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TWA 800 Hit By Missile?


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#31    skyeagle409

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 08:58 PM

View PostBabe Ruth, on 27 May 2013 - 07:48 PM, said:

No Don, it was a missle.  

Impossible, because radar data did not depicted any such missile launch. So once again,  you have reconfirmed that you were duped by another false story. Your track record for accepting false stories is very clear.

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#32    skyeagle409

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 09:01 PM

View PostRaptorBites, on 27 May 2013 - 07:09 AM, said:

Where did you think the missile came from?  A Naval Missile Boat?

I don't know if you are aware of naval vessel procedures or anything with regards to missile drill or live fire exercises (my father was in the Navy for 23 years and worked on several missile boats), considering that missile boats had over 150+ sailors on it, you'd think those sailors knew a live missile was fired off their bow.

Hell, before launching, it's announced to clear the bow for safety reasons.  Why hasn't any of them spoken up after 20 years?

Conspiracies such as a naval missile boat shot down TWA 800 rely on the opinion that only certain few on a naval vessel knew a missile was fired off their boat.  Which is completely based off ignorance.

I have often said that claims of conspiracist are ignorant-based and the conspiracy claim of TWA 800 is just another example where I was right on the money.

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#33    Rafterman

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 11:25 PM

View PostBabe Ruth, on 27 May 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:



If you had bothered to read the original post, you would have noted that more than 100 credible witnesses (FBI term, not mine) reported seeing a missle.



So 100 people who saw a flash in the sky, saw a streak of light heading upwards, and then heard a boom are credible?

Unfortunately, they had no idea what they were looking at and were wrong in their perception of the event.

The flash they saw was the explosion of the fuel tank.  When they looked and saw the light heading upwards, they were looking at the rear portion of the 747 in a death climb having lost its nose section.  They sound they they heard that they assumed was a missile strike was the sound of the initial explosion finally reaching their ears.

You know, because light travels faster than sound.

And if you're still convinced it was a missile strike, analyze the radar data and show where what SkyEagle said was incorrect.  After that, find the ship that fired said missile and get one of the 200 or so crew members to go public about it.

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#34    RaptorBites

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Posted 27 May 2013 - 11:39 PM

View PostRafterman, on 27 May 2013 - 11:25 PM, said:

So 100 people who saw a flash in the sky, saw a streak of light heading upwards, and then heard a boom are credible?

Unfortunately, they had no idea what they were looking at and were wrong in their perception of the event.

The flash they saw was the explosion of the fuel tank.  When they looked and saw the light heading upwards, they were looking at the rear portion of the 747 in a death climb having lost its nose section.  They sound they they heard that they assumed was a missile strike was the sound of the initial explosion finally reaching their ears.

You know, because light travels faster than sound.

And if you're still convinced it was a missile strike, analyze the radar data and show where what SkyEagle said was incorrect.  After that, find the ship that fired said missile and get one of the 200 or so crew members to go public about it.

I wouldn't hold my breath for BR to provide evidence.

Probably provide some snark remark about how the US Government are known liars and are lying about this one, hence why no evidence has been brought forward.

I mean seriously, the government was not able to cover up a semen stain on Lewinski's dress, yet able to cover up 9/11 and TWA 800?

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#35    DONTEATUS

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 12:24 AM

We all can agree on that one  rafterman& Raptorbites ! BR will indeed go down like he was shot like a missle hit !

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#36    Babe Ruth

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 03:05 PM

View PostRafterman, on 27 May 2013 - 11:25 PM, said:

So 100 people who saw a flash in the sky, saw a streak of light heading upwards, and then heard a boom are credible?

Unfortunately, they had no idea what they were looking at and were wrong in their perception of the event.

The flash they saw was the explosion of the fuel tank.  When they looked and saw the light heading upwards, they were looking at the rear portion of the 747 in a death climb having lost its nose section.  They sound they they heard that they assumed was a missile strike was the sound of the initial explosion finally reaching their ears.

You know, because light travels faster than sound.

And if you're still convinced it was a missile strike, analyze the radar data and show where what SkyEagle said was incorrect.  After that, find the ship that fired said missile and get one of the 200 or so crew members to go public about it.

Clearly sir, we are 2 different individuals with probably more differences than similarities.

From the beginning, and it was random chance that I happened to be watching TV when Clinton came on, this has been a coverup.

You have demonstrated clearly that you are somehow colorblind when it comes to coverups.  By that I mean you are unable to perceive coverups, and accept whatever story is thrown out.

The radar tracks you hold as some sort of Sky delivered Holy Grail, have nothing at all to do with what, or how, people on the ground perceived the event.  I am happy to accept the radar tracks, but they really don't prove much.  Certainly they are moot as to any coverup.

Digging around last night, I found an old copy of AW&ST from December 15, 1997.  The article on page 34, entitled "Report Cites Obstacles To Witness Interviews" documents yet another aspect of the coverup.  Assuming that you are interested, I will enter some of those little facts.  I also assume, perhaps wrongly, that you were already aware of the battle between FBI and NTSB that happened and was reported on, during the investigation of that accident.

As the witness group from NTSB was about to start interviewing, the following:

"Two days after the...crash, as the witness group was preparing to start interviewing witnesses, an FBI agent informed NTSB officials that the bureau 'was not prepared to share any information outside the NTSB, so parties (to the safety board investigation) could not be involved.  The NTSB had named one of its investigators, Bruce Magladry, to head the witness group, which initially included representatives of TWA, ALPA, and the FAA."

"On July 21 1996, the report states, AUSAttorney Valerie Caproni informed Magladry and Norm Wiemeyer, head of the Flight 800 probe's operations group, 'that no interviews were to be conducted by the NTSB.'  Safety Board investigators could review FBI supplied documents on the witnesses, 'provided no notes were taken and no copies were made.'"

So just as happened 5 years later with 911, the NTSB was told to go to the corner and keep your mouth shut.

You, my friend, are unable to perceive coverup, but this is the nuts and bolts of the coverup that took place regarding TWA800.

There is a reason for the coverup, and it's most likely that the government screwed up somehow or other, and it was trying to keeep it secret.  No big deal really, because it is standard behavior for the government.


#37    Rafterman

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 03:16 PM

View PostBabe Ruth, on 28 May 2013 - 03:05 PM, said:

Clearly sir, we are 2 different individuals with probably more differences than similarities.

From the beginning, and it was random chance that I happened to be watching TV when Clinton came on, this has been a coverup.

You have demonstrated clearly that you are somehow colorblind when it comes to coverups.  By that I mean you are unable to perceive coverups, and accept whatever story is thrown out.

The radar tracks you hold as some sort of Sky delivered Holy Grail, have nothing at all to do with what, or how, people on the ground perceived the event.  I am happy to accept the radar tracks, but they really don't prove much.  Certainly they are moot as to any coverup.

Digging around last night, I found an old copy of AW&ST from December 15, 1997.  The article on page 34, entitled "Report Cites Obstacles To Witness Interviews" documents yet another aspect of the coverup.  Assuming that you are interested, I will enter some of those little facts.  I also assume, perhaps wrongly, that you were already aware of the battle between FBI and NTSB that happened and was reported on, during the investigation of that accident.

As the witness group from NTSB was about to start interviewing, the following:

"Two days after the...crash, as the witness group was preparing to start interviewing witnesses, an FBI agent informed NTSB officials that the bureau 'was not prepared to share any information outside the NTSB, so parties (to the safety board investigation) could not be involved.  The NTSB had named one of its investigators, Bruce Magladry, to head the witness group, which initially included representatives of TWA, ALPA, and the FAA."

"On July 21 1996, the report states, AUSAttorney Valerie Caproni informed Magladry and Norm Wiemeyer, head of the Flight 800 probe's operations group, 'that no interviews were to be conducted by the NTSB.'  Safety Board investigators could review FBI supplied documents on the witnesses, 'provided no notes were taken and no copies were made.'"

So just as happened 5 years later with 911, the NTSB was told to go to the corner and keep your mouth shut.

You, my friend, are unable to perceive coverup, but this is the nuts and bolts of the coverup that took place regarding TWA800.

There is a reason for the coverup, and it's most likely that the government screwed up somehow or other, and it was trying to keeep it secret.  No big deal really, because it is standard behavior for the government.

Ooh, playing the "sir" card.  I must have struck a nerve.

Standard deflection noted.

Radar tracks prove nothing?  Interesting.

Governmental interdepartmental p***ing matches are now proof of coverups?  Well then everything must be a coverup then.

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#38    Babe Ruth

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 03:21 PM

Please Rafterman, explain to me the significance of the radar tracks.  I'm all ears.  See you after lunch, and hoping for some substance but not holding my breath.


#39    skyeagle409

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:22 PM

View PostBabe Ruth, on 28 May 2013 - 03:05 PM, said:


The radar tracks you hold as some sort of Sky delivered Holy Grail, have nothing at all to do with what, or how, people on the ground perceived the event.

People saw a flaming TWA 800 climbing into the sky that night because its center-of-gravity had shifted to the rear of the aircraft, which caused the aircraft to climb as a steep angle.

Quote

You, my friend, are unable to perceive coverup, but this is the nuts and bolts of the coverup that took place regarding TWA800.

There was no coverup. Problems were noted in the fuel tank and nothing to do with a coverup. There was no missile in the sky that night that intersected the flight  path of TWA 800. .

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#40    regeneratia

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:26 PM

why on earth would ppl find skeptoid a valid source?


View PostRafterman, on 23 May 2013 - 07:30 PM, said:

Here's a quick and good analysis by Brian Dunning for his Skeptoid podcast:

http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4099

In a nutshell, no one saw a missile because there wasn't one.  What they saw was simply the body of the aircraft streaking upward following the explosion and the forward part of the fuselage falling away.  Given their distance from the explosion, they saw it before they heard it, thus leading many to believe that what they were seeing and hearing was a missile strike.  Also important to point out, there were no military assets in the area that were armed with SAMs and the aircraft was out of range for a shoulder fired weapon.


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#41    RaptorBites

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:29 PM

View Postregeneratia, on 28 May 2013 - 04:26 PM, said:

why on earth would ppl find skeptoid a valid source?

Exactly how does that invalidate Rafter's post?

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#42    regeneratia

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:39 PM

View PostRaptorBites, on 28 May 2013 - 04:29 PM, said:

Exactly how does that invalidate Rafter's post?

the intent was not to refute. Think about it.

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#43    RaptorBites

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:43 PM

View Postregeneratia, on 28 May 2013 - 04:39 PM, said:

the intent was not to refute. Think about it.

You question skeptoid as being refutable.  That has zero consequences as to where Rafter man got his quote/article.

By questioning the validity of a statement based on its location, is an opinion that asserts you find the statement false.

Again....how does the location of said statement invalidate Rafter's point?

Edited by RaptorBites, 28 May 2013 - 04:44 PM.

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#44    regeneratia

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 04:56 PM

View PostRaptorBites, on 28 May 2013 - 04:43 PM, said:

You question skeptoid as being refutable.  That has zero consequences as to where Rafter man got his quote/article.

By questioning the validity of a statement based on its location, is an opinion that asserts you find the statement false.

Again....how does the location of said statement invalidate Rafter's point?

that is you opinion, raptor. As I have pointed out, you are inaccurate in your ability to determine my motivations for things. I understand how you can be so inaccurate. I am pretty certain that you and I have nothing in common, while commonality leads to accurate understandings.

So why on earth would one deem Skeptiod to be a valid source of information? Can you give me a reason why? There has to be something you can think of. If you find it, I will read it and consider it. But this is the end of discussion along this line.

I am out of this discussion. But I will read on it some more. I remember people talking about a missle at the time, way back when. I was online, read the news on it, went to alternative media even then.

Edited by regeneratia, 28 May 2013 - 05:02 PM.

Truth is such a rare quality, a stranger so seldom met in this civilization of fraud, that it is never received freely, but must fight its way into the world
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Robert Heinlein: SECRECY IS THE HALLMARK OF TYRANNY!

#45    DONTEATUS

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Posted 28 May 2013 - 06:14 PM

And which movie is "Skeptoid " in ? Salt water always gets them I think? :alien:

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