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Americans Won't Give Up Civil Liberties


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#31    Ashotep

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 12:10 AM

View PostOverSword, on 07 May 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Confession time.  Last Friday I went out for dinner.  When I reached the main street in my nieghborhood I noticed a large unattended black duffle bag sitting against the corner of the starbucks.  I thought that was a little suspicious and worrisome but continued to walk to the teryaki joint up the block.  about 30 or 40 minutes later, walking back, I look again and the black bag is still there unattended.  At this point I'm thinking 'OK, this is likely some street persons clothes, but if it blows up and I did nothing and people die, I just might feel a little bad abut that' so I proceed to call the police and report the bag, and then continue on my way home.  My point is that no, I guess I'm not totaly unworried about beng blown up by a random bomb, however my calling it in does nothing to stifle anyones freedom.  This is an acceptable level of caution IMO.  Much beyond this would be unacceptable.
Now on a sidenote, after getting home and playing my guitar for a while (1/2 hour 45 minutes or so) I'm wondering what's up.  So to satisfy my curiosity I go outside and walk up the street until I can see that corner.  There were no police anywhere in sight and the black duffle bag is still sitting there unnatended people walking by paying no attention.
I don't see it as giving up civil rights by calling the police about something like a bag left unattended on the sidewalk.  That's just being a concerned citizen given recent events.

Its possible since it was 45 minutes later before you took a look they had already stopped by with a bomb sniffing dog or maybe it had already been there for a while and had been checked out.


#32    CRYSiiSx2

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 12:20 AM

View PostHilander, on 08 May 2013 - 12:10 AM, said:

I don't see it as giving up civil rights by calling the police about something like a bag left unattended on the sidewalk.  That's just being a concerned citizen given recent events.

Its possible since it was 45 minutes later before you took a look they had already stopped by with a bomb sniffing dog or maybe it had already been there for a while and had been checked out.

Agree with you 100% there.  With the internet at hand virtually everywhere, some piece of crap can look up how to make a bomb from a cellphone.  Can't be too cautious these days.  With my luck though, I would be thinking, "oh crap what if that's full of cash?" and I set it off.

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#33    Ashotep

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 12:20 AM

I really don't know how much you can trust these polls.  I think they are probably close at best.  Demographics are going to play a big part in the answers.

I don't want to give up civil liberties to feel safer because I don't think it will make me safer.  Plus if I do get killed by a terrorist because we refused as a nation to give up our liberties I will have died a happier person.

I never worry about being attacked.


#34    Ashotep

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 12:21 AM

View PostCRYSiiSx2, on 08 May 2013 - 12:20 AM, said:

Agree with you 100% there.  With the internet at hand virtually everywhere, some piece of crap can look up how to make a bomb from a cellphone.  Can't be too cautious these days.  With my luck though, I would be thinking, "oh crap what if that's full of cash?" and I set it off.
Definitely would be kicking myself if it was full of cash.lol


#35    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 12:31 AM

Back to the way questions are asked. The way one defines civil liberties will vary between individuals, that is the main problem I see in these polls.

Also the way our society views civil liberties will change. It is never static.

Ask others in the '80s if they would be OK with cameras on street corners and on roads, most would say 'no' with some getting frothy.

Now days, especially among millennials, we take the existence of surveillance in the public sphere for granted. Many might see it as necessary now since they helped capture the Boston bombers.


#36    ninjadude

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 01:56 AM

View PostOverSword, on 07 May 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Confession time.  Last Friday I went out for dinner.  When I reached the main street in my nieghborhood I noticed a large unattended black duffle bag sitting against the corner of the starbucks.

why is it that luggage needs to "attended"? will it wander off? will someone kidnap it? will it do drugs?

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#37    Bama13

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 03:11 PM

View Postninjadude, on 08 May 2013 - 01:56 AM, said:

why is it that luggage needs to "attended"? will it wander off? will someone kidnap it? will it do drugs?

Same thing can be said about guns. Maybe we should require background checks before you can buy luggage.

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#38    RavenHawk

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 06:49 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 07 May 2013 - 03:45 PM, said:

And, if Americans are not relinquishing civil liberties for terrorism they either did not understand the question or they are hiding it quite well. Any airport tells you a different story.
I own a pair of pants that has a button or rivet that always sets off the scanner.  Every time I fly, I ensure that I wear those pants and I force them to check me.  Imagine what would happen if enough people did that?  The delays would cause them to rethink the scan approach and we could begin to take back more of our liberties.

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#39    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 08:51 PM

People who fly often, especially on business, with tight schedules, wanting to get back home to family perhaps, have little time to afford delaying the process for themselves.

They might be the ones who shake their head wondering about the newb (as they would perceive you) who does not know how to dress properly for a flight.

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What if your flights were back-to-back days, wearing a repeat of pants like that is a crime, a fashion crime!

For now you are just delaying fellow passengers with a very selfish and ineffective protest...

Edited by Leave Britney alone!, 08 May 2013 - 09:07 PM.


#40    Babe Ruth

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 09:03 PM

The Global War On Terror is such a cruel hoax. :td:


#41    Avatar Samantha Ai

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 09:04 PM

Or maybe the global hoax of terror is a cruel war?


#42    questionmark

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 10:26 PM

View PostRavenHawk, on 08 May 2013 - 06:49 PM, said:

I own a pair of pants that has a button or rivet that always sets off the scanner.  Every time I fly, I ensure that I wear those pants and I force them to check me.  Imagine what would happen if enough people did that?  The delays would cause them to rethink the scan approach and we could begin to take back more of our liberties.

My dungarees (overalls for Americans) always set off the scanners, the difference between Europe and the US is that in Europe everybody seems to know that and no big circus, in the US the blokes always drive crazy. Now, I don't care how much I hold the line: I refuse to wear anything else if I am not wearing a suit.

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#43    shrooma

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 11:08 PM

View PostDan, on 07 May 2013 - 04:29 PM, said:



How could a mayor even tell everyone what size soda they can drink?
.
over here, the EU have tried to do just that, saying we can't sell liquids in pints (568ml) but have to use half litres (500ml) instead.
I buy milk in 4pt bottles, but the EU version, 2ltrs, contains half a pint less, but they both cost the same price!

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#44    shrooma

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 11:16 PM

View Postaztek, on 07 May 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:


not to mention shortly after he waned to introduce "congestion fee" for anyone driving into the city. iirc $8
.
we've got congestion charges over here, started in london a few yrs ago.
now every city is planning on jumping on the cash-cow bandwagon.
started off as an alleged anti-pollution measure, and turned into just one more way for local govt. to get their grubby little mitts into your wallets.....

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#45    shrooma

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Posted 08 May 2013 - 11:36 PM

View PostBabe Ruth, on 08 May 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

The Global War On Terror is such a cruel hoax. :td:
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the war on terror,
like the war on crime,
is a war against anyone, anytime.
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