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Why are atheists afraid of ghosts


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#16    Irrelevant

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 11:49 AM

I just feel sorry for those who don't believe, I guess having the experience my faith has passed to belief. I was asked to test my understandings and did.

Here's one for the atheists to test: Living for the sake of others.
This principle states what you put out comes back. But it's beyond that, because its not just what you put out financially
(and for most atheists this what they care with most, there material wealth since there's nothing greater in the world and nothing after anyway) this means that giving all your heart to your family, community and going out of your way even to your own detriment to help others should come back to you. Now if it comes back as some form of Karma that means there's a external world you  can't see opperating behind the sceans right? So if your an atheist and you believe in karma and then your not a true Athiest at all, No, your Agnostic! And since your agnostic why be critical of those who have gone further and actually encountered that being/beings who do call the shots and have learnt more, if you don't seek to understand what that invisible force is then your not just Agnostic but your also now choosing to be Ignorant (and you might take that as insult but its not ment to be, it's just saying you are choosing to IGNORE or be ignorant of that force rather than try understand it )

A true Athiest doesn't believe in Ghost,Karma, or any such invisible force...those who do are Ignorant Agnostics, and that level of ignorance depends on how much spiritual growth you have obtained.

I can assure you there is a God!( Check over the other thread occasionally about Spirit world,World works)... We're still yet to get to some of the deep topics like Indemnity. How fasting and other practices allow for payment. But what is the most powerful force in the world including in the NonCopereal world? It's love! What I'm telling you is if you give pure love to everybody then you won't need to seek God or Spiritual things, they will seek YOU! And not matter how hard you try not believe they will want to be around you and introduce themselves to you. Love is the answer atheists , try believing and trust in something more important than you. Take my test, what have you got to loose? If there's nothing out there as you think....TAKE THE TEST! Once you encounter something and become Agnostic , keep going and learning or  else you are just deciding to continue to stay ignorant.  Ask God to teach you and guide you with his Eyes.

Edited by Irrelevant, 12 May 2013 - 12:02 PM.


#17    Rlyeh

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 12:26 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 11:49 AM, said:

Here's one for the atheists to test: Living for the sake of others.
This principle states what you put out comes back. But it's beyond that, because its not just what you put out financially
(and for most atheists this what they care with most, there material wealth since there's nothing greater in the world and nothing after anyway) this means that giving all your heart to your family, community and going out of your way even to your own detriment to help others should come back to you. Now if it comes back as some form of Karma that means there's a external world you  can't see opperating behind the sceans right? So if your an atheist and you believe in karma and then your not a true Athiest at all, No, your Agnostic! And since your agnostic why be critical of those who have gone further and actually encountered that being/beings who do call the shots and have learnt more, if you don't seek to understand what that invisible force is then your not just Agnostic but your also now choosing to be Ignorant (and you might take that as insult but its not ment to be, it's just saying you are choosing to IGNORE or be ignorant of that force rather than try understand it )
Please tell us the definition of atheist or atheism.

Quote

I can assure you there is a God!( Check over the other thread occasionally about Spirit world,World works)...
You don't even know what an atheist is, now you're pretending to be someone credible.

Edit: Checked the thread, it is a bunch of opinions.

Edited by Rlyeh, 12 May 2013 - 12:30 PM.


#18    Irrelevant

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 12:30 PM

Hmmmm. Toes feel a little hurt huh?


#19    RockabyeBillie

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 12:35 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 11:49 AM, said:

I just feel sorry for those who don't believe, I guess having the experience my faith has passed to belief. I was asked to test my understandings and did.

Here's one for the atheists to test: Living for the sake of others.
This principle states what you put out comes back. But it's beyond that, because its not just what you put out financially
(and for most atheists this what they care with most, there material wealth since there's nothing greater in the world and nothing after anyway) this means that giving all your heart to your family, community and going out of your way even to your own detriment to help others should come back to you. Now if it comes back as some form of Karma that means there's a external world you  can't see opperating behind the sceans right? So if your an atheist and you believe in karma and then your not a true Athiest at all, No, your Agnostic! And since your agnostic why be critical of those who have gone further and actually encountered that being/beings who do call the shots and have learnt more, if you don't seek to understand what that invisible force is then your not just Agnostic but your also now choosing to be Ignorant (and you might take that as insult but its not ment to be, it's just saying you are choosing to IGNORE or be ignorant of that force rather than try understand it )

A true Athiest doesn't believe in Ghost,Karma, or any such invisible force...those who do are Ignorant Agnostics, and that level of ignorance depends on how much spiritual growth you have obtained.

I can assure you there is a God!( Check over the other thread occasionally about Spirit world,World works)... We're still yet to get to some of the deep topics like Indemnity. How fasting and other practices allow for payment. But what is the most powerful force in the world including in the NonCopereal world? It's love! What I'm telling you is if you give pure love to everybody then you won't need to seek God or Spiritual things, they will seek YOU! And not matter how hard you try not believe they will want to be around you and introduce themselves to you. Love is the answer atheists , try believing and trust in something more important than you. Take my test, what have you got to loose? If there's nothing out there as you think....TAKE THE TEST! Once you encounter something and become Agnostic , keep going and learning or  else you are just deciding to continue to stay ignorant.  Ask God to teach you and guide you with his Eyes.

I am an atheist and I can assure you the greatest thing in the world to me is not material wealth. I don't believe I am the most important thing in the world, either. I don't need the laws of the bible to treat other human beings kindly. In fact, it is a frightening thought that the only reason a majority of people aren't *******s or serial killers is because some old book tells them it's wrong. If that's the case, then your morals are still greatly skewed. I donate time and money to charities and I am kind to people. I can't carry cash around because I have a tendency to give it to the homeless. How many 'believers' can say that? It is ignorant to make a blanket statement about atheists like that when you apparently have no real experience being around them.

However, it is NOT ignorant to require proof of something in order to first believe it. If a man on the street offered you a drink and said it would give you the ability to fly, would you just take it? Hopefully not. Hopefully common sense would tell you that's not possible, and you'd want proof before you'd even consider drinking it. That's the same with me personally. So a book says there is a god, so what? There are a lot of books about a lot of gods. How do I know which theory is correct? The Christians and their single god? How about the ancient Egyptian Gods? Or the Greek Gods? Or the modern day Hindu Gods? The scientologists with the god they've recently created? Give me solid proof of which is real, then I will believe it.

And let's move on to the paranormal. Do I believe in ghosts? Not solidly. I have had things happen in my life that I couldn't explain, so I search for logical answers. There has to be some sort of logical scientific explanation behind the paranormal. Personally I tend to lean towards "Energy cannot be created or destroyed" and therefore perhaps we leave some sort of energy behind when we pass. I could be wrong. I'm waiting until we have solid, studied, proven answers.

In short, most atheists are nothing like what you said. So stop tossing the word ignorant around so loosely when you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. Want to know what atheists are actually like? Get to know some first. Do a little research. Don't just come up with a theory in your head and believe it without proof.

That's ignorant.

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#20    Rlyeh

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 12:44 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

Hmmmm. Toes feel a little hurt huh?
Is that meant to make sense?


#21    Irrelevant

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 12:53 PM

It's in the other thread, put up what you think you know or shut up.


#22    Rlyeh

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 12:55 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

It's in the other thread, put up what you think you know or shut up.
Then you should keep it in that thread.


#23    Irrelevant

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 01:04 PM

I shall. But you likewise should tell us what you know because we would all like to hear something other than criticism...impart us your great wealth of Knowledge..live for the sake others and share what you know. take the test! Show me your God!


#24    Rlyeh

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 01:23 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 01:04 PM, said:

I shall. But you likewise should tell us what you know because we would all like to hear something other than criticism...impart us your great wealth of Knowledge..live for the sake others and share what you know. take the test! Show me your God!
I have... you don't know what atheism is.


#25    Lava_Lady

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 01:39 PM

View PostPerfection, on 12 May 2013 - 01:30 AM, said:

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On many forums there are people claiming that they don't believe in God, & yet have had an encounter with a ghost or alien, or other type of being.

It seems logical to me that if any life at all can exist outside of our known reality, then surely God can also exist. And if you don't believe in God then you must also not believe in any type of being whatsoever that is from outside of our reality.

When you say God, which one are you referring to?

There are a lot of then out there and not all support the idea of ghosts.  Some sects of the Seventh Day Adventist believe in the Christian God but not in spirits or ghosts.

Theoretical physicists that support the string theory say there are possibly countless parallel dimensions with our own bizarro selves.

Consider also the omnipotence paradox:

Quote



One version of the omnipotence paradox is the so-called paradox of the stone: "Could an omnipotent being create a stone so heavy that even he could not lift it?" If he could lift the rock, then it seems that the being would not have been omnipotent to begin with in that he would have been incapable of creating a heavy enough stone; if he could not lift the stone, then it seems that the being either would never have been omnipotent to begin with or would have ceased to be omnipotent upon his creation of the stone.[1]The argument is medieval, dating at least to the 12th century, addressed byAverroës (1126–1198) and later byThomas Aquinas.[2]Pseudo-Dionysius the Areopagite (before 532) has a predecessor version of the paradox, asking whether it is possible for God to "deny himself".




Also,.when you say it seems "logical" that if anything outside of our known reality exists then God must exist, it if more illogical since there is no absolute evidence of ethereal beings, extraterrestrial beings, dimensional beings, or anything close to it, including an omnipotent being, ie God.

There is nothing logical about religious beliefs.  Therefore an atheist can believe whatever they want, the title only indicates a disbelief of an omnipotent being.









"The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in the mind at the same time, and still retain the ability to function."  - F. Scott Fitzgerald


#26    eight bits

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 01:53 PM

Afraid of ghosts?

I must live in the wrong part of the world, since so many of the local ghost stories in New England involve unfrightening ghosts. Here's an example

http://uncertaintist...-for-halloween/

I don't know the religious beliefs, if any, of the family in the story or the newscasters telling it and commenting upon it, but why would anybody be frightened of a nice grandmotherly lady who appreciates that her house has been refurbished and that there is music in her home again?

This story, like many ghost stories, contains enough detail to cast some doubt about the relationship between the sightings and the former resident of the building. OK, but the family knows all those things, and they say they believe, perhaps based on the weight they give to the testimony of their own senses that a senitent being is among them.

What atheist, or much of anybody else, has to choose between the evidence of their senses and the weight of other evidence when it comes to the question of God? Usually, there is no evidence of their senses to weigh.

The problems are entirely different, and have nothing to do with each other. There is no unexplained mystery why the same person might give different answers to different questions.

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#27    Irrelevant

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 02:26 PM

View PostRockabyeBillie, on 12 May 2013 - 12:35 PM, said:



I am an atheist and I can assure you the greatest thing in the world to me is not material wealth. I don't believe I am the most important thing in the world, either. I don't need the laws of the bible to treat other human beings kindly. In fact, it is a frightening thought that the only reason a majority of people aren't *******s or serial killers is because some old book tells them it's wrong. If that's the case, then your morals are still greatly skewed. I donate time and money to charities and I am kind to people. I can't carry cash around because I have a tendency to give it to the homeless. How many 'believers' can say that? It is ignorant to make a blanket statement about atheists like that when you apparently have no real experience being around them.

However, it is NOT ignorant to require proof of something in order to first believe it. If a man on the street offered you a drink and said it would give you the ability to fly, would you just take it? Hopefully not. Hopefully common sense would tell you that's not possible, and you'd want proof before you'd even consider drinking it. That's the same with me personally. So a book says there is a god, so what? There are a lot of books about a lot of gods. How do I know which theory is correct? The Christians and their single god? How about the ancient Egyptian Gods? Or the Greek Gods? Or the modern day Hindu Gods? The scientologists with the god they've recently created? Give me solid proof of which is real, then I will believe it.

And let's move on to the paranormal. Do I believe in ghosts? Not solidly. I have had things happen in my life that I couldn't explain, so I search for logical answers. There has to be some sort of logical scientific explanation behind the paranormal. Personally I tend to lean towards "Energy cannot be created or destroyed" and therefore perhaps we leave some sort of energy behind when we pass. I could be wrong. I'm waiting until we have solid, studied, proven answers.

In short, most atheists are nothing like what you said. So stop tossing the word ignorant around so loosely when you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. Want to know what atheists are actually like? Get to know some first. Do a little research. Don't just come up with a theory in your head and believe it without proof.

That's ignorant.


But by your own words your defined as a Agnostic. People don't like being taking out of there comfort Zone and I already stated that being ignorant was not meant to insult but point out that if you believe there's something more out there but choose to IGNORE it and not try understand it in a greater way then that is being IGNORANT to whatever that is.

There's plenty of things I choose IGNORE as well, by choice. I ignore most of what society tells me I should accept, therefore I'm Ignorant to what is law sometimes, as I try follow heavenly law as best I can as its given to me through my conscience. I  don't agree with gay marriage or homosexuality as a life choice for example, I don't condemn  those who practice it and im ok to be there friends, and it does not bother me..but I don't except it as a valid lifestyle because its fruitless, literally fruitless since it takes a man and woman to make offspring in a natural manner.

I do know plenty of Atheist too (basically everybody I know!) , But believe this choice is a fruitless one to because God made humans to have a relationship with them. What people believe is there choice, good luck to them and good luck to you with your lifestyle choices. Since this question pertains to Spirits  I answered it, feel free to take the test and see if what you give out comes back, and if it does in a way that's unexpected would it not be wrong to ask you to question or test how and if some invisible force did this in a repeatable way in your own life ? (Rather to referring to test done apparently by others) it's very simple,  God loves, blesses and  helps those who not just " ignore"  but also hate him or the very thought of him. Just as I love Gays (not that way! Lol) and Atheist..you sound like a person who does good therefore I wish you to receive all the blessings that God desires to give you.


#28    RockabyeBillie

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 02:38 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 02:26 PM, said:

But by your own words your defined as a Agnostic. People don't like being taking out of there comfort Zone and I already stated that being ignorant was not meant to insult but point out that if you believe there's something more out there but choose to IGNORE it and not try understand it in a greater way then that is being IGNORANT to whatever that is.

There's plenty of things I choose IGNORE as well, by choice. I ignore most of what society tells me I should accept, therefore I'm Ignorant to what is law sometimes, as I try follow heavenly law as best I can as its given to me through my conscience. I  don't agree with gay marriage or homosexuality as a life choice for example, I don't condemn  those who practice it and im ok to be there friends, and it does not bother me..but I don't except it as a valid lifestyle because its fruitless, literally fruitless since it takes a man and woman to make offspring in a natural manner.

I do know plenty of Atheist too (basically everybody I know!) , But believe this choice is a fruitless one to because God made humans to have a relationship with them. What people believe is there choice, good luck to them and good luck to you with your lifestyle choices. Since this question pertains to Spirits  I answered it, feel free to take the test and see if what you give out comes back, and if it does in a way that's unexpected would it not be wrong to ask you to question or test how and if some invisible force did this in a repeatable way in your own life ? (Rather to referring to test done apparently by others) it's very simple,  God loves, blesses and  helps those who not just " ignore"  but also hate him or the very thought of him. Just as I love Gays (not that way! Lol) and Atheist..you sound like a person who does good therefore I wish you to receive all the blessings that God desires to give you.

How does that make me agnostic? An agnostic is someone who believes that it's possible there is a god but follows no denomination. An atheist is someone who doesn't believe there is one whatsoever. I don't believe there is one.

You've made up these definitions in your head and they are incorrect.

Also it is quite ignorant to consider homosexuality a lifestyle choice, because it is not. But I'll leave that.

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#29    Tiggs

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 02:57 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 11:49 AM, said:

Here's one for the atheists to test: Living for the sake of others.
This principle states what you put out comes back. But it's beyond that, because its not just what you put out financially
(and for most atheists this what they care with most, there material wealth since there's nothing greater in the world and nothing after anyway) this means that giving all your heart to your family, community and going out of your way even to your own detriment to help others should come back to you.
Given the choice, who wouldn't want universal justice?

As an atheist, I'd love for Karma to be true, but it's not. That doesn't stop us from giving what we have to others. In fact - knowing that there is no inbuilt justice system in the universe compels us to do so.

If there is no external agency, we are responsible. We can't just close our eyes and pray it away.

We hope that one good deed will spawn another, but we do not rely on it. We do not treat those who are misfortunate as if a deity has already passed judgement on that person.

We cannot justify personal material wealth on the basis that some deity, somewhere, has deemed us somehow worthy to possess it.

In short - there is no universal justice. Life is not fair.

We treat others as we would wish to be treated because our moral compass is based on compassion.

It's really that simple.


Quote

A true Athiest doesn't believe in Ghost,Karma, or any such invisible force...those who do are Ignorant Agnostics, and that level of ignorance depends on how much spiritual growth you have obtained.
I personally don't see why an atheist has to describe ghosts in the context of an afterlife (as opposed to, say, overlapping universes, time slips, etc), nor do I see why an atheist who had decided to believe in an afterlife would become an agnostic, ignorant or otherwise.

Contrary to popular opinion, agnostic is not the middle ground between atheists and theists, through which one has to pass to reach the other.

That middle ground is "Undecided". Agnostics live somewhere called "Undecidable", and while the words look similar, only one of those is still making their mind up.


#30    _Only

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Posted 12 May 2013 - 03:50 PM

View PostIrrelevant, on 12 May 2013 - 11:49 AM, said:


Here's one for the atheists to test: Living for the sake of others.

This is an attribute that is widely held dear by people of all type, including those who don't believe in a God. It's a common misconception by those of faith that belief in a god has to be a reason for such compassion. You're deifying normal human emotions.

Quote

A true Athiest doesn't believe in Ghost,Karma, or any such invisible force...those who do are Ignorant Agnostics, and that level of ignorance depends on how much spiritual growth you have obtained.


No, that's not true at all. You're personally connecting 'ghosts' to a deity, and assuming that everyone else thinks the same as you. Why must a 'ghost' be connected to a deity? Why can't it be a projection caught in time, a product from within the mind, or any other possible explanation? It can be. Sometimes it seems the atheist/agnostic/uninterested might have clearer judgement in determining the nature of something, not needing to necessarily connect everything to or not to a God.

I won't comment on the ignorant agnostic bit, as I wouldn't be able to politely.

Edited by _Only, 12 May 2013 - 03:56 PM.

"I think there may be "ghost phenomenon" that may be still not fully understood or dismissed, but that doesn't make it spirits of the dead, anymore than "UFO" means "spaceship" or even "UFO" or "spaceship" is directly related to aliens, or anything else. There is way too much assumption and a baseless reliance on anecdotal lore, like when people assert this or that about the spirit world or the astral plane or Ouija board demons, or religion. I say 'says WHO?'" - Paranormalcy




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