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Will Money die out


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#1    spud the mackem

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 10:17 AM

Stand in a checkout queue and you will see that most people use a Card to pay.
The Banks keep asking if you want to do on-line banking. Direct Debits means no cheques.

Some Hotels wont accept cash as payment you have to pay by card.
A lot of people dont carry cash these days.

You can go almost anywhere and pay by card,except maybe a Betting Shop,

Any comments on this ?

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#2    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 10:35 AM

Good hotels don't want riff-raff and anyone without at least a debit card is clearly riff-raff.

Vietnam remains about 90 percent cash, and international company employees, who are paid by having their salary automatically deposited, form a queue each payday at ATMs to withdraw it all.  Somehow I get the feeling neither the currency nor the banks are trusted overmuch, although this is improving.  The few places that accept cards want some extra percent depending on what card it is.  Really large purchases are made with gold.  I have seen a few places offering discounts if you use a certain card -- I guess as a promotion.

ATMs now exist almost everywhere.  This sure makes my life easier.  I use to keep a large amount in a safe in my house; now I go to an ATM.  It is much safer I think and even though bank account insurance is not trusted, a scheme of it now exists and I think it would be honored.  There have been a couple of bank runs, but all it took was the government showing up with trucks full of cash and the runs subsided.

The government made a big push to introduce coins a couple years ago.  To a population not use to coins this was a damn nuisance, and they were hated.  They seem to have gone away.  The size of available bills has also been increased a lot.  The paper money now is very sophisticated with all sorts of ways to detect counterfeits.


#3    shaddow134

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 11:35 AM

Money is slow becoming an illusion,just numbers on a computer.Every day Billions are moved around the world and not one bank note in sight,

"Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia." - Charles Schulz

#4    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 11:43 AM

Money is just a unit of measurement, like kilograms or degrees Centigrade.  We use it to measure an abstract thing called "value."  Whether it is represented by pieces of paper or seashells or entries in a bank log or entries in a computer database does not change what it is.


#5    onereaderone

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 11:45 AM

it  is  important  to  never  forget  what  money  is...

as  a device ...   money  is  any  object  or  device  with the  taxing  authoritys   icon  applied  to  it .

the  creation  of  money  is  done  to  unifie  the  worth  or  value  of  wage ,  and  items  for  the  purpose  of  taxation .

money  has  no  relationship  to  free  markets   or  trade  ...  and  money  is  only  of  value  because  rich  people  need  it  to  pay  the  tax  the  goverment  requires  of  them...

to  a point...   in  the  united states , where  taxation  rates  of  collection  are  the highest  since  the beginning  of  time ....   all persons  making  less  than  55,000.oo  per  year  collectivly  do  not  pay  enought  to  off set  the  cost  of  the  collection  of  the  tax and  record  keeping .
in  the  united  state ,  persons  making  between  55,oo.oo  per  year   and  2.5 million  dollors   per  year  pay  only  enought  to  cover  the  employment  of  all  city , state  , and  fedaral employees ...   but  not  a dime  tword  any  other  costs  of  the  goverment ....

(  this  is  not  guess  work ,  it is  math  and  public  record ...)

of  the  top  500  corparations  in  the  unites  states ...   they  pay  no  more  that  than  3%   of  earnings  in  tax .
those persons  who  record  making  more  than  2.5 million  or  more   pay  all  the  bills ...   and  they  make  money  have  value .
credit  cards  are  a bank  device ,  that  makes  the  banks 85% of  their  money .
mainly  in  over  draft  protection  or  in  fees  for  over  draft charges .
the  cost  of  the  credit  card  mantance  is  less  than  1%  of  the  fees  and  charges ...
the  actual  plastic  and  record  keeping   is  less  than  1 usd  per  year ...   more  is  spent  in  postage  than  the  paper ...   and  that  is  the  greatest  cost  to  the  bank ....

all  you need  to  do  is  get  one  35.oo  over  draft  fee  once...   and  you have  paid  for  everything  and  made  the  bank  money   for  the  service .


#6    onereaderone

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 11:54 AM

so  of  course  ...  banks  want  universal  credit card  useage ...  the  single  greatest  difficulty  is  illegal drug  and  criminal enterprises  ...  because ,  credit cards  leave  a paper  trail  for  taxation .    

what  the  goverment  will  do  is  make  non-person credit  card accounts  ,  or   throw  away  cards ...   spend  them  to  the  limit  and  throw  them away ...   so  that  the  underground  will  except  the  non  money   ...


#7    Nefer-Ankhe

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:14 PM

I agree that money is slowly becoming an illusion, but let's just rewind a few thousand years, where great civilizations thrived without the concept of money, e.g. ancient Egypt, Inca's, Mayans and Aztecs. They did have a currency of some sort, of course, which some aspects of, I much prefer, for example being paid for your duties, not in money, but with rations of food and land.

Man has created the concept of money, money which has been the direct cause of greed, corruption and power, though opposed to all this, money does have it's benefits and purposes.

"It is of course the height of irony that, after this intensive campaign to expunge them from the annals of Egypt, the Amarna pharaohs are today probably the most recognized of all the country's ancient rulers."

--- from Amarna Sunset, Aidan Dodson.

#8    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:31 PM

I don't see money ever being an illusion; it is a unit of measurement.  What it represents of "value" in terms of other things averaged out into an overall and varying price list.  How we represent it (electronic marks on a piece of plastic work fine) it remains money.


#9    Ashotep

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 12:39 PM

At least one state wants you to use cards or checks in yards sales even.  I think that's stupid.  So afraid your going to buy something without them getting their cut.

If there is a disaster you had better have cash.


#10    kobolds

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 01:56 PM

unless need to pay big amount or place that required to use creditcard  , I usually use cash .

I don't like the idea where people can track your activity


#11    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 02:48 PM

I rather like the idea where all transactions leave a paper trail.  It would mean that tax evasion is more difficult, rewarding the honest over the cheat.  It would also make it easer to detect crimes like insider trading, money laundering, financing and profiting from illegal businesses, and to catch and prosecutes frauds.


#12    freetoroam

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 02:57 PM

I do hope it does not, that means that we will have to trust every bank!

In an ideal World a law would be passed were NO guns were allowed and all those out there destroyed, trouble is the law makers are not going to take a risk of trying to pass that without making sure they are armed first.

#13    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 03:01 PM

I don't see how it is possible to not trust at least one bank.  It occurs to me that one could always avoid the paper trail by bartering.


#14    freetoroam

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 03:13 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 28 April 2013 - 03:01 PM, said:

I don't see how it is possible to not trust at least one bank.  It occurs to me that one could always avoid the paper trail by bartering.
Will have to ask the Cypriots about that.
I do not have enough money to barter with, so what ever little bits of paper I do have stays with me. Saves any hassle when the cash machines crash!
I got cloned at A BANK 8 years ago,  got the money back eventually, but thats not the point, the point is it should never have happened in the first place. They caught the person who done it and i said I wanted to press charges myself, the bank said I could not as it was their money which was taken as they had paid me back, so basically my account was theirs and if anyone interfered with it within their system then it was nothing to do with me.....I DON`T THINK SO! I closed the account, opened up another one elsewhere and each time they phone me and ask me if I want a credit card I tell them where they can insert their cards.
I have no chose but to have an account for my wages to go into, but it does not stay there long.

In an ideal World a law would be passed were NO guns were allowed and all those out there destroyed, trouble is the law makers are not going to take a risk of trying to pass that without making sure they are armed first.

#15    spud the mackem

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Posted 28 April 2013 - 08:49 PM

There are some interesting posts, cheers, but in the future maybe they could use a Credit system,you are paid for a weeks work in "Credits" to your bank account.When you go to buy something you are charged X amount of "Credits",and when you sell something you charge X amount of "Credits" All transactions being done by Computers,so all you have is a plastic card, and so Money becomes obsolete.I regularly get messages asking me if I want to do "online banking" with paperless statements, which so far I have refused,as I don't like the thought of being "owned" by a bank.But I am getting used to paying by card,instead of money,which saves you carrying cash and "buttons"(small change) around, all my small change goes into a "penny jar" everynight when I empty pockets,and last time I cashed it just before Xmas I had £142.38, in the jar, so maybe I'll still use money.

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(2) try your second best, ........if that dont work
(3) give up you aint gonna win




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