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The Gold Chain of Huascar

gold chainlost treasure inca huaina capac huáscar inca

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#1    The_Spartan

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 01:01 PM

I was searching for lost treasures and came across the mention of the Golden Chain of Huascar. So, digging up further, i came across these

Quote

According to Inca tradition, the chain was crafted on orders from the Inca ruler Huaina Capac to celebrate the naming ceremony of his son Huascar.  Garcilaso says Huaina Capac himself conceived the idea of the chain, as a fitting embellishment on the traditional Inca naming ceremony for his own first-born son. In the central dance of that ceremony, “men formed in line, facing the reigning Inca, at a certain distance from him, and some two or three hundred in number. Each one held the hand, not of his immediate neighbor, but of the one following him, and thus they formed a sort of chain. They then began to advance little by little toward the king, in slow rhythm, taking, alternately, one step backward and two steps forward, as in those Spanish dances called double step and repeat. It occurred to the Inca that it would be still more meet, solemn, and majestical, if they were to execute this dance, not by simply forming a chain with their bodies, but by holding in their hands a chain of real, solid gold.”

Quote

A golden chain 800 feet long? Perhaps it was even longer: One description sets its length at 350 yards, or 1,050 feet. One of the earliest accounts claims the ceremonial cord was as thick as a man’s wrist. If made of pure gold, it must have weighed a ton or more. Estimates of two tons are common. One writer believes it weighed ten tons! (This would mean each of the 200 dancers would have carried 100 pounds of chain – an unlikely burden for a dance ritual.) Whatever the case, the chain’s pure gold value would be reckoned in the tens to hundreds of millions of dollars today. Its historical value as the grandest surviving Inca artifact would render it virtually priceless.
Source

It is said that the Incans ahd hidden the Golden Chain in Urcos Lake, which is is situated at the northern limit of the small town of Urcos, about 40 kilometers southeast of the former Inca capital, Cusco, in the southern Andes of Peru at 13°41' southern latitude and 70°38' western longitude at an altitude of 3,180 meters.

Quote

Lake Urcos is known as the lake where the Incas were hiding a "golden chain". The stories written down by Spanish chronics say that Huascar emptied the lake by constructing a tunnel, constructed a building on the lake's seabed, where he stored large quantities of gold and flooded the lake again in order to hide away the gold from his brother, with whom he was at war. The Spaniards gave that much credibility to the story that they attempted themselves to dig a tunnel and empty the lake, which was frustrated when they hit hard rock that did not permit further digging.
Huacarpay is the birthplace of the Inca Huascar. The ruins of his palace are situated on the south western edge of the biggest of the three lakes forming Huacarpay. According to the archeological surveys existent in the area, it was estimated by Johan Reinhard and the local INC representatives that most probably archeological remains within the lagoon should be situated in the southern half of the biggest lake of Huacarpay, right in front of Huascars birthplace. There were no specific legends indicating archeological remains in this lake.
Source

legends tell of other treasures such as "The Garden of the Sun" which is described as

Quote

a life-sized facsimile of a country garden, complete with rows of corn, sheep and shepherds – all fashioned of pure gold. The chronicler Pedro Sarmiento de Gamboa (1532-1589) placed this garden near the Temple of the Sun: “They had a garden in which the lumps of earth were pieces of fine gold. These were cleverly sown with maize – the stalks, leaves and ears of which were all pure gold. They were so well planted that nothing would disturb them. Besides all this, they had more than twenty sheep with their young. The shepherds who guarded the sheep were armed with slings and staves made of gold and silver. Pots, vases and every kind of vessel were cast from fine gold.”


Treasure hunting anyone???


Ps : the Golden Chain was one of the treasures Dirk Pitt & his team from Numa hunted for and found in the novel " Inca Gold" by Clive cussler. there is a brief mention of a Golden Armour of  the mummy of Naymlap,  a mythical god king of the sican Culture, famous for its gold artefacts. I wonder if this golden Armour of Naymplap is true!!!!

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#2    Myles

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 01:34 PM

I have to think that the lake had been searched over by the National governments.

"Lake Urcos has been screened in a very detailed manner with 143 recorded profiles taken in 6 days. Wall like structures of several meters of extension and heights at different locations in the lake’s sediment could be positively identified by scuba diving as fragments of natural platforms formed by the roots of reed grass, being ripped off by mudslides or being separated by aging and growth processes from the reed grass belt along the shoreline and having sunk to the lakes bottom, “sticking” vertically in the lakes sediment. The profile of the lake is extremely even. There is a steep fall on all sides of the lake to a depth of 14 meters. The rest of the lake’s bed is formed by a flat plane with an average depth of approximately 15 meters. The lake has a maximum depth of 15.4 meters. No archeological remains like walls, man-made structures or other large remains within the lake’s sediment up to a depth of two meters could be identified."

http://mundoazul.org...ion/lake-urcos/


#3    Ashotep

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 01:53 PM

That would definitely be a place I would like to explore. Peru has so many ancient sites that would be great to see.


#4    The_Spartan

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 02:23 PM

View PostMyles, on 15 April 2013 - 01:34 PM, said:

I have to think that the lake had been searched over by the National governments.

"Lake Urcos has been screened in a very detailed manner with 143 recorded profiles taken in 6 days. Wall like structures of several meters of extension and heights at different locations in the lake’s sediment could be positively identified by scuba diving as fragments of natural platforms formed by the roots of reed grass, being ripped off by mudslides or being separated by aging and growth processes from the reed grass belt along the shoreline and having sunk to the lakes bottom, “sticking” vertically in the lakes sediment. The profile of the lake is extremely even. There is a steep fall on all sides of the lake to a depth of 14 meters. The rest of the lake’s bed is formed by a flat plane with an average depth of approximately 15 meters. The lake has a maximum depth of 15.4 meters. No archeological remains like walls, man-made structures or other large remains within the lake’s sediment up to a depth of two meters could be identified."

http://mundoazul.org...ion/lake-urcos/

Lol. We can wish..right.

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#5    Jon101

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 02:47 PM

This is really interesting, thanks for posting. Would a chain that large break under its own weight?, gold is quite soft after all.
Garcilaso is a very interesting fellow and was of Royal Incan stock If I recall.

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#6    Abramelin

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:04 PM

View PostThe_Spartan, on 15 April 2013 - 01:01 PM, said:

I was searching for lost treasures and came across the mention of the Golden Chain of Huascar. So, digging up further, i came across these




Source

It is said that the Incans ahd hidden the Golden Chain in Urcos Lake, which is is situated at the northern limit of the small town of Urcos, about 40 kilometers southeast of the former Inca capital, Cusco, in the southern Andes of Peru at 13°41' southern latitude and 70°38' western longitude at an altitude of 3,180 meters.

Source

legends tell of other treasures such as "The Garden of the Sun" which is described as




Treasure hunting anyone???


Ps : the Golden Chain was one of the treasures Dirk Pitt & his team from Numa hunted for and found in the novel " Inca Gold" by Clive cussler. there is a brief mention of a Golden Armour of  the mummy of Naymlap,  a mythical god king of the sican Culture, famous for its gold artefacts. I wonder if this golden Armour of Naymplap is true!!!!



Several chronicles speak in particular about a wonderful "gold chain" which the Inca Huayna Capac had made execute to commemorate the birth of Huascar, the heir legitimizes of the Incas, which Atawualpa, his half brother, will make murder. This yahuirka, the length of which was at least two hundred meters, had, as it is said, links so big as the inch of a man. Garcilaso de la Vega, a half-blood who spent his youth to Cusco, claims that its weight was as much as two hundred Indians succeeded hardly in lifting it. It was covered with articulated golden plaques which, feigning the scales of the skin of a snake, sparkled in the Sun. The conquistadors tried vainly to seize it. But the legend tells that this inestimable golden chain would have secretly been returned, by the very Indians, up to the kingdom of Grán Païtiti and thrown in a lagoon, accompanied with quantities of objects of a priceless value.

(crap translation, I know)

http://www.granpaiti...?id=121&lang=en


According to legend the first Inca rulers Manco Inca and Mama Ocllo came forth from the Island of the Sun in Lake Titicaca. They united warring tribes under a common language, Quechua [ME: their own language was probaly Aymara] and a unified religion to create what became one of the most fabulous of ancient empires Tawantinsuyo. Over time, they spread the empire from Ecuador to Chile.

Another legend has it that when the Spanish forces reached Cuzco, the Incas took the two-ton gold chain of Inca Huascar from the temple at Koricancha and threw it into the lake. It has never been found although some years ago Jacques Cousteau mounted an expedition to explore the lake with a mini-submarine.


http://gosouthameric.../blvirtInca.htm


As a testament to the quietly rebellious nature of the more faithful natives, Lake Titicaca allegedly became a secret depository for the Incan empire's gold during the Spanish Conquest. Among the items supposedly buried at the lake's bottom is Inca Huascar's gold chain, weighing 4,400 lbs /2,000 kg and previously stored in the Koricancha – the Temple of the Sun in Cusco – until loyal Indians threw it into the lake to prevent it from falling into Spanish hands. Oceanographer Jacques Yves Cousteau spent eight weeks using mini submarines to explore the depths of the lake but instead of gold found a treasure of a different sort: a previously unknown, enormous, multicolored frog.

http://www.peruforle...ide-history.php

Lost Treasures and Wonders
Charles A. Mills


http://books.google....d chain&f=false


Mystical Fascinations: The Lost City
Charles A. Mills


http://books.google....d chain&f=false



According to Gregorio Sanchez seems that Manco, the grandson of Huayna Capac, wanted to create his own kingdom, not subject to the dominion of his uncle, who was in Cusco.

Also according to Felipe de Alcaya, Manco, sent his son Guaynaapoc (the Young King), to Cusco in order to inform the emperor Huayna Capac of the achivements that were carried out by his father.
Here is another passage of the Chronicles:

The grandson of the Inca sent his son Guaynaapoc to Cusco to inform his uncle Inca Tupac Yupanqui of the achievements made by his father, and did not send him silver or gold...because he did not want that the King took away those precious metals that he got with so much effort and sweat, and before departed instructed him on the secrets of the Rich Land, saying that if one day he wanted to be the lord, he should have said to the Inca, that he had not found anything more than a silver mountain, which is the Paititi as Titi in his language means "silver" and Pai means "that."

But when Guaynaapoc arrived to Cusco, probably in 1537, he found the Spaniards as masters, and therefore decided to return to the Antisuyo, perhaps bringing with him the sacred symbols of Tahuantinsuyo, the great golden Solar Disc and the gold chain of Huascar, as well as the mysterious real and literary quipu, (as they are called by the italian scientist Laura Laurencich Minelli). Here is a passage of the Chronicles of Alcaya:

"When finally the "little king" [Guaynaapoc] reached the city of Cusco, he found the land conquered by Gonzalo Pizarro, and his uncle [Huascar], murdered by the king of Quito [Atahualpa], and the other Inca retreated to Vilcabamba [Manco Inca].
And in that occasion he gathered all the Indians who were on his side, and he invited them to follow him to the new land discovered by his father [Manco] called Mococalpa (and now called Moxos)...
About twenty thousand Indians followed Guaynaapoc, even if, according to the Indians of Cusco, they were more than those that went to Vilcabamba with their king...
They brought with them many cattle and silver craftsmen, and along the way other Indias joined the group, which eventually reached Manatti river *
He finally reached Paititi and was received by his father and other soldiers and his happiness doubled to be in an impregnable kingdom far away from Cusco, which was now conquered by the invaders."

* (Guaporé or Madeira river?)


http://www.yurilever...colo.php?Id=169



The other two interesting evidence on the permanent presence of the Incas in the Amazon jungle are the Chronicles of father Pedro Felipe de Alcaya and Captain Francisco Sanchez Gregorio whose narratives were collected in the Lizarazu informations (1635).

http://www.yurilever...colo.php?Id=169

http://www.yurilever...colo.php?Id=159

http://www.iae.uni-b...rs/meyers-1998b

http://www.redalyc.o...12625273003.pdf



INKA ARCHAEOLOGY IN EASTERN BOLIVIA: SOME ASPECTS

https://docs.google....9KLbt_LqvO69ugw



Incas, Españoles y el Paytiti: la perspectiva desde el "Fuerte de Sabaypata", Oriente de Bolivia (2005)
by Albert Meyers


ABSTRACT
On the basis of the analysis of a “consulta” about the expeditions to the Mojos region and other documents collected during a research project on the cultural history of the Eastern Bolivian Andes it is described how the Dorado or Paytiti myth serves the interests of different social groups of the Early Spanish Colony among them the Jesuits of Santa Cruz in the beginning of their famous Indian Reductions. In this context, an evaluation of the so-called Alcaya chronicle and their indications on the Inka expansion to the Eastern Lowlands is discussed. Key words: Paytiti, Jesuits, Inka, Samaipata


http://www.academia....e_Bolivia_2005_

Posted Image


#7    The_Spartan

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 06:54 PM

Abe, why the hell didnt you go digging for the treasure when you were in peru???
Why the hell did you have to go lovey dovey behind your ex and work as a guide??
you could have been an Indiana Jones, dont you know??

by the way, are you scared of snakes???

Edited by The_Spartan, 15 April 2013 - 06:54 PM.

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#8    Abramelin

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 07:45 PM

Give me money and I will go find that fkg golden chain myself, ok?

I never heard of the damn thing when I lived in Peru.

+++

EDIT:

No, I am not scared of snakes; they taste like chicken.

And monkeys taste like pork, in case you wanna know. That means: they taste GOOoood.

.

Edited by Abramelin, 15 April 2013 - 07:48 PM.


#9    The_Spartan

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Posted 15 April 2013 - 09:01 PM

:whistle:

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#10    TheSearcher

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 09:53 AM

I found this bit, by an Aramco worker, that contains some more info about said golden chain, it's a rather well written en interesting read.

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#11    Abramelin

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 10:44 AM

View PostTheSearcher, on 16 April 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

I found this bit, by an Aramco worker, that contains some more info about said golden chain, it's a rather well written en interesting read.

From your link:

"Pedro Pizarro, a cousin and page of Francisco, and Agustín de Zarate, a royal accountant who arrived in Peru in 1544, agreed with Garcilaso that the chain really existed. But a historian of the 17th century, Fernando de Montesinos, thought it was only a legend: “Everything that is said about the origin of the name of Huascar, especially the story of the golden chain, is pure imagination.” However, modern scholars have questioned Montesinos’ reliability on other subjects, so his debunking is not definitive."

i have the book written by Agustín de Zarate ("The Discovery and Conquest of Peru"), but it has no index so it may take a while to look for what Zarate writes about that golden chain.


#12    Abramelin

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 11:18 AM

View PostAbramelin, on 16 April 2013 - 10:44 AM, said:

From your link:

"Pedro Pizarro, a cousin and page of Francisco, and Agustín de Zarate, a royal accountant who arrived in Peru in 1544, agreed with Garcilaso that the chain really existed. But a historian of the 17th century, Fernando de Montesinos, thought it was only a legend: “Everything that is said about the origin of the name of Huascar, especially the story of the golden chain, is pure imagination.” However, modern scholars have questioned Montesinos’ reliability on other subjects, so his debunking is not definitive."

i have the book written by Agustín de Zarate ("The Discovery and Conquest of Peru"), but it has no index so it may take a while to look for what Zarate writes about that golden chain.

Got it:

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#13    TheSearcher

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 11:24 AM

Nice find Abe. so it wasn't a chain as such but a richely decorated rope with gold..... from what I understand

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#14    Abramelin

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 11:27 AM

View PostTheSearcher, on 16 April 2013 - 11:24 AM, said:

Nice find Abe. so it wasn't a chain as such but a richely decorated rope with gold..... from what I understand

It's a "golden cable". Considering these guys almost swam in gold, I think it really could have been a pure golden chain/cable.


#15    The_Spartan

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Posted 16 April 2013 - 01:50 PM

Multiply 800ft of a pure gold chain with todays gold rates!! :w00t:

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