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Favorite Historical Mystery


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#106    HMS Dreadnought

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 01:57 PM

View PostLucidElement, on 12 June 2013 - 04:05 AM, said:

D. B. Cooper (aka “Dan Cooper”) is a pseudonym given to a notorious aircraft hijacker who, on November 24, 1971, after receiving a ransom payout of $200,000, leapt from the back of a Boeing 727 as it was flying over the Pacific Northwest somewhere over the southern Cascades.
Cooper has not been seen since and it is not known whether he survived the jump. In 1980, an eight year old boy found $5,800 of soggy $20 bills washed up on the banks of the Columbia river. The serial numbers matched those of the ransom money which had been noted to make it easier to track Cooper later.
Cooper escaped from the plane by jumping off the rear airstair with a parachute leading aviation authorities to add stricter measures about the design of planes to prevent it from happening again. In addition, this event caused airports to install metal detectors for the first time.

I have to say the D.B. Cooper mystery is fascinating to myself as well :tu:

Dear you guys. Words cannot express how much I hate you guys. As we fight our way northward into the great unknown, only that one thing remains certain: that I hate you guys with every tired muscle in my confederate body. We have taken Topeka and I must rally the men onward to Missouri. Because I will not stop until we have won it all, and you guys are my slaves. Because I hate you guys. I hate you guys so very very much. Yours, General Cartman Lee.

#107    Kowalski

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 03:45 PM

Who was the Man in the Iron Mask?

Link: http://historicmyste...-the-iron-mask/


#108    Skithia

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 03:57 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 11 June 2013 - 06:13 PM, said:

As many will know, one of my most favorite mysteries is "Doggerland" :

http://www.unexplain...0

It was the area that is now the North Sea, and it got catastrophically flooded around 6150 BCE, after it was already steadily sinking because of rising sea levels and post glacial isostatic adjustment.

Why is it a mystery to me?

Because it was something close to a post-glacial North European paradise, it was densely populated, and because no recognizable myths have survived of its final submergence (caused by a huge tsunami that may have lasted for 2 days on end).

And the Strait of Dover  - formed right after the tsunami caused by the Storegga Slide - looked quite differently : many huge white cliffs standing close together and by that creating a dangerous situation (very strong sea currents)  for those who wanted to sail through it (and they did have boats back then, 8150 BP).

If there ever had been real "Pillars of Hercules", then these would have been it, 8150 years ago.

And those brave enough to pass those huge white chalk pillars would enter a shallow sea with mud shoals and a few remaining islands.

.
There was a really good Time Team program on Doggerland and the effect the tsunami had on the east coast of Britain the other week. If its on youtube or anything similar you might enjoy it :)

Edited by Skithia, 12 June 2013 - 03:58 PM.


#109    Abramelin

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 04:01 PM

View PostSkithia, on 12 June 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

There was a really good Time Team program on Doggerland and the effect the tsunami had on the east coast of Britain the other week. If its on youtube or anything similar you might enjoy it :)

Thanks Skithia. I think I saw that doc years ago. Once it was online on YouTube.

Wasn't the presenter of that doc the guy who played "Baldrick" in "Black Adder"?


#110    Myles

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 05:13 PM

View PostKowalski, on 12 June 2013 - 03:45 PM, said:

Who was the Man in the Iron Mask?

Link: http://historicmyste...-the-iron-mask/

Wow, talk about a story with so many variations!    No facts, no mask.   Even the part listed as facts admits that they cannot be verified.  
I guess that is what make it a mystery, right.  
It would be cool to find such a mask or documentation of the prisoner, but if keeping this hidden was their plan, why document it.


#111    LucidElement

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 04:34 AM

View Postthe L, on 12 June 2013 - 06:33 AM, said:

As I said before I think there is a list of works (which is not complete) what was in library. I study about library some 5 years ago. If you insist I could check.
Despite what Harte said we actually cant know is there any earth shaking work.
Perhaps one ancient mathmatician found formula for calculating prime numbers. We dont know.
As a proof that there WAS a earth shaking works there is that we dont have all major Aristotele works. We glorify Aristotele based on his notes for education his pupils which we collect in book and called a book. Now you can imagine what hides in other LOST Aristotele works which he personally collected and thought it was important. We actually have only Aristotele sketches not art.
Also despite what keithisco wrote libraries in Spain didnt have lost work from Alexandria. For example see above my example of Aristotele.
What was lost was lost. During library of Alexandria there were two more great libraries in ancient world which didnt have half of books what lied in Alexandria.
We know that based on fact that we dont have preserved major works of ancient world. Also Alexandria was center of world and have famous library.
Its logic to conclude that have greatest number of works.
Also despite what keithisco said about Enlightenment and dark ages...well there is period in between which move Europe from dark ages and its called renaissance.
And its based on European scholars mosty Cicero. When in renaissance earth wasnt center of universe but sun, suprisingly man become center of universe.
That doctrine is called humanism. And its responsible for renaissance. Ofcourse there are others factors as Ottoman conquest of Constantinopolis and influnces on Cicero and then  Islam scholars. But humanism led to todays science and it was invented in Europe. Imho opinion its greatest European invention.
But those libraries in Spain were great.
Also Harte said that Egyptians didnt know their own history. Well... British and Americans dont know their own history too but their historians DO know.
Same here. Egyptians didnt know but Berrosus maybe wrote chapter about their history. We cant know for sure did they or didnot know own history.
Harte conclude that on speculations that we today know more about AE then AE themselves. Which are pure speculations.
so just guess-timating, where do you think the world would be with works from the ancient world, and if alexandria never burned down?

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#112    LucidElement

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 04:37 AM

View PostSkithia, on 12 June 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

There was a really good Time Team program on Doggerland and the effect the tsunami had on the east coast of Britain the other week. If its on youtube or anything similar you might enjoy it :)
So it was like a atlantis?

View PostMyles, on 12 June 2013 - 05:13 PM, said:

Wow, talk about a story with so many variations! No facts, no mask.   Even the part listed as facts admits that they cannot be verified.  
I guess that is what make it a mystery, right.  
It would be cool to find such a mask or documentation of the prisoner, but if keeping this hidden was their plan, why document it.
I read somewhere it was his brother or brother in law??

"The Truth Is Out There, Its Up To Us To Find The Answers."

"Imagination Is More Important Than Knowledge." - Einstein

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#113    Lava_Lady

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 05:38 AM

View Postthe L, on 02 June 2013 - 01:10 PM, said:

There is no mysteries on Easter island. Those were not-smart theetless natives  who destroy their enviroment and in the end themselves.
Moai is monument for human stupidity.

Oh only one mystery there. What settler who cut last tree think at that moment?


What a horribly arrogant and insensitive thing to say about a culture.  For someone who is trying to come off as superior all you're really doing is flaunting your naivete.

And what is "theetless"?

"The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposed ideas in the mind at the same time, and still retain the ability to function."  - F. Scott Fitzgerald


#114    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 07:02 AM

View PostLava_Lady, on 13 June 2013 - 05:38 AM, said:

What a horribly arrogant and insensitive thing to say about a culture.  For someone who is trying to come off as superior all you're really doing is flaunting your naivete.

And what is "theetless"?
Sorry lapsus.
They didnt have teeths.
It isnt arrogant at all. Its called facts. Their leadership was far from being smart. Otherwise they wouldnt cause ecocide and own destruction.

Edited by the L, 13 June 2013 - 07:10 AM.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#115    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 07:08 AM

View PostLucidElement, on 13 June 2013 - 04:34 AM, said:

so just guess-timating, where do you think the world would be with works from the ancient world, and if alexandria never burned down?


Hard to speculate. Many many factors trough centuries might cause all kind of different scenarios.
For sure we will be far ,culturaly and sciencetificly, richer if we preserved library.
But, library of Alexandria wasnt only destruction of knowledge. We know that few Chinese emperors also burned books.
We need to separate destruction of books. For instance Pol Pot also burned all books in country so we must ask ourselves did he burnt some realy important work?
If so there was a small number. Very small. But for instance Chinese burning of books probably did cause damage since from Han till industrial revolution they were always center of the world when we talk about science and many others things.

During Hulagu siege of Baghdad, Mongols destroyed Baghdad library (Baghdad was one of scientific centers of that time).
When you came in today Iraq, even uneducated people in Baghdad tell stroy how Mongols sack city.
There is a legend that Tigris become red and black. Red from blood and black from ink. (when they drop books in it, Tigris wash away ink.)
That in fact isnt surprisng since in my country people always mentioned battles with Mongols (among many others).
Mongols were historical wild card.

Edited by the L, 13 June 2013 - 07:17 AM.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#116    Lava_Lady

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 07:12 AM

View Postthe L, on 13 June 2013 - 07:02 AM, said:

Sorry lapsus.
They didnt have teeths.
It isnt arrogant at all. Its called facts. They leadership was far from being smart.

Of course... you know because you were there....

Also, just fyi - it's toothless and how do you know they were toothless?  What do YOU think the settler was thinking when he cut down the last tree?

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#117    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 07:29 AM

Lava Lady,

I know it because I was interested in it so I read several books on theme. Polynesians of Rapa Nui where different from rest of their people.
There are islands which survived till today times based on coexistence with nature. There was islands on Pacific on which came numerous scientists to conclude why they are so successfull. I can give you more info about it. Despite positive examples we have Polynesian societies which did same things as those on Rapa Nui. Also, I can give example.
As Newton said: " I have studied these things — you have not." Thats how I know.

Personally, I dont have opinion what was going trough mind of person who cut last tree. Thats why I mentioning it as mystery.
They were withouth teeths because due lack of water they made juice from sugar cane I drink it regulary. You can imagine what was result.
As proof Europeans mentioned their bad shape of teeths plus we have archaeology.

Edited by the L, 13 June 2013 - 07:47 AM.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#118    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 07:46 AM

View PostLava_Lady, on 13 June 2013 - 07:12 AM, said:



Also, just fyi - it's toothless

Thanks on correction. I try to improve my English with UM.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#119    Abramelin

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 10:27 AM

View PostLucidElement, on 13 June 2013 - 04:37 AM, said:

So it was like a atlantis?



Not at all, though some have done their utmost best to 'prove' it was.

But there is the slightest possibility that the memory of it's destruction by a tsunami lingered on for many centuries and may have been an inspiration for Plato's Atlantis story, many thousands of years later.

From what they have found up to now, it did not resemble anything Plato mentioned about Atlantis. Well, aside from the Pillars of Hercules (the chalk cliffs of the Strait of Dover right after England got separated from France) and those mud shoals that were the remnants of Doggerland. Even though the tsunami caused by the Storegga Slde was one of the largest in human history, we should have found remnants of those Atlantian temples by now.


#120    Abramelin

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 10:31 AM

View PostLava_Lady, on 13 June 2013 - 05:38 AM, said:

What a horribly arrogant and insensitive thing to say about a culture.  For someone who is trying to come off as superior all you're really doing is flaunting your naivete.

And what is "theetless"?

Maybe The_L sounded a bit harsh, but I think he meant to say that the inhabitants of Easter Island chopped down all the trees on the island to use them for transporting those Moai, and by that caused their own downfall.





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