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AA artifacts - evidence or speculation ?

ancient aliens proof evidence statues petroglyphs drawings

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#31    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:39 AM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 05 May 2013 - 04:31 AM, said:

A word of advice to anyone looking for AA explanations among ancient artifacts or art. Don't take anything out of context, be it art or artifact. You need to understand the culture that is responsible for any artifact to understand it's meaning and significance. Without context AA is nothing more than a speculative fantasy with no meat on it's bones.

I NEVER said its not speculative.

Edited by Sheep Smart, 05 May 2013 - 04:39 AM.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#32    Harte

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:41 AM

View PostSheep Smart, on 05 May 2013 - 04:29 AM, said:

I believe the Sumerians did leave both. The story is that they came from another planet. Its the one Sagan chose when he and Nasa sent out the communication back in the 70's. Presumably it must have meant something if it were chosen to be sent out for communication with extraterrestrials.

No Sumerian story was singled out for inclusion on the plaques for Pioneer 10 and 11, nor for the Voyager "golden record."

Also, no Sumerian story tells of anyone coming from or going into space.  The Sumerians certainly did not believe they came from another planet.  The Sumerians, like most cultures, had a creation myth that places their origin right here on Earth, of course.  That is, they didn't know other planets even existed, and they didn't know Earth as a planet at any rate.

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#33    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:43 AM

View PostHarte, on 05 May 2013 - 04:29 AM, said:

Be alone if you want.  But you're wrong there too.

There's a conversation going on right now at this boardabout how we know Khufu had the Great Pyramid built.
Harte
I had a guy tell me yesterday on here that he could build it himself.  Im supposing he started the thread.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#34    cormac mac airt

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:46 AM

View PostSheep Smart, on 05 May 2013 - 04:43 AM, said:

I had a guy tell me yesterday on here that he could build it himself.  Im supposing he started the thread.

You're supposing incorrectly. Kmt_sesh wouldn't have the time even if he wanted to. Nor would he make such a claim.

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The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#35    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:47 AM

Look for anyone who doesnt have their own words, or isnt into the coincidence, rather than call me names and post a zillion links on crap i dont care about because as i already said, its SPECULATIVE and NOT imposed to AA from my perspective,..go somewhere else and refrain from the topic.
I have my own reasons for being interested. simple.

View Postcormac mac airt, on 05 May 2013 - 04:46 AM, said:

You're supposing incorrectly. Kmt_sesh wouldn't have the time even if he wanted to. Nor would he make such a claim.

cormac
i dont think that was his name, but thanks anyway.

Edited by Sheep Smart, 05 May 2013 - 04:48 AM.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#36    S2F

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:49 AM

View PostSheep Smart, on 05 May 2013 - 04:39 AM, said:

I NEVER said its not speculative.

I NEVER said you did.

"You want to discuss plausibility then you have to accept reality." -Mattshark

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You know... the plural of ``anecdote'' is not ``data''. Similarly, the plural of ``random fact'' is not ``mystical symbolism''. -sepulchrave


#37    cormac mac airt

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:52 AM

View PostSheep Smart, on 05 May 2013 - 04:47 AM, said:

Look for anyone who doesnt have their own words, or isnt into the coincidence, rather than call me names and post a zillion links on crap i dont care about because as i already said, its SPECULATIVE and NOT imposed to AA from my perspective,..go somewhere else and refrain from the topic.
I have my own reasons for being interested. simple.


i dont think that was his name, but thanks anyway.

And for those of us who know better, BS is not speculative. And in regards to at least two items you've posted about, namely the Pacal sarcophagus lid and the Abydos "machines" it's already known what they are, so not speculative in the least. Neither has anything to do with AA.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#38    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 04:52 AM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 05 May 2013 - 04:49 AM, said:

I NEVER said you did.
now that we cleared that up...

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#39    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 05:00 AM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 05 May 2013 - 04:52 AM, said:

And for those of us who know better, BS is not speculative. And in regards to at least two items you've posted about, namely the Pacal sarcophagus lid and the Abydos "machines" it's already known what they are, so not speculative in the least. Neither has anything to do with AA.

cormac

if you believe that that is fine. I still try to point out the coincidence. that is all.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#40    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 05:15 AM

View PostHarte, on 05 May 2013 - 04:29 AM, said:

Be alone if you want.  But you're wrong there too.

There's a conversation going on right now at this boardabout how we know Khufu had the Great Pyramid built. The thread was started some years back, but was recently picked back up - page 3 or 4 I think. And in that conversation, there are many of the ignorant that strive to remain ignorant in the face of information that is the cure to their ignorance.

Harte
I suppose then one would attract the other.
I think you dont understand though. The current standing theories on construction are accepted. They are not proven. As i mentioned before, this thead was to emphasize depictions.

Edited by Sheep Smart, 05 May 2013 - 05:16 AM.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#41    kmt_sesh

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 05:36 AM

View PostSheep Smart, on 05 May 2013 - 04:47 AM, said:

...

i dont think that was his name, but thanks anyway.

I am kmt_sesh, I am indeed the guy who started that thread, and I would of course never make such an inane claim.

That being the case, for someone who so strongly emphasizes that you're not really saying these images represent ancient aliens, you're going to notable lengths to try to show how these images must represent ancient aliens. You seem to be shooting down all counterarguments left and right, regardless of cogent explanations presented, in order to favor the ancient-alien myth.

And that's all it is, in the end: a myth. Period.

I'd be interested to know what your sources are. If you care to share them, I am open to hearing them. I think the rest of the posters would appreciate knowing, too. I am left wondering because a couple of times or more, you suggested to other posters that the Romans did indeed write of UFOs and all we have to do is Google it. Well, I can at least say for myself, the day I turn to Google as a research method is the day I can no longer take myself seriously. I would turn the question back at you and ask: in what peer-reviewed, academic paper does a vetted and respected classical scholar state that the Romans wrote of UFOs? Now, that is a better-directed question.

And please don't try to push the conspiracy angle. If you're trying to push the notion that the Vatican has and keeps most of ancient Rome's records, you're not only not very familiar with the Vatican's holdings, but you're equally unfamiliar with the collections of great museums and universities around the world. All I can say is, in my own twenty-plus years of researching ancient Mediterranean civilizations, I've never once heard a vetted classical scholar state that the Romans wrote of UFOs. So, indeed, I turn the question back on you: which scholar or scholars have written of this?

I certainly don't have time to plumb all the posts and comment on all of the images you've posted, and to be honest numerous of them lie outside my own research forte. But as a general rule, how much time have you invested in researching and studying the societies and cultures which produced all of these images? What does proper historical analysis of these cultures tells us about their artwork? Time and again the ancient-alien crowd trots out the same images, divorces the same images completely from their cultural contexts, and points at them as "proof" of ancient aliens. Now, that is more or less the overall approach one sees on the TV show Ancient Aliens, but this TV show is without intellectual merit and has contributed mightily to human stupidity.

I question, for example, one image from your OP: the "cave drawing" supposedly from France and dating to 15,000 to 17,000 years ago. As it happens I've invested a significant amount of time over the past month or so researching this very subject for a large new exhibit on Lascaux at our museum, and my studies have caused me to look into many of the 340 painted caves in southwest France and northeast Spain. This subject of prehistoric Europe is pretty new to me, I admit, but I would ask you exactly in which cave this image is supposed to appear? It doesn't even resemble the cave art of Magdalenian France. What does the wider cave wall show? What other images and symbols are present?. What is your source?

As I mentioned, my main area of study is the ancient Mediterranean world, and most especially pharaonic Egypt. Few images are trotted out by the ancient-alien crowd with such frequency as the Abydos inscription (the image in the link, by the way, has been "touched up" in Photoshop, as is obvious). I don't have the time tonight to go into depth on how one should properly view and interpret ancient Egyptian reliefs and inscriptions, but suffice it to say this is a classic example of a palimpsest. That's its technical term: a piece of art or inscription copied over by another piece of art or inscription. One should ask why the ancient Egyptians would even bother to carve a bunch of high-tech craft willy-nilly in a state temple, which is nonsensical on the face of it. But in point of fact, what's going on here is not a mystery. I've done my own work to straighten out this inscription, and I provide a color-coded image of it below:

Posted Image

In the way of brief explanation (brief for me, anyway), as most here know, this temple was commissioned by Seti I early in Dynasty 19. It was left unfinished when this king died. His son and successor, Ramesses II, finished it for him, as all dutiful crown princes were supposed to do upon assuming the throne. Archaeologists have dubbed Ramesses II "the chiseler" due to his penchant for usurping older royal monuments for his own use, and it was no different in this temple at Abydos. Ramesses II added his own name and titulary throughout the temple.

The blue glyphs in the palimpsest were those carved first, by Seti I. Note how they underlie the red glyphs, which were added by Ramesses II. The glyphs not color coded were those shared by both men, and thus unchanged. A proper analysis and translation of this inscription is as follows (I first provide transliterations so others can check my work, if interested):


Blue: Seti I:
nbty nx Kmt (H)w(i) xAswt nsw-bity nb-tAwy mn-mAat-re sA-ra...

"He of the Two Ladies, protector of Egypt, defeater of foreign lands, he of the Sedge and Bee, Lord of the Two Lands, Menmaatre, Son of Re…"


Red: Ramesses II
nbty d(A)rt psdt nsw-bity nb-tAwy wsr-mAat-re stpn-re sA-ra...

"He of the Two Ladies, suppressor of the Nine Bows, he of the Sedge and Bee, Lord of the Two Lands, Usermaatre Setepenre, Son of Re…"

That's enough for me for one night. Everyone else, have at it!

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#42    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 05:56 AM

kmt,
FIRST OFF ,I didnt drag your name in here, im not sure why that dude did. Some people just have an answer for everything i guess
.. Infact i replied saying it wasnt you so calm the freak down. (Who said they could build the giza) hahaha
Secondly im not here to "prove" anything. So there goes your argument.
I sure hope youre not refering to me when you say "blablabla-bla bla blah ..push the conspiracy ", because in my initial few posts I said its all speculative coincidence regardless of where i stan. Furthermore I posted the following in the stat bar:

She of two men say; "It wasnt Ancient Aliens, it was humans prior to mutating dumbward."

Edited by Sheep Smart, 05 May 2013 - 06:21 AM.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.

#43    third_eye

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 06:22 AM

I am delighted and amazed with the images of the 'wall paintings' posted ... great job and a world of thanks

My approach is if we were to express ideas of 'extra terrestrials' how do we compare ours today to those images of those ages with using only the tools available then?

Bear in mind again the only way/path on those trips to those 'holy sites' are perilous and difficult today even with the modern pathways and steps created to make our visits less demanding.

I don't believe its Aliens though I am most interested in knowing what put those 'inspirations' in their heads .... Graham Hancock's book "SuperNatural" does touch on the many theories put forward thus far, but mentioning Mr Hancock's name around here is a bit of a taboo ... ;lol:

Good one Sheep Smart .... baa baa baa to ye :tu:

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#44    Exeter

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 06:45 AM

Not to stir up **** here (more that's been already) but seriously who can claim to truly understand what the ancient people really thought? Even today with so much available communication world wide there's more than a few cultural blocks. What I mean by that is that even if you go live abroad with a different culture and learn everything you can about them you still will never have their mind set.

The ancients made art and wrote a lot about their every day lives. Who's to say that what we interpret as just their beliefs and myths weren't actual descriptions of what really went down?

Time machine or it didn't happen. lol

UFOs = weather balloons of the Gods.

#45    Sheep Smart

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 06:51 AM

thank you third eye ;)

Edited by Sheep Smart, 05 May 2013 - 06:52 AM.

Other life in the universe?, you dare to imply there are entities possibly far greater than us almighty humans, creators of canned ham and reality tv. Nonsense. Absurd.

   The reality that stupidy exists in abundance doesnt bother me. Its the fact that theres still no cure.




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