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IRS Asks For Content Of Prayers

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#16    Otto von Pickelhaube

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 03:21 PM

View PostBama13, on 22 May 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

They "cheat" on their taxes legally. Wait...what? You can legally "cheat"? I thought cheating involved breaking the rules. You're saying that cheating involves following the rules? I think you need to look up the defination of "cheat".
Surely you must know it's very easy for big corporations and churches (which I believe can claim charitable status) to exploit all sorts of dodges and loopholes and remain within the law. That's nothing new.

If, as it seems, we are in the process of becoming a totalitarian society in which the state apparatus is all-powerful, the ethics most important for the survival of the true, free, human individual would be: cheat, lie, evade, fake it, be elsewhere, forge documents, build improved electronic gadgets in your garage that’ll outwit the gadgets used by the authorities.

- Philip K. Dick.


#17    Bama13

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 03:47 PM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 22 May 2013 - 03:21 PM, said:

Surely you must know it's very easy for big corporations and churches (which I believe can claim charitable status) to exploit all sorts of dodges and loopholes and remain within the law. That's nothing new.

It's nothing new and nothing illegal, nor is it cheating. Everyone I know takes every legal deduction they can. Are we all "cheating" on our taxes? Of course not, because we are obeying the rules.

"Dodges" and "loopholes" are just derogatory terms for something that is perfectly legal. Deductions is the correct term. Big corps and churches don't write the tax laws, although they influence the people that do. The writers would be our elected officals. Don't like the laws, then elect someone else instead of returning the incumbants. Rinse and repeat until you get the desired result. Don't blame tax payers for taking legal deductions, blame law makers for allowing the deductions.

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#18    ninjadude

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 03:48 PM

View Postdanielost, on 21 May 2013 - 08:37 PM, said:

But they rubber stamped the liberal ones.  That is the problem.

No, they don't. The IG said this.

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#19    ninjadude

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 04:01 PM

View PostMerc14, on 22 May 2013 - 01:09 AM, said:

Proof.  Show your proof if you are going to make these allegations.

Like for instance http://www.politicus...mon-romney.html

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#20    ninjadude

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 04:04 PM

View PostBama13, on 22 May 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

They "cheat" on their taxes legally. Wait...what? You can legally "cheat"? I thought cheating involved breaking the rules. You're saying that cheating involves following the rules? I think you need to look up the defination of "cheat".

No. 501c are tax exempt. They are asking for tax exemption under false pretenses.

Quote

In 2010, the Determinations Unit noticed something peculiar about the I.R.C. § 501© applications it was receiving. Many of the applications requesting I.R.C. § 501©(4) status as a “social welfare” organization were clearly, on closer review, not social welfare groups. An example of this is Karl Rove’s Crossroads GPS, which sought social welfare organization status. Crossroads GPS’s parent organization, American Crossroads, is a I.R.C. § 527 organization, which are required to publicly disclose their donors.
This raised a red flag with the IRS. First, no group has to file an application with the IRS to call itself a social welfare organization. Social welfare organizations cannot receive tax-deductible charitable contributions and cannot primarily engage in political campaign interventions.
A social welfare organization can engage in unlimited legislative lobbying and can engage in general advocacy — as long as that advocacy does not favor specific legislation or the election of a candidate.
http://www.mintpress...for-irs-fiasco/

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#21    ninjadude

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 04:06 PM

View PostBama13, on 22 May 2013 - 03:47 PM, said:

It's nothing new and nothing illegal, nor is it cheating. Everyone I know takes every legal deduction they can.

we're not talking about everyone you know. We're talking about tax exempt organizations.

"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin it now!""
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#22    Otto von Pickelhaube

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 04:14 PM

View PostBama13, on 22 May 2013 - 03:47 PM, said:

It's nothing new and nothing illegal, nor is it cheating. Everyone I know takes every legal deduction they can. Are we all "cheating" on our taxes? Of course not, because we are obeying the rules.

"Dodges" and "loopholes" are just derogatory terms for something that is perfectly legal. Deductions is the correct term. Big corps and churches don't write the tax laws, although they influence the people that do. The writers would be our elected officals. Don't like the laws, then elect someone else instead of returning the incumbants. Rinse and repeat until you get the desired result. Don't blame tax payers for taking legal deductions, blame law makers for allowing the deductions.
No need to get on your high horse about it. Of course anyone would do it if they had half a chance, but it's all still a scam, isn't it.

If, as it seems, we are in the process of becoming a totalitarian society in which the state apparatus is all-powerful, the ethics most important for the survival of the true, free, human individual would be: cheat, lie, evade, fake it, be elsewhere, forge documents, build improved electronic gadgets in your garage that’ll outwit the gadgets used by the authorities.

- Philip K. Dick.


#23    Bama13

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 05:48 PM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 22 May 2013 - 04:14 PM, said:

No need to get on your high horse about it. Of course anyone would do it if they had half a chance, but it's all still a scam, isn't it.

Sorry, just get tired of people saying they are "cheating" on their taxes for taking legal deductions. Taking advantage of the rules isn't cheating.

If you are talking about our tax system then yes, it is all a scam.

" Mighty little force is needed to control a man whose mind has been hoodwinked; contrariwise, no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free. No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything —you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him" - Robert Heinlein

#24    Bama13

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 05:54 PM

View Postninjadude, on 22 May 2013 - 04:06 PM, said:

we're not talking about everyone you know. We're talking about tax exempt organizations.

Tell you what, you talk about what you want and I'll talk about what I want.

I was talking about "cheating" on taxes and how taking legal deductions isn't "cheating". You, as usual, are simply defending your party according to the latest talking points, catchwords, and marching orders you recieved from your handlers.

" Mighty little force is needed to control a man whose mind has been hoodwinked; contrariwise, no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free. No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything —you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him" - Robert Heinlein

#25    Merc14

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 10:21 PM

View Postninjadude, on 22 May 2013 - 04:01 PM, said:


That is perhaps the most one-sided, shrill left wing article you ahever posted here and it is irrelevant to the matter at hand.  If that is teh crap you read then no wnder youy are here defending the IRS (who defends the IRS?!?!?)

The problem is you don't understand what this scandal is about do you?  None of the 500 organizations (and climbing) could've "cheated" on their 501 c3/4 stauts because THEY DIDN"T HAVE ONE.  I use caps because apparentl, after pages and pages of you defending the IRS, you still don't comprehend what you are defendinfg.  How can that be?  I offered you ample articles from varied sources, did you read any of them?  Probably not.   It is fun,BTW, watching spin out of control defending the absolutely indefensible with some of teh most absurd rationalizattions I have ever seen.  Keep it up, you are helping the cause immensely.

Believing when there is no compelling evidence is a mistake.  The idea is to withhold belief until there is compelling evidence and if the universe does not comply with our predispositions, okay, then we have the wrenching obligation to accommodate to the way the universe really is.  - Carl Sagan

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#26    danielost

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Posted 22 May 2013 - 11:28 PM

View Postninjadude, on 22 May 2013 - 03:48 PM, said:



No, they don't. The IG said this.

Is that why obamas brother got his through in three days.  Even tho he had't payed taxes for the last three years.  Not, only did they rubber stamp it, they wiped out his tax bill.

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#27    ninjadude

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 03:14 AM

View PostBama13, on 22 May 2013 - 05:54 PM, said:

Tell you what, you talk about what you want and I'll talk about what I want.

I was talking about "cheating" on taxes and how taking legal deductions isn't "cheating". You, as usual, are simply defending your party according to the latest talking points, catchwords, and marching orders you recieved from your handlers.

ok but the whole IRS so called "scandal" is about tax exempt organisations not individuals.  Yes taking legal deductions is not cheating.

"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin it now!""
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#28    ninjadude

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 03:16 AM

View PostMerc14, on 22 May 2013 - 10:21 PM, said:

  None of the 500 organizations (and climbing) could've "cheated" on their 501 c3/4 stauts because THEY DIDN"T HAVE ONE.

no duh. They were requesting tax exempt status and I would argue under false pretenses aka cheating.

"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin it now!""
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#29    ninjadude

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 03:17 AM

View Postdanielost, on 22 May 2013 - 11:28 PM, said:

Is that why obamas brother got his through in three days.  Even tho he had't payed taxes for the last three years.  Not, only did they rubber stamp it, they wiped out his tax bill.

Millions of taxpayers get their return done in a few days. Nothing so scandalous about that. And the whole "scandal" has nothing to do with individuals.

"Whatever you can do or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has genius, power and magic in it. Begin it now!""
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#30    F3SS

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 03:21 AM

Yea who defends the IRS? Lol






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