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Americans Won't Give Up Civil Liberties


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#16    CRYSiiSx2

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 06:25 PM

View PostLeave Britney alone!, on 07 May 2013 - 06:13 PM, said:

How was "giving up civil liberties" defined if it was at all during the poll?

A Post/CBS poll revealed 88% support background checks at gun shows while 55% support armed guards at school.

http://www.washingto...e95c8_page.html

A Pew research poll revealed 85% favor background checks at gun shows and private sales while 64% favor armed guards at school.

http://www.people-pr...jority-support/

You do realize these "polls" are pretty much horse **** right?  Do you know how easy it is for the media to make any poll lean in their favor?  Hmm, let's call 1,000 people in Detroit and ask them if them about gun control, as they hear a .45 popping every night.  I bet you won't see them calling 1,000 people in rural areas in Michigan where people actually hunt / target shoot and use their guns for something other than sticking up a liquor a store and I bet your poll flips.

Has anyone ever considered who these 1,000 people called for a survey even are?  The people too stupid to quit putting their phone number all over the internet, and get all these telemarketers in the first place?  Yeah, I trust they are informed and intelligent enough to be one of the 1,000 asked to represent the entire country's opinion on any matter... not.

Edited by CRYSiiSx2, 07 May 2013 - 06:26 PM.

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#17    aztek

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 06:45 PM

View PostCRYSiiSx2, on 07 May 2013 - 06:25 PM, said:

You do realize these "polls" are pretty much horse **** right?  
lmao, do you really have to ask?? he is making useless polls here.

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#18    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 06:48 PM

That might very well be your opinion of polls but it is likely that they are more disciplined than you assume or than your very own opinion is.


#19    Kowalski

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 06:57 PM

View PostCRYSiiSx2, on 07 May 2013 - 06:25 PM, said:

You do realize these "polls" are pretty much horse **** right?  Do you know how easy it is for the media to make any poll lean in their favor?  Hmm, let's call 1,000 people in Detroit and ask them if them about gun control, as they hear a .45 popping every night.  I bet you won't see them calling 1,000 people in rural areas in Michigan where people actually hunt / target shoot and use their guns for something other than sticking up a liquor a store and I bet your poll flips.

Has anyone ever considered who these 1,000 people called for a survey even are?  The people too stupid to quit putting their phone number all over the internet, and get all these telemarketers in the first place?  Yeah, I trust they are informed and intelligent enough to be one of the 1,000 asked to represent the entire country's opinion on any matter... not.

I agree. It all depends on the people you ask. I honestly think all these "polls" conducted by the MSM is nothing but bull****.
It's propaganda meant to influence the idiots out there that believe everything the Mainstream reports.


#20    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 07:04 PM

Masked obsenities to express yourself while calling others idiots seems rather ironic.

Just to add, I do not want armed guards in our schools, the NRA suggested that, but it does seem that public opinion is going that way, in favor of it.

Just because I disagree with public sentiment is no reason to trash the pollsters who rely on the scientific method in gathering data.

I will point out a flaw with telephone polls, millenials are less likely to have a land line. That is not a flaw that invalidates polling but something that should be noted as we play catch up with the effects of new technologies.

Edited by Leave Britney alone!, 07 May 2013 - 07:45 PM.


#21    green_dude777

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 08:34 PM

View PostLeave Britney alone!, on 07 May 2013 - 07:04 PM, said:

Masked obsenities to express yourself while calling others idiots seems rather ironic.

Just to add, I do not want armed guards in our schools, the NRA suggested that, but it does seem that public opinion is going that way, in favor of it.

Just because I disagree with public sentiment is no reason to trash the pollsters who rely on the scientific method in gathering data.

I will point out a flaw with telephone polls, millenials are less likely to have a land line. That is not a flaw that invalidates polling but something that should be noted as we play catch up with the effects of new technologies.

I also wanted to share a story.

My brother a few years back was employed by a company who does telephone polling.  This particular time, he was calling homes and asking what the predominant language spoken in the house was, English or Spanish.  He had a lady tell him "We don't believe in that Spanish", and hung up.  I have a feeling these are the type of people who pick up their phone despite it showing 'unavailable', 'private', or a random 800 number.


#22    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 08:38 PM

Great point, many with land lines and caller ID will not pick up calls listed as random, private, or some random 800 number.


#23    Michelle

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 08:44 PM

View Postgreen_dude777, on 07 May 2013 - 08:34 PM, said:

I also wanted to share a story.

My brother a few years back was employed by a company who does telephone polling.  This particular time, he was calling homes and asking what the predominant language spoken in the house was, English or Spanish.  He had a lady tell him "We don't believe in that Spanish", and hung up.  I have a feeling these are the type of people who pick up their phone despite it showing 'unavailable', 'private', or a random 800 number.

I've heard many people say they like to mess with phone solicitors and pollsters so they give them the most outrageous answers possible...especially the more elderly lonely people. They are going through sort of a second childhood and they get a big kick out of it. It's the equivalent of a reverse prank call. :lol:

Edited by Michelle, 07 May 2013 - 08:45 PM.


#24    IamsSon

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:07 PM

View PostOverSword, on 07 May 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Confession time.  Last Friday I went out for dinner.  When I reached the main street in my nieghborhood I noticed a large unattended black duffle bag sitting against the corner of the starbucks.  I thought that was a little suspicious and worrisome but continued to walk to the teryaki joint up the block.  about 30 or 40 minutes later, walking back, I look again and the black bag is still there unattended.  At this point I'm thinking 'OK, this is likely some street persons clothes, but if it blows up and I did nothing and people die, I just might feel a little bad abut that' so I proceed to call the police and report the bag, and then continue on my way home.  My point is that no, I guess I'm not totaly unworried about beng blown up by a random bomb, however my calling it in does nothing to stifle anyones freedom.  This is an acceptable level of caution IMO.  Much beyond this would be unacceptable.
Now on a sidenote, after getting home and playing my guitar for a while (1/2 hour 45 minutes or so) I'm wondering what's up.  So to satisfy my curiosity I go outside and walk up the street until I can see that corner.  There were no police anywhere in sight and the black duffle bag is still sitting there unnatended people walking by paying no attention.
There's a difference between being unduly scared and being more aware.

9-11 changed things.  American civilians suddenly became aware of the fact that death could come to them on a bright, sunny Tuesday morning.

That doesn't necessarily mean we are more scared, just more aware of the way the world has changed, and more aware of unusual things in our surroundings.

Those of us who are/were in the military, especially those of us who were stationed overseas, were already aware that danger lurks where you least expect it.  We watched 30-second awareness "commercials" on Armed Forces Network (AFN) telling us to book hotel rooms above the 2nd floor but below the 8th floor because most terrorist attacks/criminal acts will take place in the first two floors, but most fire engine ladders will not go up higher than the 7th floor and other similar bits of advice.

"But then with me that horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man's mind which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey's mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?" - Charles Darwin, in a letter to William Graham on July 3, 1881

#25    regeneratia

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:13 PM

View PostOverSword, on 07 May 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

TIME/CNN Poll Shows Increasing Number Of Americans Won't Give Up Civil Liberties To Fight Terrorism

From the article:

When discussing NYPD Police Chief Ray Kelly's assertion that "privacy is off the table" as a result of the Boston bombing, I mentioned I hadn't heard any public outcry demanding the government and law enforcement step in and do something (i.e., curtail civil liberties) in response to the tragedy. The responses we were seeing seemed to be nothing more than legislators and law enforcement officials pushing their own agendas.


This isn't just me not hearing what I don't want to hear. There's actual data available that explains the lack of concerned noises from Americans. A CNN/TIME poll shows that nearly two-thirds of Americans aren't interested in sacrificing rights to combat terrorism.

When given a choice, 61 percent of Americans say they are more concerned about the government enacting new anti-terrorism policies that restrict civil liberties, compared to 31 percent who say they are more concerned about the government failing to enact strong new anti-terrorism policies.

This is a vast improvement over 1996, when a post-Atlanta Olympics bombing poll showed only 23% opposed giving up freedom in exchange for fighting terrorism.

http://www.blacklist.../38/38/Y/M.html

Although I'm glad to see this, I'm very disapointed that it's only 61%.  It should be 99.9%.  How worried are you when you go out in public that you will be blown up by a terrorist?



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View PostDan, on 07 May 2013 - 04:11 PM, said:

I just got done going through several large airports. Taking my shoes off, having my body and carry-on scrutinized did not bother me. And I have nothing to hide but I do take offense to the government going through emails without a warrant. IRS or otherwise. That is illegal search as far as I am concerned. If they can't do it with your home or physical mail they should not do it with electronic mail. If they have serious, valid concerns then getting a legal warrant should not be a problem. And that google story of new technology that scrutinizes what you type is just as bad. Do no evil? Yeah, OK.

TSA backed off the radiation machines. I seriously doubt you went thru the worst that was being done.

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#26    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:22 PM

View PostLeave Britney alone!, on 07 May 2013 - 06:48 PM, said:

That might very well be your opinion of polls but it is likely that they are more disciplined than you assume or than your very own opinion is.
A poll result by itself is mostly useless. You need to know where it was polled, the exact wording of the questions, the number of people polled the number of responses ignored and so forth.
You know how it works - "97% of people polled were against any form of gun laws". Impressive. Even more impressive when you're told "97% of the 10,000 people polled". What you're not told is they polled the NRA. Or "86% of the man on the street says hippies are useless wastes of air" when that street happens to be "Wall Street".
Polls are lovely things to discuss, when it comes to bias and intent, only thing more interesting to discuss is Political Cartoons.

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#27    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:23 PM

Well while it is not best to trust any one poll, after more and more come out with similar numbers it becomes harder to ignore, although some will, some definitely will!


#28    IamsSon

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 09:57 PM

View PostLeave Britney alone!, on 07 May 2013 - 09:23 PM, said:

Well while it is not best to trust any one poll, after more and more come out with similar numbers it becomes harder to ignore, although some will, some definitely will!
If five people ask the same question with the same options, is it really a different poll?

"But then with me that horrid doubt always arises whether the convictions of man's mind which has been developed from the mind of the lower animals, are of any value or at all trustworthy. Would any one trust in the convictions of a monkey's mind, if there are any convictions in such a mind?" - Charles Darwin, in a letter to William Graham on July 3, 1881

#29    CRYSiiSx2

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 10:02 PM

View PostWearer of Hats, on 07 May 2013 - 09:22 PM, said:

A poll result by itself is mostly useless. You need to know where it was polled, the exact wording of the questions, the number of people polled the number of responses ignored and so forth.
You know how it works - "97% of people polled were against any form of gun laws". Impressive. Even more impressive when you're told "97% of the 10,000 people polled". What you're not told is they polled the NRA. Or "86% of the man on the street says hippies are useless wastes of air" when that street happens to be "Wall Street".
Polls are lovely things to discuss, when it comes to bias and intent, only thing more interesting to discuss is Political Cartoons.

Yep, who knows who CNN or MSNBC asks on these polls.  For all we know their "well 80+% vote for gun control", come to find out the people they asked were from Newtown, or the worst street in a big city.  Well hmm... I wonder how that poll will end up.  I never trust these polls.  Whichever way these swing.

Edited by CRYSiiSx2, 07 May 2013 - 10:03 PM.

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#30    Kowalski

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 11:51 PM

View PostWearer of Hats, on 07 May 2013 - 09:22 PM, said:

A poll result by itself is mostly useless. You need to know where it was polled, the exact wording of the questions, the number of people polled the number of responses ignored and so forth.
You know how it works - "97% of people polled were against any form of gun laws". Impressive. Even more impressive when you're told "97% of the 10,000 people polled". What you're not told is they polled the NRA. Or "86% of the man on the street says hippies are useless wastes of air" when that street happens to be "Wall Street".
Polls are lovely things to discuss, when it comes to bias and intent, only thing more interesting to discuss is Political Cartoons.

:tu:  I agree. What questions were asked and who did they poll? Where did these people they asked these questions live? I mean there are so many variables...
How can we trust these polls if they don't give out that type of information?





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