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What they are teaching in your kids in SC


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#16    Sherapy

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 07:38 PM

View PostMichelle, on 26 April 2013 - 06:41 PM, said:

I have no proof they don't, but even snopes admits this is pretty much a rumor. I will not discuss the possibility of something which has not been proven to be true. Out of all the kids I know that go to or have graduated from Christian schools the majority of them aren't even particularly religious. They go to private Christian schools because the education is much better and gives them a very distinct advantage when applying to college.

Advantages come from taking AP classes and honor classes, or community college(in high school) and getting a high GPA,this can be accomplished regardless of the school one comes out of. In other words, it's the effort a student  applies that get them the grades that  determine the college choices they will have, not the high school they come out of. If a school teaches creationism as the equivalent of  science and technology, a person would have a hard time competing on an academic level as they just will not have the information they need regardless of the school.

Edited by Sherapy, 26 April 2013 - 07:41 PM.


#17    Michelle

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 07:51 PM

View PostSherapy, on 26 April 2013 - 07:38 PM, said:

Advantages come from taking AP classes and honor classes, or community college(in high school) and getting a high GPA,this can be accomplished regardless of the school one comes out of. In other words, it's the effort a student  applies that get them the grades that  determine the college choices they will have, not the high school they come out of. If a school teaches creationism as the equivalent of  science and technology, a person would have a hard time competing on an academic level as they just will not have the information they need regardless of the school.

There's the rub now isn't it? First, we don't know if this is even true and second, this could be a religious class asking the students what Christians believe? You are making an assumption you can't prove.


#18    Sherapy

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 09:48 PM

View PostMichelle, on 26 April 2013 - 07:51 PM, said:

There's the rub now isn't it? First, we don't know if this is even true and second, this could be a religious class asking the students what Christians believe? You are making an assumption you can't prove.

Michelle-- I can infer from the 4th grade students quiz that they are being taught creationism, based on that-- I stand by my conclusion that if this is their 'only' Science education it will not afford them the options that come from a good education as this is not an academic education-- it is religious in context. You are correct, I cannot prove or establish this is their only education though, it is very possible it is a Sunday school quiz. With that being said, I actually do know of and have  lots of experience with home school movements that do teach creationism and bible based educations. I have been around long enough to see the outcome of such choices, it is very limiting for a young persons future (as it limits their options.) I am all for honoring and respecting religious tradition as one sees fit--, but I also respect and honor that a child has the right to an education that will serve to give them a life where they can thrive.

Edited by Sherapy, 26 April 2013 - 09:50 PM.


#19    Kowalski

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Posted 26 April 2013 - 10:32 PM

View PostMichelle, on 26 April 2013 - 07:15 PM, said:

Ted Turner graduated from one of our most prestigious Christian schools and he is still one of it's biggest contributors. I don't think anyone can say he hasn't integrated very well, unless you wouldn't want to be married to Jane Fonda and have billions of dollars. :w00t:

I have to say, when I was a teacher's aide (at a private Christian School) to the two teachers. One was taught English Literature, and the other one taught History. I eventually left the school to pursue a degree in Occupational/Speech Therapy for special needs kids (I love children and have always been comfortable and at ease with them. They are so special!)but was unable to finish college.
Anyway, what I SAW, in this school was excellent! I mean these kids were getting a great education. I have to admit, I went to public school for a LONG time, but my parents had to pull me out, because I was bored to tears in class, and I needed to be getting in
ADVANCED classes which my school did not offer at all.
Public schools have been going down the toilet for awhile now. In some areas, the public schools are SO BAD, the only choices for parents who actually care about there kids, and don't think the government should be babysitting them, Christian Private Schools or homeschooling is THE only option.
I am devoting my LIFE to my sons (and any future children) education. I plan to homeschool.  I know a lot of moms don't get this option but me and my husband (he was homeschooled) think it's VERY important, and we are lucky to be able to do this. I am a genealogist and I am lucky I can do most of my research online. I DO have to go to libraries and archives but I am lucky my mother in law, mother, or sister in law can watch my kid. So I'm very blessed. :innocent:

I think individualism is VERY important. Present ALL the evidence to the child, and let them decide for themselves. No one should be able to dictate to someone what to believe.


#20    Michelle

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 06:14 PM

View PostKowalski, on 26 April 2013 - 10:32 PM, said:

I have to say, when I was a teacher's aide (at a private Christian School) to the two teachers. One was taught English Literature, and the other one taught History. I eventually left the school to pursue a degree in Occupational/Speech Therapy for special needs kids (I love children and have always been comfortable and at ease with them. They are so special!)but was unable to finish college.
Anyway, what I SAW, in this school was excellent! I mean these kids were getting a great education. I have to admit, I went to public school for a LONG time, but my parents had to pull me out, because I was bored to tears in class, and I needed to be getting in
ADVANCED classes which my school did not offer at all.
Public schools have been going down the toilet for awhile now. In some areas, the public schools are SO BAD, the only choices for parents who actually care about there kids, and don't think the government should be babysitting them, Christian Private Schools or homeschooling is THE only option.
I am devoting my LIFE to my sons (and any future children) education. I plan to homeschool.  I know a lot of moms don't get this option but me and my husband (he was homeschooled) think it's VERY important, and we are lucky to be able to do this. I am a genealogist and I am lucky I can do most of my research online. I DO have to go to libraries and archives but I am lucky my mother in law, mother, or sister in law can watch my kid. So I'm very blessed. :innocent:

I think individualism is VERY important. Present ALL the evidence to the child, and let them decide for themselves. No one should be able to dictate to someone what to believe.

There is no doubt private Christian schools have a far better education than public schools. Parents start prepairing their children and their resumes from the time they are born. That hadn't even accured to me until our neighbor was telling me she had already put her child on waiting lists, starting with preschool, at only a few months old. Parents are very competitive when it comes to getting their children in these schools and they don't accept just anyone. These kids have very high standards they have to live up to and have to have/keep a certain grade point average. There are too many children on waiting lists to take advantage of a better education to have others simply taking up space.

For the most part I think homeschooling is wonderful. Personally, all of the kids I know who were had a fantastic education and are very well rounded. I have heard of a few people who homeschool that worry me a great deal. Not everyone can be a good teacher or have the character, stability and education needed. I think those children should have exposure to more adults and not hear everything from one side.

It sounds like you have everything needed to successfully homeschool. The best of luck to you! :tu:

Edited by Michelle, 27 April 2013 - 06:45 PM.


#21    White Crane Feather

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 07:52 PM

View PostMichelle, on 26 April 2013 - 06:41 PM, said:



I have no proof they don't, but even snopes admits this is pretty much a rumor. I will not discuss the possibility of something which has not been proven to be true. Out of all the kids I know that go to or have graduated from Christian schools the majority of them aren't even particularly religious. They go to private Christian schools because the education is much better and gives them a very distinct advantage when applying to college.
Oh... They do. ( not all of course) Watch the documentary "friends of christ" .

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
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#22    notforgotten

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 08:08 PM

I see no harm in testing children about the truth. Their is no real evidence that science knows the truth. This country has been founded on the premise that God is real. God bless America. It's still on our currency. It's the rest of the country that has it backwards if you ask me.


#23    GreenmansGod

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 08:10 PM

View PostKowalski, on 26 April 2013 - 06:51 PM, said:

I worked in a private Christian school several years ago. I would like to point out we taught Creationism AND Evolution. This test is most likely from a CHRISTIAN school, not a public one. We don't know if they are ONLY teaching Creationism. They could be teaching Evolution too. Also, back when dinosaurs roamed the earth, my Dad attended a private Catholic School that was run by nuns (Blue Brothers comes to mind, LOL) and interestingly enough, they taught Creationism along with Evolution also. A LOT of Christian Schools and homeschoolers do this.
After all, it's up to the individual student to decide what to believe in, right?

The problem is CreationISM is not science and shouldn't be taught as science.  It is religion. Actually evolution is not really about how life was created, it about how it was done.  If you feel the Universe was started by an omnipotent being evolution is most likely how he did it.

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#24    AquilaChrysaetos

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Posted 27 April 2013 - 10:29 PM

since when did atheistic darwinism become the neutrality?

Public schools ask that religion be left out of the classroom, and yet in it's place it inserts atheism. You just can't have evolution without atheism. Sure, you could explain the beginning of the universe as starting with God perhaps, however it would only be a cruel, impersonal, useless God that would do that.

There are many serious objections to the theory of evolution that completely disproves it, however due to mankind's new found anti-supernatural bias, it's all ruled out despite all of the obvious objections to the theory. It can't be questioned no matter how much evidence, 'It just simply must be so!' Everything else is just slapped the 'religon' label (which btw is dogmatically dismissed as false simply on those grounds which is ludacris) while the state continues enforcing their atheism.

I may not agree with enforcing Christianity in the public schools, nor more than I agree with enforcing atheism. But to willingly twist and ignore and silence the totality of the evidence just to simply inforce their 'belief' is just simply rediculous.

Jesus Christ - Matthew 28:18-20 said:

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

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#25    Mr Walker

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:24 AM

View PostMidyin, on 26 April 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

This test(Assumong it's real), is teaching this little girl that "The Flintstones was a documetary because that's how we interperate an old magic book".

If that's the kind "scientific method" that's being taught there I very highly doubt that those children are going integrate into the rest of Americas general population very well... lol
Oh I dont know, from what i read on UM they might fit in perfectly :innocent:
Seriously though, i found it interesting that the purported father of the student was very happy with the standards rigour and content of all other classes And they even teach latin. "Non nobis solum" to quote my old school motto. Or "Fac omnia bene"  to quote the motto of the government school where I teach.

In australia about  25-30 % of parents send their kids to religious schools, not because they are religious, but because of the standards and values taught in those schools compared with government ones.Here creationism is not allowed to be taught in science, history, etc., but certainly religous beliefs can be taught, as such, in any school; public/govt. or private. So we have schools teaching buddhist beliefs, islamic beliefs, jewish beliefs, mainstream christian beliefs, and fundamentalist beliefs that I know of personally.

My wife attended one of the later, and you won't find a better "educated" person, despite her belief in  creationism. She knows evolutionary history, but choses not to believe it. Her maths, language, logic, and other skills, are as good as mine, and I went to a govt school and university and have taught teenagers in a govt school for forty years. She found work for 10 years  in church employment as a trained ledger machinist and typist, but her skills were quite transferrable to private enterprises, where she spent her last five years working, until we were married and she did not have to  do paid work.

Edited by Mr Walker, 28 April 2013 - 12:34 AM.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#26    Arbenol

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:56 AM

View PostAquilaChrysaetos, on 27 April 2013 - 10:29 PM, said:

You just can't have evolution without atheism.

Any theists here have a problem with this statement?

View PostAquilaChrysaetos, on 27 April 2013 - 10:29 PM, said:

There are many serious objections to the theory of evolution that completely disproves it, however due to mankind's new found anti-supernatural bias, it's all ruled out despite all of the obvious objections to the theory.

There are objections, but I wouldn't call one of them serious. And they've all been addressed a gazillion times. Creationists ignore this due their long-standing religious bias. Evolution is ruled out despite the masses of evidence that converges on it.


#27    Midyin

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:26 PM

View PostMichelle, on 26 April 2013 - 07:15 PM, said:



Ted Turner graduated from one of our most prestigious Christian schools and he is still one of it's biggest contributors. I don't think anyone can say he hasn't integrated very well, unless you wouldn't want to be married to Jane Fonda and have billions of dollars. :w00t:

Ok, Ted Turner is one success story, but what happens when you figure up the percentage of successfull people that graduate from Christian Schools vs the percentage of Successfull people that graduated from a school that teaches real science?


#28    Mr Walker

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:40 PM

View PostMidyin, on 28 April 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:

Ok, Ted Turner is one success story, but what happens when you figure up the percentage of successfull people that graduate from Christian Schools vs the percentage of Successfull people that graduated from a school that teaches real science?

I really only know about adventist schools, which my wife attended in the past and which some of her family members also attended  in more recent times.These are fully accreditied schools, colleges and universities, including loma linda in the usa.

Adventists are creationist believers and i assume creationism is taught in their schools. It certainly was in the  past but they also give a very high standard of educaiton all around the world, and graduates are succesfull in all spheres of life includng medicine and science. I assume they separate out science from belief. In australia religious based schools (most of which are not creation based) consistently have the top ranking graduates in the country and provide the leaders of the country in business sport and politics

In america, Loma linda university is in the top 15 universities in america for  results for  students from minority groups, and has students from over 80 nations and most american states. Its medical centre also ranks very high.

Loma Linda University scored high on the national list of “Top 100 Degree Producers,” which lists institutions by the number of degrees conferred to minority students.
The annual rankings were released in the June 9, 2011, issue of Diverse: Issues in Higher Education.
Nationwide, Loma Linda University places among the top 15 institutions in the master’s, doctorate, and first professional degree categories. To determine an institution’s standing, the magazine uses the most recent data (from 2009-2010) reported by each institution.

http://www.llu.edu/n.../diversity.page

Edited by Mr Walker, 28 April 2013 - 12:52 PM.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#29    Rlyeh

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:53 PM

View PostAquilaChrysaetos, on 27 April 2013 - 10:29 PM, said:

since when did atheistic darwinism become the neutrality?

Public schools ask that religion be left out of the classroom, and yet in it's place it inserts atheism. You just can't have evolution without atheism. Sure, you could explain the beginning of the universe as starting with God perhaps, however it would only be a cruel, impersonal, useless God that would do that.

There are many serious objections to the theory of evolution that completely disproves it, however due to mankind's new found anti-supernatural bias, it's all ruled out despite all of the obvious objections to the theory. It can't be questioned no matter how much evidence, 'It just simply must be so!' Everything else is just slapped the 'religon' label (which btw is dogmatically dismissed as false simply on those grounds which is ludacris) while the state continues enforcing their atheism.

I may not agree with enforcing Christianity in the public schools, nor more than I agree with enforcing atheism. But to willingly twist and ignore and silence the totality of the evidence just to simply inforce their 'belief' is just simply rediculous.
Here is a new word for you, secularism. Modern science is secular.
It's obvious you've got a problem with science and naturalistic explanations, so please find out what science is before going on an ignorant anti-evolution rant.

BTW Cosmology studies the origins of the universe, not biology.

Edited by Rlyeh, 28 April 2013 - 01:01 PM.


#30    Michelle

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 04:26 PM

View PostMidyin, on 28 April 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:

Ok, Ted Turner is one success story, but what happens when you figure up the percentage of successfull people that graduate from Christian Schools vs the percentage of Successfull people that graduated from a school that teaches real science?

I think I've already explained to you that they do teach real science. These private Christian schools are the Yale and Harvard of early education. The people that graduate from these schools are the creme de la creme. Not only do they get the best education, they make the business contacts they need to prosper in a highly compettitive world. How they choose to use those advantages are up to them, but the majority of them go on to make great livings.

People don't line up to get their kids in them for a Christian education, but for the best education available.





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