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Secret Soviet UFO studies revealed


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#16    Sakari

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 04:26 PM



Edited by Sakari, 15 April 2013 - 04:29 PM.

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#17    JimOberg

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 05:14 PM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 15 April 2013 - 04:14 PM, said:

Hey Jim, not everyone is as aware of the Russian state of affairs regarding UFO's as your good self. I'm sure you are aware that learning is a continual process and most often personal inquiry into these matters is often a work in progress. Some of us simply aren't up to speed on some of this however with the information being given on this board and discussion of such information we (some of us, at any rate) are getting there. :tu:

The bigger issue is this -- how can we use the vast resources of the Internet and its search engines to check out ANY claims of this sort for 'contrarian' views and assessments? I'm still struggling to develop -- heck, to even DEFINE -- an algorithm that we all can use to rein in the torrent of multiply-echoed myths that search engines deliver. It's not just me and my own work, it's the thousands of others who have contributed unique insights to controversial topics that will NEVER be seen by search engines which only rate by mass appeal.

Any suggestions?


#18    Tutankhaten-pasheri

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 05:31 PM

I mentioned before months back about Soviet UFO being conveniently seen, though not in all cases, close to "secret" bases concerned with aeronautics of various types. Most famously at Voronezh, with closed airforce base just across the road, literally, from the Tupolev factory the produced Konkordski, and other "stuff". And UFO reports, including a few photos (which I do not have to hand) from the Tver area, which by strange co-incidence housed a closed airforce base that conducted research into anti-aircraft equipment and some odd sort of drone........


#19    diablo_04

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 05:49 PM

How can I take this seriously when they quote the joke of the Russian Prime Minister D. Medvedev as true fact, and it was obviously a joke.... :td:

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#20    Esoteric Toad

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:05 PM

View Postquillius, on 15 April 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

why not? if we studied the rain forest for 40 years then found out all we wanted to know, would the monkeys say 'hey why all those visits from these humanz and then suddenly none.... not a single photograph? you mean you havent seen a photograph....that doesnt equal there isnt/wasnt any.


maybe because they are not as frequent as past years? maybe only around 2 billion of the 6billion have cameras? maybe the ufos only show for such a short length of time fiddling to get a phone out and capture it just doesnt happen......lastly a camera phone with footage of a light in the sky equals evidence does it?



so you have seen earth shattering images from the 1940-70s then?



concrete evidence like grainy wobbly camera phone footage?
The earth shattering images line was a bit tongue in cheek. It seems as we gain the ability to capture life in real time the alien/UFO phenomena has become rarer. Why were there so many photographs back in the day when film cameras were more fiddly than even my super cheapo cell. Hit one button and that is all?

The idea that as our personal access to capture picutres and video has advanced and it just so happens that the aliens/ufos have buggered off is silly and sounds like a convenient excuse to me.

JMO.


#21    Tutankhaten-pasheri

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:11 PM

View Postdiablo_04, on 15 April 2013 - 05:49 PM, said:

How can I take this seriously when they quote the joke of the Russian Prime Minister D. Medvedev as true fact, and it was obviously a joke.... :td:
Worse is the lack of knowledge of Russian media. Medvedev gave that quote to REN TV, and everybody knows that TV station is a complete joke. Medvedev knows this and was simply playing to the REN TV audience. All irony and tounge in cheek........


#22    Starseed hybrid 1111

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:35 PM

its good to know that some countries actually took the UFO sightings seriously and honest too.this is good news to me and many people.believers,serious researchers and open minded people alike i am here to also send a message as well lets focus on the research,finding evidence and proof on UFOs and E.Ts lets ignore and forget the skeptics and etc the only thing that they are good at is delaying us and research by  giving them the attention and slowing us down.we must unite and all help each other lets put our ego aside for a moment and instead focus on the research and study.and above all lets be honest and clear with the public and results please and thanks.but other nations do take these events and etc seriously not like the U.S.A i wonder why???and by the way i am being sarcastic


#23    Slave2Fate

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:49 PM

View PostJimOberg, on 15 April 2013 - 05:14 PM, said:

The bigger issue is this -- how can we use the vast resources of the Internet and its search engines to check out ANY claims of this sort for 'contrarian' views and assessments? I'm still struggling to develop -- heck, to even DEFINE -- an algorithm that we all can use to rein in the torrent of multiply-echoed myths that search engines deliver. It's not just me and my own work, it's the thousands of others who have contributed unique insights to controversial topics that will NEVER be seen by search engines which only rate by mass appeal.

Any suggestions?

Heck Jim, if I had an answer to that I'd probably turn that information toward something a little more lucrative than discussing the paranormal! ^_^

Unfortunately I think this is the best that can be offered at the moment, believers and skeptics hashing out the details in a public forum, each bringing their own bit of insight and information to the fray. I think there are certain benefits to be had in such a venue in my opinion.

I understand and echo the frustration over the seemingly countless sites that simply provide outdated woo woo garbage without including more recent or overlooked information to balance the credibility of said site however to combat that would involve more than just a search string in a browser, truth be told. I wish I did have an answer for that little conundrum. :tu:

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#24    JimOberg

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:54 PM

View PostAndromedan Starseed 333, on 15 April 2013 - 06:35 PM, said:

its good to know that some countries actually took the UFO sightings seriously and honest too.this is good news to me and many people.believers,serious researchers and open minded people alike i am here to also send a message as well lets focus on the research,finding evidence and proof on UFOs and E.Ts lets ignore and forget the skeptics and etc the only thing that they are good at is delaying us and research by  giving them the attention and slowing us down.we must unite and all help each other lets put our ego aside for a moment and instead focus on the research and study.and above all lets be honest and clear with the public and results please and thanks.but other nations do take these events and etc seriously not like the U.S.A i wonder why???and by the way i am being sarcastic

AS, what you find 'good to know' is a delusion. Zigel's mid-1960s officially allowed reporting on Soviet UFO reports were suddenly terminated in early 1968 when it became clear they were NOT real 'UFOs', but detailed technical descriptions of Soviet military missile and space weapons exercises, imaginatively misperceived [but still containing useful intelligence data for Western analysts]. Rockets from Plesetsk and Kapustin Yar and Baykonur, from White Sea submarines, from orbiting rockets thrusting over the Crimea, and especially in 1967-8 the treaty-banned thermonuclear warhead entry tests [that created crescent-shaped clouds soaring across the skies of Ukraine and the Volga and Caucasus] were behind practically ALL the most spectacular sightings. In later years, you can presume the Moscow government maintained a disinformation program to label any similar reports as 'flying saucers' so as to lower the attention level the stories would get from Western intelligence agencies. Too bad nobody in Western ufology ever caught on, either. Any 'serious' study by science panels would have been charades to deflect attention from what most of the reports really were caused by -- top secret military aerospace activity. THAT was the 'Moscow coverup', not any 'TRUE UFO' secrets, as I see it. .


#25    Starseed hybrid 1111

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 07:09 PM

does Russia still look into UFO reports though?i hope they do as well as any other nation if the united states won't someone else has to.mainstream science should look into this as well.i mean what are you afraid of?


#26    PersonFromPorlock

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 07:35 PM

The Soviet Union wasn't a place where honesty was much regarded, since government organizations competed for official funding; these reports could easily have been made up out of the whole cloth for just that purpose. Certainly some of the 1990s KGB videos on UFOs were obvious fakes, with 'Soviet' aircraft cockpit pictures showing American ejection seats, for instance.

Edited by PersonFromPorlock, 15 April 2013 - 07:39 PM.


#27    JimOberg

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 08:04 PM

View PostAndromedan Starseed 333, on 15 April 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

...   i mean what are you afraid of?

I am afraid of ignorance and false belief, and the bad choices that are their consequences, and work diligently to dispel it.

Regarding russian UFO stories, you, to the contrary, seem to revel in NOT knowing the full facts of stuff you enjoy believing.

Is your avoidance of such inconvenient insights based on fear?


#28    JimOberg

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 08:06 PM

View PostPersonFromPorlock, on 15 April 2013 - 07:35 PM, said:

The Soviet Union wasn't a place where honesty was much regarded, since government organizations competed for official funding; these reports could easily have been made up out of the whole cloth for just that purpose. Certainly some of the 1990s KGB videos on UFOs were obvious fakes, with 'Soviet' aircraft cockpit pictures showing American ejection seats, for instance.

Exactly. After the fall of the USSR, several Moscow psychology professors described how they set up fake ESP study labs to get military contracts, and used the money for real research while delivering bogus study results. "If they didn't give us the money", one rationalized, "they just would have bought more tanks."


#29    lost_shaman

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 11:43 PM

View PostPersonFromPorlock, on 15 April 2013 - 07:35 PM, said:

The Soviet Union wasn't a place where honesty was much regarded, since government organizations competed for official funding; these reports could easily have been made up out of the whole cloth for just that purpose. Certainly some of the 1990s KGB videos on UFOs were obvious fakes, with 'Soviet' aircraft cockpit pictures showing American ejection seats, for instance.

Your wrong about that. It was just a B rated documentary with Roger Moore that was using stock footage  and added a cheap CGI UFO and they claimed it was KGB footage but it wasn't really KGB footage so it is not the KGB's credibilty that was on the line but the producers of documentary called KGB UFO Files.

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#30    PersonFromPorlock

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 11:54 PM

If I'm wrong about that then I stand corrected. But what about the film of the half-buried (but no divot!) saucer, with everyone standing around it looking bored? Wasn't that a KGB product?





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