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Bill to require labeling of GMO foods


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#31    jugoso

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 03:08 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 26 April 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

Fear is being fanned by demonizing Monsanto, as though they had some sort of super-political power.  


Because they do! The most telling evidence that Monsanto's strategy has been an overwhelming succes is the number of former Monsanto employees who have been given jobs in the FDA and other regulatory agencies that monitor Monsanto's products.
Margaret Miller is just one example. While working as a Monsanto researcher, she contributed to a scientific report for the FDA on Monsanto's genetically engineered bovine growth hormone. Shortly before the report was submitted, Miller left Monsanto to work at the FDA, where her first job was to review the same report! Assisting Miller was another former Monsanto researcher, Susan Sechen.
Monsanto´s Government ties

http://www.organicco...anto/#p7APMc1_1

Frank, if you scroll about one third down this report, there is a very nice visual showing many top officials and policy makers and their connections to Monsanto

http://www.organicco...s.org/monsanto/

View PostFrank Merton, on 26 April 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

You can always find hundreds of people to come forward if you give it publicity.

Yes, that is partially true..If more people were aware of what is happening and if major media would give decent coverage to what many believe to be one of the most serious issues we are facing today, not hundreds but millions of people will be questioning this process. In fact many are.

Attached File  gmo US.jpg   171.26K   5 downloads



View PostFrank Merton, on 26 April 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

  What are needed to prove harm is the same that is needed to prove help -- double-blind studies.

Agreed. Long-term and carried out by third party INDEPENDENT researchers..

View PostFrank Merton, on 26 April 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

The FDA's demonstrates that it is nonsense.

The FDA!!! Can you please expand on this idea please. Are you suggesting that the FDA is our protection with this situation?? If so, see above. Or you may want to look at how they have handled the testing with GMO salmon.

http://www.unexplain...opic=242293&hl=

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#32    spartan max2

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 03:10 PM

Or you could belive that Montaso studies are the only studies that are true and honest and all the studies done by these other countries scientist and our independent scientist are just fear mongering. Your call.

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#33    Frank Merton

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 03:26 PM

I can see, and am not surprised, how this board lines up.  Frankly I had never heard of Monsanto, so I wonder why most of the coffee and tea and rice and even the rubber produced here is genetically modified.  Same with a lot of the fruit and even the potatoes.  I'm quite sure socialist Vietnam is not the least bit interested in furthering an American corporation's interest.

I got a feeling countries that are sensible about this stuff are going to have a huge agricultural advantage over those that aren't.  There may be some important agricultural interests behind the scare stuff, that is just an educated guess, since the things are patentable -- scare people just enough to slow them down until the patent expires.

There may be an occurrence somewhere sometime of something bad coming from this.  That is about all that can be said; in the meantime we have a world to feed.


#34    OverSword

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 03:40 PM

But people are not starving because there is not enough food in the world.  People starve mainly because of politics.


#35    Frank Merton

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 03:47 PM

It's a complicated business, but the idea is to lower prices with more efficient production, and, as the European food wall testifies, there is a lot of advanced-country farmer opposition to this.  Feeding the world makes a neat slogan anyway.


#36    Br Cornelius

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 04:02 PM

We are making the whole food supply chain more vulnerable to shocks by concentrating supply to a few seed strains. That is making it more likely that we will have a real food supply crisis in the near future.
The most efficient and productive forms of agriculture have always been conducted at the small scale - but that is a difficult thing for politicians and corporations to manage and make a profit from so they tend to play down this fact in favour of agribusiness.

We are sailing into a looming disaster if we continue to displace small farmers with massive agribusiness farms and a handful of GMO seed varieties.

That is saying nothing about the likely unforseen health effects that we will suffer.

Br Cornelius

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#37    bmk1245

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 01:36 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 25 April 2013 - 02:23 PM, said:

[...]
Basically, the fearmongering about GMO is rank superstition.  [...]
:nw:

Here is the quote that fits this issue:

Quote

Not surprisingly, the idea that changes in God's creation could happen, and especially that they could happen with human direction was strikingly novel and potentially blasphemous. It took the sea change in thinking brought about by Enlightenment to create the intellectual climate where such change could even be considered.
(Hybrid: The History and Science of Plant Breeding, Noel Kingsbury, University Of Chicago Press, 2011).

Thats how things were with breeding few ages ago...

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#38    bmk1245

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 01:41 PM

View PostBr Cornelius, on 26 April 2013 - 04:02 PM, said:

We are making the whole food supply chain more vulnerable to shocks by concentrating supply to a few seed strains. That is making it more likely that we will have a real food supply crisis in the near future.
The most efficient and productive forms of agriculture have always been conducted at the small scale - but that is a difficult thing for politicians and corporations to manage and make a profit from so they tend to play down this fact in favour of agribusiness.

We are sailing into a looming disaster if we continue to displace small farmers with massive agribusiness farms and a handful of GMO seed varieties.

That is saying nothing about the likely unforseen health effects that we will suffer.

Br Cornelius
Can you remind us what happened in 1970? Were there any GM corn back then?

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#39    Br Cornelius

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 01:47 PM

View Postbmk1245, on 27 April 2013 - 01:41 PM, said:

Can you remind us what happened in 1970? Were there any GM corn back then?
Not something that would have been prevented by a move to GMO crops. A bit of red herring but certainly proof that relying on an ever decreasing pool of genetic material is a very bad idea.

Here's the lesson The greatest genetic diversity offers the greatest resistance against crop plagues. Now tell me how GMO's work in that scenario.

Br Cornelius

Edited by Br Cornelius, 27 April 2013 - 01:50 PM.

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#40    bmk1245

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 02:01 PM

Sigh...
List of varieties of genetically modified maize.
With time will be more.

Edit to add: here is another list (just select Registered and maize).

Edited by bmk1245, 27 April 2013 - 02:08 PM.

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#41    Br Cornelius

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 03:46 PM

You can sigh all you like but it ain't going to change the fact that agriculture as currently constituted is a disaster waiting to happen, and GMO's are only going to make matters worse.

By no means a comprehensive list, and almost totally devoid of heritage varieties, but here's a small sub-list of the  of the 100's of varieties of maize to put against your tiny list of GMO varieties;

http://en.wikipedia....tcorn_varieties

Let us not forget that the GMO's are clones which makes matters entirely worse in terms of genetic vulnerability to disease.



Br Cornelius

Edited by Br Cornelius, 27 April 2013 - 03:54 PM.

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#42    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 11:05 PM

When you start to copyright food, you create a situation where someone can honestly say "do you have the right to eat that food?" because they own the rights to the food.




Ohh good lord, I just made a slippery slope argument.
Shoot me now.

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#43    Rafterman

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 01:49 PM

View Postshaddow134, on 25 April 2013 - 01:43 AM, said:

Most definitely,I for one would avoid it if I knew it was GMO.

Have fun starving.

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#44    preacherman76

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 02:50 PM

Starving? Companies will switch to organic real fast when they see thier products arent selling. I could see many making the switch soon as labling is law.

Some things are true, even if you dont believe them.

#45    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 03:04 PM

Whether companies switch depends on supply and cost.  By the way, calling food as it is grown today "organic" would by itself be dishonest.  I suspect countries without silly laws like that will gradually outpace and overtake countries who stick to old superstitions.





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