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Serial killers


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#1    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 09:40 PM

Iv been fascinated with serial killers since I first turned 16, Iv read many books about them how they are created, nurture vs nature and all of that, I think it can be a number of different things that can turn someone into a serial killer. But I always hear the victims of these serial killers say that there emotionless and so on.  Are they truly emotionless though, I mean they feel fear, excitement, happiness, the point is they feel the same emotions a lot of non killers do. The lack of a conscious is relative also, because Ed Kemper actually turned himself in because he knew that If he didn't he would continue to kill. He felt great remorse and even wanted a lobotomy to cut out the section of his brain that made him want to kill.  I'm in no way condoning what serial killers do also hell I think David Berkowitz should have been given the death penalty, but lucked out because at the time there was no death penalty in the state that he was living.

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#2    third_eye

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 12:35 AM

I've read a lot about the Famous Cases and one thing that stood out as consistent throughout the modern serial killers is that they're are all more often than not very 'normal' 'harmless' and even 'friendly' or 'loveable' in their day to day demeanor. Partly the reason why they are so 'successful' and managed to get away with numerous murders for a lengthy period of time.

The most frightening thing to me is how they can convince themselves that killing is the most normal thing that they do too ... they can kill someone in the most brutal fashion imaginable and then sit down to have dinner while watching TV the very next minute.

~

Quote

' ... life and death carry on as they always have ~ and always will, only the dreamer is gone ~ behind the flow of imagination, beyond any effort to be still
dancing in the ebb and flow of attention, more present than the breath, I find the origins of my illusions, only the dreamer is gone ~ the dream never ends
'

GIFTS WITH NO GIVER - a love affair with truth ~ Poems by Nirmala

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#3    QuiteContrary

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 12:53 AM

View Postthird_eye, on 04 July 2013 - 12:35 AM, said:

I've read a lot about the Famous Cases and one thing that stood out as consistent throughout the modern serial killers is that they're are all more often than not very 'normal' 'harmless' and even 'friendly' or 'loveable' in their day to day demeanor. Partly the reason why they are so 'successful' and managed to get away with numerous murders for a lengthy period of time.

The most frightening thing to me is how they can convince themselves that killing is the most normal thing that they do too ... they can kill someone in the most brutal fashion imaginable and then sit down to have dinner while watching TV the very next minute.

~

Or leave their victims dying while they go in and eat dinner with the wife and kids. (1950's? serial killer can't remember his name)

For me, in instances like this, something is not wired like the rest of us.


#4    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 12:56 AM

Yeah its like they can literally become a different person, I once heard the term compartmentalization which is what a lot of serial killers seem to be able to do. Ted Bundy had everyone shocked when they realized what he had been doing

Edited by R4z3rsPar4d0x, 04 July 2013 - 01:00 AM.

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#5    third_eye

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 01:02 AM

From a Psychological point of view it is actually the opposite in some cases ... they are wired too perfectly black and white ... yes and no ... can and cannot ... will and wont

When they see the world they see it as perfectly contrasted ... feel good and feel bad ... and they have absolute confidence in themselves ... even in jail you can see that they mostly claims that they were caught because they wanted to be caught ... no one is better or more capable than them.

The religious ones are the worse ... as they are more prone to be the sexual predators ... and preys on children.


~edit : dyslexia attack

`

Edited by third_eye, 04 July 2013 - 01:03 AM.

Quote

' ... life and death carry on as they always have ~ and always will, only the dreamer is gone ~ behind the flow of imagination, beyond any effort to be still
dancing in the ebb and flow of attention, more present than the breath, I find the origins of my illusions, only the dreamer is gone ~ the dream never ends
'

GIFTS WITH NO GIVER - a love affair with truth ~ Poems by Nirmala

third_eye ' s cavern ~ bring own beer


#6    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 01:13 AM

But don't you think the whole them wanting to be caught is just said because they have such an ego? I mean a lot of them want to be known for what they've done such as the BTK killer.  But I highly doubt Ted Bundy wanted to be caught. I mean because they have to know the consequences of being caught are probably gonna be a life sentence or even the death penalty

Edited by R4z3rsPar4d0x, 04 July 2013 - 01:15 AM.

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#7    third_eye

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 01:37 AM

View PostR4z3rsPar4d0x, on 04 July 2013 - 01:13 AM, said:

But don't you think the whole them wanting to be caught is just said because they have such an ego? I mean a lot of them want to be known for what they've done such as the BTK killer.  But I highly doubt Ted Bundy wanted to be caught. I mean because they have to know the consequences of being caught are probably gonna be a life sentence or even the death penalty

According to what I read about the investigation in Bundy's case the officials believed Ted ... he left clues and became erratic with last few murders ... drove stolen cars ... almost got arrested ... got arrested and escaped. When he was under custody he declared that he wished that the arresting officer had 'killed him' over and over again ... maybe is was his ego toying with the authorities but all in all he changed his MO to his disadvantage. I guess you could see it from the other perspective that his own ego got him caught but in Ted's case ... he was always one step ahead because he kept himself one step ahead throughout the years.

He even got married during his trial ... and had a child ... a daughter if I remember correctly ...
One of the things that I remember most of all is something one of the FBI agents said ...

Ted couldn't understand why people cant accept the fact that he killed because he wanted to ...  

or something to that effect ... I don't remember exactly ... it was a long time ago ...
I started getting into all this when I happened on the book about the Zodiac Killer ... and of course the most famous one of all ... the Silence of The Lambs

~

Quote

' ... life and death carry on as they always have ~ and always will, only the dreamer is gone ~ behind the flow of imagination, beyond any effort to be still
dancing in the ebb and flow of attention, more present than the breath, I find the origins of my illusions, only the dreamer is gone ~ the dream never ends
'

GIFTS WITH NO GIVER - a love affair with truth ~ Poems by Nirmala

third_eye ' s cavern ~ bring own beer


#8    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 02:13 AM

I thought Ted  in the interviews after being caught described the way he did the murders, like for instance he would say " and then he would drag her through the dirt and then bash her head" I don't know if that's the second  or third person he was talking in, then when the death penalty was getting near he blamed it all on hard*spam filter*ography as to the reason why he killed.

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THAT IS NOT DEAD WHICH CAN ETERNAL LIE AND WITH STRANGE AEONS EVEN DEATH MAY DIE

#9    ReaperS_ParadoX

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 03:10 AM

View PostQuiteContrary, on 04 July 2013 - 12:53 AM, said:



Or leave their victims dying while they go in and eat dinner with the wife and kids. (1950's? serial killer can't remember his name)

For me, in instances like this, something is not wired like the rest of us.
Was this in the United States or some other country?were the victims female or males?

Edited by R4z3rsPar4d0x, 04 July 2013 - 03:10 AM.

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#10    QuiteContrary

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 04:42 AM

View PostR4z3rsPar4d0x, on 04 July 2013 - 03:10 AM, said:

Was this in the United States or some other country?were the victims female or males?
United States. His victims were female and he would kill them in his garage. He lived in a neighborhood, had a wife and I'm pretty sure kids.  I just tried to find him in a serial killer database. Surely someone on UM knows who he is.  I am pretty sure it was the 1950's possibly the early '60's?


#11    QuiteContrary

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 04:50 AM

Sorry, I watched three shows on different serial killers late one night a few weeks a go and they are running together in my recollection. But it reinacted him hanging a young woman in his garage and then going inside to eat dinner before she was even dead.


#12    QuiteContrary

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 05:30 AM

View PostR4z3rsPar4d0x, on 04 July 2013 - 03:10 AM, said:

Was this in the United States or some other country?were the victims female or males?

Jerry Brudos. It was the late 60's. He had a wife and 2 kids.


#13    Antilles

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 06:17 AM

Made a good point about Bundy. He did talk about how the murders were carried out by 'he'. Bundy used he instead of I. Now, you could argue he did this because he couldn't accept the burden this placed on him because he was a serial killer so he described the murders having been carried out by someone else. He moves the killer into 3rd person so Bundy won't be responsible.

Or, like me, you could just accept that he was a repellent little creep who got his rocks off terrorising and murdering helpless girls who all reminded him of the girl who jilted him.

And before you mention it, yes, he was very attractive to women and very normal in his behaviour. Ann Rule never saw the monster lurking underneath his surface charm.

There are serial killers who are physically quite repulsive but on the whole they look and act like anyone else. Until the rage/blood lust/desire explodes inside them. Look at Dr Harold Shipman. Killed more people in England than probably anyone else. He didn't look like a circus freak.

A successful serial killer has to be able to hunt.


#14    third_eye

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 11:03 AM

In Ted's case I think it is best to separate the trial Ted and the serial killer Ted ... during the trial he was a totally different animal and he was very confident of beating the law in law's own backyard ... I also believe the media made more of his excuse on p0rn that it was ... he only went down that alley briefly during the end of his trial when it was apparent that the was going to get the death verdict ... while on death row and being interviewed by the FBI he was not so generous with crediting p0rn for his desire to kill ... in fact most of his victims weren't assaulted sexually ... they were sadistically assaulted sexually ... he was more interested in killing than sex so to speak.

~

Quote

' ... life and death carry on as they always have ~ and always will, only the dreamer is gone ~ behind the flow of imagination, beyond any effort to be still
dancing in the ebb and flow of attention, more present than the breath, I find the origins of my illusions, only the dreamer is gone ~ the dream never ends
'

GIFTS WITH NO GIVER - a love affair with truth ~ Poems by Nirmala

third_eye ' s cavern ~ bring own beer


#15    Antilles

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Posted 04 July 2013 - 12:50 PM

View Postthird_eye, on 04 July 2013 - 11:03 AM, said:

In Ted's case I think it is best to separate the trial Ted and the serial killer Ted ... during the trial he was a totally different animal and he was very confident of beating the law in law's own backyard ... I also believe the media made more of his excuse on p0rn that it was ... he only went down that alley briefly during the end of his trial when it was apparent that the was going to get the death verdict ... while on death row and being interviewed by the FBI he was not so generous with crediting p0rn for his desire to kill ... in fact most of his victims weren't assaulted sexually ... they were sadistically assaulted sexually ... he was more interested in killing than sex so to speak.

~

I think you're pretty well right except about the charm. He used that on everyone. That's how he escaped from prison in Colorado - he was allowed to use the law library. He opened a window and jumped to freedom. And more murder. Even the judge in Florida where Bundy acted as his own lawyer wished him luck.

I agree with you about the sex. He wasn't interested in that. The thrill for him was in the murder. Actually, it was probably more in the terror those girls went through when they finally recognised the monster that stood before them.

But he wouldn't have 'got' his victims without the charm. And fake leg plaster. But still, the charm.





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