from a purely secular POV there is abundant evidence that these two sides are as far apart as any two groups of human beings EVER have been.  The Bible states that a peace treaty of 7 years will be enforced at some point and broken at the 3.5 year mark.  I don't think this is the treaty but it could be the immediate predecessor.

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  for what could be, the darkest age...
“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#3    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:23 AM

sometimes when you can't fight the bushfire, you put out spot fires.
Perhaps he's trying to establish himself as, if not someone who can "bring peace" but at least get them to a table talking, that'd be kudos in and of itself.

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I will permit it to pass over me and to move through me. And when it is gone I will turn the inner eye to see it's path.
When the fear is gone, there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.

#4    acidhead

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 07:05 AM

View Postand then, on 08 April 2013 - 02:07 AM, said:

Imo Kerry is just carrying Obama's water (of course) and the end game is forcing a deal on Israel while doing the minimum to discomfit the Palestinians.  Perhaps I'm wrong.  But I do not think Obama's record on Israel is as pristine as he says.  I admit I have a bias toward Israel and due to my faith I cannot see a real peace occurring in the M.E. that has been negotiated by man.  But from a purely secular POV there is abundant evidence that these two sides are as far apart as any two groups of human beings EVER have been.  The Bible states that a peace treaty of 7 years will be enforced at some point and broken at the 3.5 year mark.  I don't think this is the treaty but it could be the immediate predecessor.

Just curious...

Compared to what?

"there is no wrong or right - just popular opinion"

#5    and then

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 11:12 AM

View Postacidhead, on 08 April 2013 - 07:05 AM, said:

Just curious...

Compared to what?
I don't understand the question with regard to my statement you've bolded.  What are you asking?

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#6    AsteroidX

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 12:14 PM

I wish our leaders were popular like this. :whistle:




#7    Corp

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 02:18 PM

Blunder? How is pushing for peace talks a blunder? The US has been pushing for peace talks for a while now. There's really nothing new here.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things: the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth a war, is much worse...A man who has nothing which he is willing to fight for, nothing which he cares more about than he does about his personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

#8    sear

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 03:16 PM

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"The US has been pushing for peace talks for a while now. There's really nothing new here." C
Yes, when there was a semblance of enthusiasm among the primaries; we tried it repeatedly, and failed all but once (President Carter).
It's obvious at the moment, there's simply not much will to negotiate on either side; and less prospect for success than in most previous attempts.

Quote

"Blunder? How is pushing for peace talks a blunder?" C
The U.S. establishes international prowess with success.
Stacking together a tower of doggy doo, and having it collapse all over U.S. is only going to make us look like %#@$!
I predict Secretary Kerry will expend U.S. resources, expend U.S. persuasive capital, and get less in return than he expends.

Peace in the Middle East? Between Israel and Palestine? WHERE DO I SIGN!!
FABULOUS IDEA! ! !
Do you really think whatever Secretary Kerry will do will lead to that? Posted Image I wouldn't bet on it.


#9    Corp

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:03 PM

The US has been trying to get a Middle East peace process going for decades now. This is just them taking another kick at the can. This is no more a blunder than the last dozen times this has been attempted.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things: the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth a war, is much worse...A man who has nothing which he is willing to fight for, nothing which he cares more about than he does about his personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

#10    sear

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 04:30 PM

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"This is no more a blunder than the last dozen times this has been attempted." C
Without context I might agree.

But in context of Netanyahu's ruthless expansionism, in context of Palestine's redirected focus toward its own prosperity instead of Israel's destruction;
that puts the burden on Kerry.

If Kerry, the mediator, is more interested in negotiating peace than either of the primaries; Kerry insinuates himself into a position of great weakness.

Has the U.S. mediated before? UNQUESTIONABLY!!

Has the U.S. ever mediated against such formidable adversity (aka disinterest)?
I couldn't cite an example.
Can you?


#11    and then

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 07:41 PM

View PostAsteroidX, on 08 April 2013 - 12:14 PM, said:

I wish our leaders were popular like this. :whistle:


The look on Putin's face was PRICELESS!  :w00t:  Attack of the TATAS

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
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“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#12    AsteroidX

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Posted 08 April 2013 - 09:15 PM

I thought he took it very well. He even gave a :tu:


#13    Corp

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Posted 09 April 2013 - 04:24 PM

View Postsear, on 08 April 2013 - 04:30 PM, said:

Without context I might agree.

But in context of Netanyahu's ruthless expansionism, in context of Palestine's redirected focus toward its own prosperity instead of Israel's destruction;
that puts the burden on Kerry.

If Kerry, the mediator, is more interested in negotiating peace than either of the primaries; Kerry insinuates himself into a position of great weakness.

Has the U.S. mediated before? UNQUESTIONABLY!!

Has the U.S. ever mediated against such formidable adversity (aka disinterest)?
I couldn't cite an example.
Can you?

Israel and Palestine are actually relatively peaceful when compared to their general relationship. And while neither side is that interested in peace that's hardly new. The fact is the US has been pushing for a peace treaty for decades. Since the latest peace talks broke down the US has encouraged both sides to get together several times. Kerry it just following the set policy for not only the last four years but also the last several decades. Even taking in all the proper context there is still no major blunder here.

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things: the decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth a war, is much worse...A man who has nothing which he is willing to fight for, nothing which he cares more about than he does about his personal safety, is a miserable creature who has no chance of being free, unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

#14    praetorian-legio XIII

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Posted 09 April 2013 - 08:31 PM

Well at least he didn't referr to them as Israestine & Palerael.


#15    sear

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Posted 09 April 2013 - 08:36 PM

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"The fact is the US has been pushing for a peace treaty for decades ... Kerry it just following the set policy for not only the last four years but also the last several decades." C
My point precisely!
It's the same old policy, in substantially different political environment.
What might have been perfectly sensible decades ago is in 2013, incongruous; a certain failure.





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