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Snowden (2009) berated government leaks


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#16    Jacques Terreur

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 07:06 AM

View PostThe world needs you, on 27 June 2013 - 03:44 AM, said:

Leaving means you are no longer a whistleblower. Can you name other whistleblowers who did that? No, Snowdem is a drama llama.

Bradley Manning also is not one, he stayed in the shadows. Whistleblowers stand up and speak out not run away and release information selectively.

Snowden is attempting to calculate his damage toward our security. He is helping our competitors. That is not what whistleblowing is. Look up Serpico.


so, you're the one who wrote "whistleblowing, 1. 01"? how would it help anybody if people, who risk enough with releasing information like that, should just sit there and wait until the CIA or whoever invites them for a nice round of waterboarding.  I see absolutely NO reason why he shouldn't try to save his life after uncovering the secrets of a corrupt system.


#17    Jessica Christ

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 07:09 AM

View PostJacques Terreur, on 27 June 2013 - 07:06 AM, said:

so, you're the one who wrote "whistleblowing, 1. 01"? how would it help anybody if people, who risk enough with releasing information like that, should just sit there and wait until the CIA or whoever invites them for a nice round of waterboarding.  I see absolutely NO reason why he shouldn't try to save his life after uncovering the secrets of a corrupt system.

Ralph Nader invented the term.

Voted for him once but voting for a third party is throwing your vote away. Not sure I would do so again.


#18    Jessica Christ

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 07:22 AM

Quote

*snip*

Federal law broadly protects whistle-blowers with one exception, employees who are privy to the nation's secrets, said Professor Richard E. Moberly, associate dean of the University of Nebraska College of Law.

"The definition of a whistle-blower depends on the context," he said. "Outside of national security we tend to think very broadly. [Whistle-blowers expose] not only illegal activity, but abuses of power, fraud, financial misconduct, and even unethical choices."

But employees entrusted with state secrets "should be more limited in how and what to disclose," he said.

Under the law, intelligence employees have their own system to report activity they believe violates the law or is unethical. Employees are instructed to report wrongdoing to Congress or their agency's inspector general, Moberly said.

The press, which has made heroes of past whistle-blowers like Jeffrey Wigand who exposed big tobacco's lies and Frank Serpico, an NYPD detective who took on police corruption, have selectively used the word "whistle-blower" to describe Snowden.

The Associated Press, which sets the style for many of its member agencies, issued a memo on Monday telling reporters to call Snowden a "leaker" rather than a "whistleblower."

"A whistle-blower is a person who exposes wrongdoing. It's not a person who simply asserts that what he has uncovered is illegal or immoral," wrote AP standards editor Tom Kent. "Whether the actions exposed by Snowden and [Pfc. Bradley] Manning constitute wrongdoing is hotly contested, so we should not call them whistle-blowers on our own at this point."

Hero. Traitor. Whistle-Blower. Spy. What to Call NSA Leaker Ed Snowden?


Quote

Edward Snowden, who illegally leaked classified information about a National Security Agency intelligence gathering program to a British newspaper last week, had ample legal channels to report what he felt were illegal or improper activities.

The inspector general for the Defense Department runs a hotline for military and intelligence officials to report such conduct in ways that do not disclose classified information to the public.

Experts on national security whistleblower laws say Snowden could also have disclosed the information to members of Congress.


Director of National Intelligence James Clapper said Tuesday that Snowden’s leak did “huge, grave damage” to the country’s intelligence-gathering capabilities.

The Pentagon provides avenues for whistleblowers to disclose alleged wrongdoing in ways that avoid disclosures that could have that affect.

The foremost law providing such an avenue is the Intelligence Community Whistleblower Protection Act (ICWPA).

*snip*

Even absent the ICWPA process, Zaid says Snowden could have personally disclosed the information to Congress.

“There are quite a number of members of Congress who he could’ve gone to who would have embraced him. Clearly [Sen.] Rand Paul [(R., Ky.)] would have been very interested in this, and Sen. [Ron] Wyden [(D., Ore.)]. On both sides of the aisle, there are members of Congress … who clearly would have embraced what he would have told them,” Zaid said.

If Snowden had come to his office, Zaid said, he would have brought him directly to Congress. “The way I handle it will give that person as much if not greater protection” than the ICWPA, he insisted.

“He could have revealed everything directly to Sen. Rand Paul, directly to Sen. Wyden,” Zaid said. “Any member of Congress has the appropriate security clearances for what he knew.”

*snip*

NSA Leaker Had Legal Means to Reveal Information

Edited by The world needs you, 27 June 2013 - 07:23 AM.


#19    Jacques Terreur

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 07:52 AM

View PostThe world needs you, on 27 June 2013 - 07:09 AM, said:

Ralph Nader invented the term.

Voted for him once but voting for a third party is throwing your vote away. Not sure I would do so again.

i don't even know who Ralph Nader is, but what i actually meant is: how come you're in a position to say what a "proper" whistleblower is and which ethical code she or he should follow (according to your previous post, that would be sitting still and waiting for the authorities to S.W.A.T. you away from your keyboard).....


#20    Bavarian Raven

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 01:58 PM

Quote

Voted for him once but voting for a third party is throwing your vote away. Not sure I would do so again.

No its not. But I get your a dem. type of person. Look how well THAT vote turned out :whistle:


#21    questionmark

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 02:44 PM

View PostJacques Terreur, on 27 June 2013 - 07:52 AM, said:

i don't even know who Ralph Nader is, but what i actually meant is: how come you're in a position to say what a "proper" whistleblower is and which ethical code she or he should follow (according to your previous post, that would be sitting still and waiting for the authorities to S.W.A.T. you away from your keyboard).....

You don't know who Ralph Nader is? I am afraid you have a lot to learn before being able to discuss politics informed.

Edited by questionmark, 27 June 2013 - 02:45 PM.

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#22    DeWitz

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 03:05 PM

This is a general shout-out to folks posting here, who know more about Snowden and his tactics, intentions and motivation than do I.

In all my absorption of mainstream media, I do not hear or see what it is that Snowden actually 'leaked.'

I understand that he left the country with classified documents, electronic or otherwise; I get that he has the potential for disseminating secret or top secret information; I even understand some of the nuances of the "is he a traitor/he is a patriot" argument.

But I only know that he stated a fact (perhaps a secret, but most of us knew it, at least intuitively, all along since the Patriot Act was rammed through during anthrax attacks, and W. started tapping phones, in 2001): That the federal government continues to be engaged in an unprecedented information-gathering operation that is ongoing to this moment.

But I do not know what specific information he has disclosed (I know, I can hear some folks grumbling, "He might have divulged all to the Soviets Russians already!). Has he said, "A. Homedi al Qani, of 17 Punjabi Street, 2nd floor #1, in Karachi, Pakistan, is really Albert H. Quint, CIA agent, and he can be reached at 011-53-555-666, ask for 'Homey;' he drinks tea at home daily from 3-5 pm and leaves his rear windows open all night?" I'm being rhetorically specific because I have seen no specific references to what information (the information itself, of course, would not be shared--just the nature of the information) he has actually given up.

I only know that he stated the obvious (unprecedented ongoing information-gathering) with the additional nugget that the Big Computer Program at NSA Headquarters is called "Prism." So the Beast has a name--so what?

Can anyone tell me what information he has leaked?

Edited by szentgyorgy, 27 June 2013 - 03:08 PM.

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#23    Jacques Terreur

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 06:44 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 27 June 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

You don't know who Ralph Nader is? I am afraid you have a lot to learn before being able to discuss politics informed.


call me sloppy and uninformed, but i don't really see why i should step kneedeep into foreign politics to be able to speak my mind in this discussion....


#24    Professor Buzzkill

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Posted 27 June 2013 - 11:43 PM

Exposing a crime is not a crime no matter how you cut it

Edited by Saru, 28 June 2013 - 10:52 AM.
Removed personal attack


#25    Jessica Christ

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Posted 28 June 2013 - 09:39 PM

View PostJacques Terreur, on 27 June 2013 - 07:52 AM, said:



i don't even know who Ralph Nader is, but what i actually meant is: how come you're in a position to say what a "proper" whistleblower is and which ethical code she or he should follow (according to your previous post, that would be sitting still and waiting for the authorities to S.W.A.T. you away from your keyboard).....

Snowden's association with WikiLeaks clarifies his own status as a leaker.




#26    DeWitz

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Posted 28 June 2013 - 09:55 PM

What information has Snowden leaked (see post #22) other than the fact that the NSA is engaged in an unprecedented collection of private information?

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